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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#37301: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:06:52 PM

According to Toriyama, Vegeta watches infomercials. And that's how he knows about bargain sales.

I personally imagine that after Goku died, Vegeta was in a funk where he just started watching TV in the living room.

Like. I'm imagining Vegeta watching soap operas. He didn't start training until Bulma basically forced him because she was sick of having him around and just doing nothing.

He was spending too much time with Trunks. Being too nice. It was weird.

For the most part of those 7 years he trained just to keep her off his back.

Then he heard Goku was coming back for a day. And then Goku came back to life permanently.

edited 9th Apr '16 9:18:06 PM by unnoun

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37302: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:07:49 PM

Saiyans don't get bored of training, though. If they could, Vegeta and Goku would just keep training non stop.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#37303: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:11:20 PM

Technically, it's not training they don't get bored of, it's fighting they don't get bored of; do recall that training was a foreign concept to all of the Saiyans, since they just got stronger by essentially abusing their Zenkai ability. Goku was probably the first Saiyan ever to embrace the act of training in and of itself.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#37304: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:13:29 PM

Part of the humor in the party scenario would be that both of them clearly hate the party and Bulma's clearly debating with herself as she hobnobs with the swells whether to control Vegeta and at least maintain the illusion of respectability or just let him ruin everything while she points and laughs.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#37305: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:13:49 PM

They don't keep training non-stop, though.

Like, Goku seemingly didn't train much at all between Piccolo and Raditz.

Before the Cell games Goku specifically emphasized taking breaks instead of training constantly. Three days of rest, three days of training, three days of rest and also making a Goten.

Vegeta specifically says after Cell and Goku died that he would never train or fight again.

When he sacrifices himself against Buu he asks Piccolo whether he'll see Kakarot again and is told that, no, he's going to hell and ain't keeping his body.

His main goal of training after Frieza was his rivalry with Goku. With Goku dead. He doesn't have much of a reason anymore, and he says as much.

The only reason he'd keep training before he heard about Goku's day back would be that Bulma forced him to because she was sick of his moping.

edited 9th Apr '16 9:15:10 PM by unnoun

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37306: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:24:59 PM

They can't keep training nonstop.

And Goku emphasized taking breaks because it made the training better, not because he was sick of training.

He never is sick of training.

And just because they hadn't discovered it doesn't mean that the Saiyans as a whole wouldn't be enamored with training. I doubt that a day went by in Planet Vegeta in which the Saiyans weren't beating the tar out of each other just for fun. It's a form of training too. Also they didn't really have very long to do that before Freeza recruited them and kept sending them around, probably without really giving them time to train.

There's plenty of reasons to assume why Vegeta, Nappa and Raditz seem to not have trained.

But I just assume they did train, they just weren't as good at it as the main characters were and that's why they didn't get amazing results.

Also interesting to note: Vegeta does not say "I'll never train again", he says he won't fight. Which he doesn't, until Goku comes back. But he trained. Like he always does.

edited 9th Apr '16 9:35:09 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Demetrios Making darkness adorable since 1999 from Des Plaines, Illinois (unfortunately) Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Making darkness adorable since 1999
#37307: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:29:20 PM

The half hour for Dragon Ball Z Kai goes by too fast.

Come on! Let's bless them all until we get fershnickered!
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#37308: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:37:07 PM

So with the Monaka reveal does this also mean Beerus was lying to Goku when he told him that there was someone else who gave him a tougher fight?

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37309: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:39:38 PM

Of course there was someone who gave Beerus a tougher fight than Goku.

He's probably fought Whis, and might have fought Champa and Vados.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#37310: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:07:17 PM

There's still the "person" who steps up to fight Champa. Maybe Monaka's got a second form or something.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#37311: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:07:33 PM

You're not hitting a lot of home-runs with this Toriyama.

Or Toei. I don't know who I need to blame for that idea, but if I don't find out, everyone will feel my pain.

One Strip! One Strip!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#37312: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:09:08 PM

With Monaka being a fraud, I'm betting the person to step in against Champa will be Time Patrol Trunks.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#37314: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:47:54 PM

[up]Reminds me of that time Krillin imagined 4th Form Freeza as being an even more monstrous 3rd Form.

Hobgoblin Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#37315: Apr 10th 2016 at 4:57:02 AM

Gotenks was a pointless cameo. Shows up, defuses, and Frieza flips out.

Frieza flipping out was amusing, but I agree that Frieza should have tried to kill them on the spot and that Gotenks was wasted.

Why would they fuse beforehand and then fly for 30 minutes? They can sense how far away someone is and should know how long it would take to get there!

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#37316: Apr 10th 2016 at 5:05:22 AM

Taking 30 minutes to fly there is kinda weak, since they can lap the world multiple times in few seconds.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Hobgoblin Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#37317: Apr 10th 2016 at 5:10:47 AM

So....apparently Monaka is a complete amateur, only there to motivate Goku and Vegeta. Can't say I'm shocked really.

Likewise. Though, I did like the theory that Monaka was really weak, but is the only one that ever has beaten Beerus in Rock, Paper, Scissors.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37318: Apr 10th 2016 at 5:22:26 AM

[up][up]Indeed.

Gotenks should be able to be anywhere in the world in under ten seconds.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#37319: Apr 10th 2016 at 5:22:56 AM

@ Saiga: Interesting you blame Toriyama rather than Toei for Super's failings. Care to tell us why?

No, that's not right. The only thing I attributed to Toriyama was Monaka's reveal, because he wrote the plot to Universe 6 and I don't see something that effects the tournament to be an outside addition. It's also very in line from what we've seen from Toriyama lately.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#37320: Apr 10th 2016 at 5:26:37 AM

We also learn that Super Saiyan Blue drains Goku and Vegeta's stamina so fast that they decided to save it for the end so they could save as much energy as possible. his made them use SS 1 for most of the tournament.

Sounds exactly like Golden Freeza's weakness, and Super Saiyan 3 weakness, and Kaioken's weakness. At this point i'm pretty sure "losing stamina fast" is less a weakness and more a fact of life for higher levels of fighting.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37321: Apr 10th 2016 at 6:00:56 AM

Dood, you're saying it like 'losing stamina fast' is an arbitrary, nonsensical limitation, when it makes total sense that the stronger transformations would drain their energy faster. It always was a part of the transformations. SSJ drained energy, SSJ 2 drained it faster, SSJ 3 drained it fast enough to be almost unusable and SSJB probably drains it ever faster. The only exception was SSJG, and it had its own outside timer to circumvent that.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#37322: Apr 10th 2016 at 6:08:46 AM

But Goku and Vegeta were laughing at Golden Freeza for apparently having the same exact issue they did with Super Saiyan Blue the entire time, which implied to me at the time of watching Resurrection of Freeza that they had good control over the form and that it was an efficient transformation. If Stamina draining to this degree was always unavoidable then it's not really worth mentioning to the audience anymore, we get the point by now.

edited 10th Apr '16 6:10:24 AM by VeryMelon

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37323: Apr 10th 2016 at 6:15:46 AM

They can still laugh at Freeza for the problem, because they're clearly aware of it and thus aren't screwing around. Alternatively, this is a dumb retcon. Pick whichever you wish.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#37324: Apr 10th 2016 at 7:21:22 AM

It's a dumb retcon, super is a travesty. Fanon Discontinuity!

And I've explained this before, but here we go again. Exercise isn't about bringing out "hidden" power but about breaking your body down so that it will grow back stronger. This is why rest has benefits, if you just keep breaking down, breaking down breaking down, you don't have time for recovery.

Training is also about honing skills, increasing talent, improving reflexes, but that's still not hidden power, that's improving.

Something your body can already do but can't, either due to some mental block or biological necessity, that could be called hidden, sleeping whatever power. It's not potential in anything other than the sense it's not being used, but you already have it and no amount of exercise, drills or skill training is going to bring it out. You'd need mediation, therapy, drugs, or some biological trigger.

Gohan clearly had some kind of mental block. He already had enough power to match uncle Raditz but could not voluntarily use it. Training with Piccolo made him stronger, but he still had the issue. Guru made him stronger, but that didn't change the issue. Training with dad made him stronger but still didn't fix it. Elder Kai did fix the issue. He clearly did something different, independent of every prior power increase, and it wasn't just removing the transformation need.

Buldogue's lawyer
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#37325: Apr 10th 2016 at 9:23:53 AM

Wow, so even with the potential of having more characters fight it still ends up being Goku & Vegeta who pretty much do everything. Well, can't say I expected much else. At least Hit is pretty cool.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.

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