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Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#37201: Apr 8th 2016 at 7:05:32 AM

To be fair, he outlasted Piccolo at this point.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#37202: Apr 8th 2016 at 7:07:41 AM

As noted, he gets killed every other arc.

  • Died in Piccolo arc.
  • Did not die in Saiyan arc.
  • Died on Namek.
  • Did not die against Androids.
  • Died from Buu.
  • Did not die in Battle of Gods.

He also didn't die in ROF but since the manga refused to even bother adapting that one, it exists in a weird state of being quasi-filler. It's a filler arc based on a movie that was originally supposed to be in-continuity, and the Broad Strokes of the events that happened within it are considered to have happened in both continuities even though the manga didn't address it, so...it's weird, basically.

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randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#37203: Apr 8th 2016 at 7:13:23 AM

It's just a pattern.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Hobgoblin Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#37205: Apr 8th 2016 at 7:31:21 AM

Since Krillin didn't die in the RF Saga, that means 1 of 2 things:

  • Krillin's curse has been lifted.
  • Krillin is gonna perma-die.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#37206: Apr 8th 2016 at 8:00:07 AM

[up][up]In the Super 17 Saga, which was 2 sagas later...

It has to be intentional.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37207: Apr 8th 2016 at 2:58:11 PM

Krillin will secretly become the Super Human God Super Human and one-shot Vados.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#37208: Apr 8th 2016 at 5:36:43 PM

Big Green Paragus is fantastic.
Too bad such great voice work was wasted on a non combatant role in a combat series.

Buldogue's lawyer
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#37209: Apr 9th 2016 at 12:02:53 AM

Piccolo - 23rd is officially and sanely two arcs and the series did not start there. I think Kuririn fans need to be kept down as much as the next guy but don't force the pattern.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#37210: Apr 9th 2016 at 12:09:44 AM

Since he was introduced...since he first died, after that.

For it to be a true pattern GT was necessary addition because it's the 3rd time in a row, and in that case I guess I could have been forcing it?

edited 9th Apr '16 12:10:37 AM by randomness4

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#37211: Apr 9th 2016 at 12:17:41 AM

He was introduced two atcs before his death, stayed alived for two arcs after his death, then had a death-survive-death pattern in the last three arcs of the story.

Whether GT has three or four arcs also depends on if that even counts otherwise it is survive-survive-death-survive (officially the Black Star arc leads into the Baby arc but is separate).

The movies break this, the Super anime breaks this, the Super manga shows no signs of killing him in its second arc.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#37212: Apr 9th 2016 at 8:39:15 AM

Dragon Ball Super, Episode 22!

  • Off to a good start. Tagoma No Sells Piccolo punching him in the face but is blasted aside easily enough by Gohan, clearly establishing that Gohan is still far beyond Piccolo. Gotenks, likewise, does some damage to Tagoma through Groin Attack. Tagoma himself makes a good point, emphasizing his endurance: having spent the last four months as Frieza's punching bag, his strongest attribute is his ability to take a hit.
  • Gotenks was a pointless cameo. Shows up, defuses, and Frieza flips out. This doesn't feel right. Not only is it a waste of Gotenks but it's detrimental to Frieza as well. The Frieza I know would have Death Beamed them into oblivion when he realized who they were. No, show, they don't get to just scramble away. They're dead now. You killed them.
  • Speaking of whom, keeping Gotenks out of this was about as bullshit as keeping Android 18 out. Folks are talking about how it's too dangerous, but nobody said that shit to Kame-senning or Tien. Gotenks is the second-most powerful person on this side of the field. THE most powerful if Gohan's power has decayed below them. Even separated, they have a better shot than the humans do. This arc is very confused about the relative strengths of its characters.
  • And now Ginyu's back and stealing Tagoma's body. Goddammit, Captain Ginyu, go die in a fire. I was really starting to like Tagoma, I do not want to see him get sidelined for a relic Toei keeps trotting out long past his expiration date. How is he even alive? He should be dead, like, at least twice over.
  • GINYU: "Frieza, will you listen to my tale?" Frieza, I am begging you, do not listen to his tale. I will pay you to not listen to his tale. I do not want to burn, like, five to ten minutes on pointless recap from a character who should not still exist.
  • Sigh. Pointless recap, it is. Complete with flashbacks. Goddammit, Toei. Like, I realize this is happening because people who start watching the series at Super would need some explanation of who Ginyu is and why they should care, but the answers to that should be, "An asshole who got turned into a frog a long time ago and was never relevant again," and "Beyond the Frieza Saga, you shouldn't, really."
  • JACO: "He's drawing out the full power of Tagoma's body. Ginyu is a creature capable of doing that." The hell he is. Have you even seen the Namek arc, Jaco? After stealing Goku's body, Ginyu could barely draw out even 1/4 of his power. This is just pure and utter character shilling.
  • Bulma attempts to draw Whis's attention with an ice cream sundae that she made a couple episodes ago, which has been sitting in her ship under some tools. That sundae has remained frozen outside of a cooler for what must be hours in-universe. I shudder to ask what it's made of.
  • Goku and Vegeta are in some kind of pocket dimension training. It wouldn't be Dragon Ball if we weren't waiting for Goku to arrive and save the day, after all. And what's more Dragon Ball than Dragon Ball? Double waiting. We have to wait for Goku to finish his training so that we can wait for Goku to get to Earth!
  • Vegeta masters the training first because sure, why not. He stops moving, quits making noises, closes his eyes, and my exact thoughts were, "Either Vegeta just died or something stupid is about to happen." Fortunately, my suspicion that he would be the first to discover Super Saiyan Blue did not come to pass...yet.
  • Ginyu beats up Gohan in base and I'm left wondering why he didn't just start as a Super Saiyan. You know, they do that all the time in the manga and non-filler Z bits. They start fights transformed. It's only the movies and shit where they get their ass kicked in base for twenty minutes and then suddenly remember the transformation. Toei thinks it builds suspense to have a character who is obviously not using 100% of his power be completely stymied by his foe. It doesn't. I might be charitable and assume Gohan can't transform as a consequence of his Ultimate power-up, but he pointed out that he can in a previous episode, so no dice.
  • GINYU: "Don't tell me you had this power all along. In that case, you should have used it from the beginning." That's what I said! And you don't get to say that. Pointing out that the padding was stupid and pointless doesn't make it less stupid and pointless.
  • Frieza blasts Death Beams through Gohan from his pod, and it doesn't feel right that Frieza's first form should be able to humble Gohan like this. I could buy Final Form, sure, but not First. It implies a far bigger gap between Buu Saga powers and Battle of Gods powers than I'm comfortable with.
  • Final scene, Piccolo takes a bullet for Gohan and it was a beautiful and dramatic Tear Jerker. When it happened in the Saiyan Saga. Right now, it feels like rehash.

<.< I didn't like this episode very much.

EDIT: Wait, if Gohan isn't Ultimate anymore, why is he stronger than Piccolo in base? I take back my compliments about understanding the relative strength of the two. Dende's sake, this was a bad episode.

edited 9th Apr '16 8:43:14 AM by TobiasDrake

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Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#37213: Apr 9th 2016 at 9:55:04 AM

Speaking of Ginyu... I wonder if that body-change ability was a biological trait of his species, like Zenkais, or if it was a magical ability.

I mean, all he had to do was have Tagoma say 'Change' for his ability to take effect. I don't remember how Ginyu managed to make Bulma say the word, but still, it seems magical.

In which case, maybe the entire Ginyu Force could've learned it. But then, we don't even know if Ginyu's body is his original body, if he's tested this ability before, he's sure to have made some upgrades.

edited 9th Apr '16 10:14:24 AM by Soble

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Reservoir A former adventurer... from Eastern US Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
A former adventurer...
#37214: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:07:25 AM

I doubt that the body Ginyu was using in the Frieza arc was his original body, given that he trends towards stealing the nearest body that seems more useful to him.

Honestly, I've always wondered if Ginyu wasn't some sort of magical witch or something in his/her "first" body. Having been born a woman would be a stereoypical explanation for his more 'flamboyant' approach to things despite having a male body when he was introduced.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#37215: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:26:50 AM

So you're saying Ginyu's a Buff Baba?

Reservoir A former adventurer... from Eastern US Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
A former adventurer...
#37216: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:47:39 AM

I'm saying it's a possibility, though I figure the truth's further from my fanon idea than, say, "Toriyama didn't think about it that hard, didn't really think about it at all, or though a flamboyant alien muscleman would be funny." If nothing else, it's just very likely he Body Change'd his way to a strong enough body to become an asset for Frieza.

edited 9th Apr '16 10:47:52 AM by Reservoir

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#37217: Apr 9th 2016 at 10:51:42 AM

Someone created a timeline that shows where all the Toei films before Battle of Gods take place

While I like the effort put into this by one person, there are still problems:

  • The biggest one is the Dead Zone film skipping the Saiyan and Namek Sagas, then lines back up with the Garlic Jr saga which somehow still happens in the main timeline.

  • The movie 2-4 side timeline lining back up with Frieza makes no sense either. May as well stop that timeline after Lord Slug, as the chart doesn't refrain from forcing other arbitrary stops (such as Cooler's Return, no reason for that to be an ending point).

  • My only major complaint left is Bojack's placement. Bojack's movie seems to be a different timeline altogether since Goku died in that film and the timeline it's in depends on Vegeta killing Semi-Perfect Cell.

edited 9th Apr '16 10:58:12 AM by VeryMelon

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#37218: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:15:43 AM

What, so Ginyu can't be a flamboyant guy just because he is flamboyant? That's actually kinda homophobic.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#37219: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:19:53 AM

All of the Ginyus were flamboyant. I fail to understand why Ginyu needs more of an explanation like being born a woman(?) when it was shown to a part of all of their personalities.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37220: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:20:16 AM

Speaking of Ginyu... I wonder if that body-change ability was a biological trait of his species, like Zenkais, or if it was a magical ability.

I mean, all he had to do was have Tagoma say 'Change' for his ability to take effect. I don't remember how Ginyu managed to make Bulma say the word, but still, it seems magical.

In which case, maybe the entire Ginyu Force could've learned it. But then, we don't even know if Ginyu's body is his original body, if he's tested this ability before, he's sure to have made some upgrades.

In the Namek filler, Ginyu didn't. Bulma put a translator on him so she could understand him, allowing him to say it. He has never previously demonstrated the ability to have his target say the word for him in either the manga or the anime.

Regarding him Body Changing in the past, I would honestly be very surprised if he hasn't. Jeice seemed familiar enough with the ability to accept that Ginyu was now in Goku's body without question. I'm sure it is no coincidence that the second-most powerful warrior in the universe and the guy who can snatch bodies from other people just happen to be the same guy.

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SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#37221: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:25:38 AM

So does that mean that Ginyu's "current" body was more powerful than it was before he stole it?

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Reservoir A former adventurer... from Eastern US Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
A former adventurer...
#37222: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:28:10 AM

In regards to [up][up] and [up][up][up], I was just saying it was a possibility, though I'll own up to the lapse in my logic of "flamboyant = possibly born a woman". Ginyu's gender is of no consequence, much like whether or not the Body Change technique is magic or not. I just like to speculate, even if it sometimes leads down stupid, odd paths.

As far as his current body goes, I assume he has to take time to learn how to manage the current body before it's full power is realized. The purple body he's in when he's introduced is likely at it's current max, since he's probably been in it long enough to have mastered it. But it's clear when he switches with Goku that he has nowhere near that amount of control with his body, meaning he probably has to adjust to it before it's potential is reached.

edited 9th Apr '16 11:32:20 AM by Reservoir

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#37223: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:31:30 AM

Wasn't it said somewhere that one member of the Ginyu Force knows what Ginyu's real body looks like?

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#37224: Apr 9th 2016 at 11:50:13 AM

If Ginyu regularly needed to take the time to get accustomed to a body, he would be aware of it. He was utterly flummoxed by his inability to use Goku's body effectively.

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Reservoir A former adventurer... from Eastern US Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
A former adventurer...
#37225: Apr 9th 2016 at 12:17:33 PM

True, but then that wouldn't have happened if he didn't need that time. If you think about it, though, Goku had learned how to use the Kaio-ken in such short bursts, it wasn't even readily apparent he was using the technique. So, perhaps Ginyu not knowing the technique limited his ability to put Goku's body to its full potential? I mean, the energy for the Kaio-ken has to come from somewhere, so maybe the technique itself is a temporary "potential unlock"?


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