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BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#30051: Nov 30th 2015 at 8:26:55 PM

Yeah, that's really bs.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#30052: Nov 30th 2015 at 8:39:43 PM

I think that's a reasonable thing to be upset by, considering Gohan could just be retired from the series after the Buu Saga instead of getting dragged through the mud in the new material.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#30053: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:00:35 PM

My favorite thing about the future Androids is this bit of narrative from the History of Trunks special.

"Piccolo was the first to try and the first to die. Vegeta was next to fall. Then Yamcha. Then Tien. Even KRILLIN was no match for these ruthless androids!"

Ignoring the part where Vegeta had to settle for Piccolo's sloppy seconds, the narrator just seems so shocked and astonished that Krillin couldn't handle the foes that had bested Piccolo and Vegeta. The animation even shows the twins teaming up to take down Krillin after killing the others individually.

edited 30th Nov '15 9:01:57 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#30054: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:05:41 PM

I'm still not completely over how badass Tagoma was and will be.

DoctorDiabolical So pure. Since: Mar, 2010
So pure.
#30055: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:09:31 PM

[up][up] That got me intrigued enough to watch that bit, even though I've never seen History of Trunks. You got the line a little wrong, and it's not quite as funny, but still:

"Even Krillin was destroyed by the ruthless duo!"

I don't know, put that way it kind of seems like the narrator was saying Krillin wasn't even worth going after, but they did anyhow because they're bastards xD

edited 30th Nov '15 9:09:55 PM by DoctorDiabolical

Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#30056: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:45:15 PM

[up]Krillin too strong! [lol]

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#30057: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:46:57 PM

Now that you mention it, the emphasis on Krillin is funny.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#30058: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:51:26 PM

Maybe Krillin got him some Determination and became Krillin the Undying, and his power level got really high but not high enough for the Androids?

edited 30th Nov '15 9:51:49 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#30059: Nov 30th 2015 at 9:54:10 PM

Its cuz 18 didn't mack on him.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#30060: Nov 30th 2015 at 11:08:39 PM

Did you know youtube has an auto play feature now? I was watching a video about Adam Cole, fell asleep and was woken up by this thing.

Weird.

Now it's just doing Dragon Ball

edited 30th Nov '15 11:34:01 PM by IndirectActiveTransport

Buldogue's lawyer
BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#30061: Dec 1st 2015 at 3:39:57 AM

Vegeta's not exactly wrong there. Fat Buu and Super Buu mostly cared about fighting for their own entertainment, just like a Saiyan. I mean, the Human Extinction Attack was primarily because he was sick of waiting for Gotenks and saw right through Piccolo's ploy to buy time.

edited 1st Dec '15 3:40:22 AM by BaffleBlend

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#30062: Dec 1st 2015 at 5:52:30 AM

I think I've figured out why Gohan being useless has been bugging me so much. It's not just because I like his character. It's because the plot is actively punishing him for following his dreams.

He wanted to be a scholar, and he didn't necessarily want to train. And the plot is saying that's a bad thing. He's not allowed to do what he wants, because then he's a nerd! And he'll get weaker! And that's a bad thing, because he doesn't get to do anything cool in the plot!

What kind of message is that? 'If you don't want to fight, that's stupid and you're stupid for thinking that'?

That's not really a fair assessment. Gohan really brought it upon himself. He stopped training, fair enough, but that doesn't mean the battles are going to get any easier to accommodate that. Their opponents just keep getting stronger.

So sure, abandoning martial arts to pursue a different path is all right, but crying foul when he shows up to a battle anyway and gets his ass kicked is kind of unfair on the writers, when they are just showing the obvious consequences of his decision.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#30063: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:07:20 AM

Well, Gohan is a long-standing character so they can't exactly drop him from the main roster, but they're clearly not interested in doing anything with him either sooooo he's just kinda stuck in limbo.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#30064: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:10:42 AM

Well, they are doing something with him - he's a pretty dynamic character- just not necessarily what his fans would like them to.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#30065: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:11:27 AM

[up][up]

Pretty much.

At least they can just dump the older characters, except for group shots and get-togethers (barring Tien and Roshi showing up for the Frieza battle).

[up]That's true. No one has changed quite as much as Gohan I think, except maybe Krillin, which has kinda been lampshaded.

edited 1st Dec '15 6:14:00 AM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#30066: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:11:37 AM

[up](x3)

See, that's the song, that orchestral tune. I hate it, the Japanese version uses it a lot. It sounds great for the Red Ribbon army, if they used that for them, the Androids, I'd accept it. Buu, Cell, no thank you.

edited 1st Dec '15 6:13:59 AM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#30067: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:13:18 AM

-n/a-

edited 1st Dec '15 6:13:33 AM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#30068: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:14:01 AM

Yeah, you can't have it both ways: you can't go on about how you Gohan is so much of a better person that Goku and the likes for not wanting to fight, and then complain when he becomes a worse fighter and starts doing more poorly as a consequence of those actions.

Maybe they are going out of their way to make him look worse than he should, I haven't actually be watching Super, but the general idea really does makes sense.

edited 1st Dec '15 6:23:26 AM by LSBK

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#30069: Dec 1st 2015 at 6:18:43 AM

[up]x5: I dunno, has he really done much of anything in Super? Aside from getting smacked around?

Yea, I haven't been keeping up.

edited 1st Dec '15 6:20:04 AM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#30070: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:13:49 AM

Vegeta's not exactly wrong there. Fat Buu and Super Buu mostly cared about fighting for their own entertainment, just like a Saiyan. I mean, the Human Extinction Attack was primarily because he was sick of waiting for Gotenks and saw right through Piccolo's ploy to buy time.
Oh wait, someone kind of agrees with me.

Personally, if I were the director I would have kept Vegeta on screen for the entirety of this part.

...had no feelings or conscience, he was designed as an instrument of fear and terror. His single desire was to eliminate all living things, and he was very good at it.
Though I guess that would be too much foreshadowing to the fact Vegeta would sell his soul.

edited 1st Dec '15 8:14:27 AM by IndirectActiveTransport

Buldogue's lawyer
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#30071: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:16:48 AM

[up][up]If you compare current Gohan to the one who showed up to fight Super Buu you notice a slight change. Maybe not one all would approve off, but it's hard to argue he didn't change.

[up]And nowadays Buu just wants to eat and sleep.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#30072: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:19:10 AM

All that's happened to Gohan is getting taken out by Beerus, which happened to everyone, and getting shot through by Tagoma, which was necessary to establish Tagoma as a serious threat to everyone involved and was a cheap shot anyways. You all are overreacting.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#30073: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:30:05 AM

[up]

I see your point, but there's also Goku flat out rejecting including Gohan in the Tournament because he's a nerd now. I think that on their own, these things would mean nothing, but combined with other things that have happened to him, and Toriyama's losing interest in doing anything fighting related with Gohan, it's coming off as frustrating to fans.

I do admit, seeing him as a father, and a scholar is interesting, and different, and maybe some people (myself included, even if I didn't realize it) want it both ways.

Again, we're not asking for Gohan to take up the main character slot again (cause that's not happening), we're just asking that he be allowed to have some good moments since he's been around for so long and all.

One Strip! One Strip!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#30074: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:34:35 AM

I think Goku's point was that Gohan wouldn't be interested.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#30075: Dec 1st 2015 at 8:35:23 AM

Remember all those little moments of Gohan buying books and speaking at conventions? I'm like 100% sure that those are building up to Gohan's book from Online that teaches the average Joe how to fly and shoot Ki blasts. Yeah, he's a nerd now but he's always been a nerd, and his life outside of fighting is just more important to him nowadays than his life in fighting.


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