Inspired by this thread, I've noticed that this wiki doesn't have a dedicated cleanup thread for negativity.
As we all know, Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, Creator Bashing and other negativity isn't desired on the wiki, except in a few selected areas like reviews and several Darth Wiki pages (and even then, with limitations). And yet, it's one of the most common sins wiki contributors can make.
So, if you find a page, TLP or discussion whose content seems like a straight-up insult or any other bitching - including complainy soapboxing -, you might ask here for help with removing said content.
The sandbox for this project is located at Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining.
Edited by MacronNotes on Apr 27th 2022 at 5:36:47 AM
I dont think your allowed to remove an example just because you personally dislike it on a ymmv page. Its called ymmv for a reason. People are allowed to have different opnions than you and you haven't really pointed out why any of these are inaccurate.
I also have to ask. If a work is hugely disliked. Is their any reason, we need to patrol a ymmv page and wipe out any negative opnions even if their accurate. Its fine to remove misuses and keep it of the main pages but the ymmv pages seem like an overreach. That's not fair to anyone who reads a work's ymmv page as it does not give them the accurate picture either.
Edited by miraculous on Feb 25th 2019 at 10:23:00 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."There's still a lot of complaining on Anime.Romance Of The Three Kingdoms, which I brought up earlier but was ignored. Also, the page quote, caption, and stinger on Miracle Star are all from the episode of The Amazing World of Gumball mocking it.
Keet cleanupThe Romance of the Three Kingdoms page looks like someone's trying to write a review in the main page. Could definitely use a more neutral revision.
Most of the entries look zero-context, too.
Edited by bookworm11 on Feb 25th 2019 at 4:01:15 AM
I'd at least ditch the image caption on Miracle Star. The caption makes no sense unless you've seen that episode of The Amazing World of Gumball, which I haven't.
~miraculous, there's a fine line to tread between critical opinion and Complaining About Shows You Don't Like. This thread is devoted to resolving the latter.
You're welcome to contribute to this thread if you feel that something is being unjustly cast as said complaining, but the thread's essential purpose is valid.
Edited by nombretomado on Feb 25th 2019 at 5:59:07 AM
Oh no I wasn't saying stop with removing misuse or shoehorns that's definitely not what I was saying. I was just asking if any of these are actually genunily inaccurate or being forced and shoehorned. I'd lose the Internet Backdraft section though barring citatations due to being an eyesore though.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Does anyone else feel like some of the Frozen Headscratchers go into complaining territory? Not all, but a few come across more like "Why did this character do this thing when it's so obviously stupid and wrong?" than actual confusion. (Like the ones about Anna telling Elsa about the Endless Winter, Elsa cutting off trade with Weselton, and a couple about the trolls.)
From Assassin's Creed: Odyssey
With Ubisoft confirming that Kassandra is the canon character of this game through its novel adaptation, some are wondering what the point was of having the choice between her and Alexios for the game and not either having her be the only character in the game, or having them be in a parallel story like the characters from Syndicate.
It doesn't feel like a backdraft to me. Just sounds like a bunch of headscratching at worst.
Where there's life, there's hope.Found this on Designated Villain:
- Karen Traviss seems determined to do this to Dr. Catherine Halsey in her Halo novels Glasslands, The Thursday War, and Mortal Dictata (prequels to Halo 4), putting the blame for the SPARTAN-II program's shadier aspects (primarily the kidnapping of six year old children) squarely on Halsey's shoulders. Almost everyone suddenly starts seeing Halsey as a monster who shouldn't be allowed to live. The specific act that earns the hate is the flash-cloning of the kidnapped children in order to convince the parents that the kids aren't really missing. The clones fall ill, with most dying a few months later. The head of ONI, Admiral Margaret Parangosky, personally blames Halsey for this. The kicker is, nothing happens in ONI without Parangosky's say-so, so there's no way she could not have known about the flash-cloning beforehand, especially since it hardly could have been accomplished by Halsey alone (indeed, previous sources implied that the flash-cloning was done with ONI's full approval). Nobody seems to consider that making parents think their kids are dead may be more merciful than living with the constant fear that their child was kidnapped (and additionally, Traviss even conveniently forgets that the flash-cloning was done precisely to stop people from asking further questions). Another argument is that the SPARTAN-II program was started many years before the war with the Covenant, so there's no justification for it. However, the Insurrectionists who plagued UNSC for years did so using terrorist tactics far beyond anything we've seen so far in real life, like using suicide bombers armed with nukes (the Insurrectionist nuking of the Haven arcology, mentioned in Halsey's own journal, killed two million civilians and injured 8.3 million more). While Halsey's actions may be seen as deplorable, there were reasons why she took them, and it's fairly clear that the moral culpability rests on ONI as a whole (which, to its credit, Mortal Dictata does touch a tiny bit on). Worse, the author shows no sympathy for Halsey, even when it's revealed that she cries herself to sleep every night with the name of her dead daughter (Miranda Keyes) on her lips.
I'm not familiar enough with the work to comment on this, and obviously Designated Villain is a mostly negative Audience Reaction so some negativity is inevitable, but I want to draw attention to the first sentence, which reads like it's specifically attacking the book's author.
(The example also a nigh-impenetrable Wall of Text, but that's not what this cleanup thread is about).
I've seen Karen Traviss being described unfavourably on other pages unrelated to the Halo novels, so this is almost certainly a case of Creator Bashing.
You can find me here now.Honestly, a lot of Traviss' work should probably get checked. I'm mostly familiar with her Star Wars Legends work, but she seems to have a pretty large hatedom and whether her work is good or not is a very divisive issue among fans. From what I've seen, similar is true for some of the other franchises she writes for as well.
I can try to get started on the star wars end of that, but I'm in the middle of another large project on the wiki atm, which has gotten sidetracked by real life, so I'm not sure when I could actually get going.
Edit: Ninja'd
Edited by Ashfire on Mar 1st 2019 at 4:13:52 AM
I didn't look at it originally because I didn't know she was so controversial, but Karen Traviss' own page was almost certainly written by one of her haters.
Reading that creator page... oof.
I'm actually fairly neutral on her myself- I enjoy her willingness to explore areas and perspectives on the star wars cannon that other writers haven't really gotten into, but I find she does occasionally suffer from Writer on Board and might have a bit of an ego (although I'm never clear if the one incident everyone likes to cite was supposed to be a joke that got taken out of context or not... creator drama is something I tend to stay away from)
But that page makes it sound like she's universally hated, when, at least in the experiences I've had, its a very divided issue, approaching Broken Base levels.
YMMV.Mobile Suit Gundam SEED Destiny
- Americans Hate Tingle: A number of American Gundam fans (the UC fans in particular) really, really loathe this series, declaring SEED Destiny to be the worst Gundam series ever made prior to AGE. Why? Because of Kira's Hostile Show Takeover.
- Kira was a Base-Breaking Character in the original SEED, but by Destiny the West had given up on him and he's lost almost all his defenders. And there's what he did to Stella in Episode 32.
- His popularity took a nosedive in late 2018, when a Japanese poll on the top most hated characters in the Gundam franchise was conducted and Kira was on the Number 1 spot. The reason specified? He "stole" Flay from his friend Sai of all reasons back in SEED instead of the usual detracting points about him.
- Like SEED, Lacus is unpopular in the west even though she's one of the most popular characters in Japan.
- The reaction in Japan wasn't quite as strong, but even so, the show seems to have as many vocal detractors as fans in Japan. For reference. A lot of this can be attributed to Shinn's demotion, since characters of his type tend to be better received in Japan than in the West.
- Kira was a Base-Breaking Character in the original SEED, but by Destiny the West had given up on him and he's lost almost all his defenders. And there's what he did to Stella in Episode 32.
The first bullet needs to explain that it's popular in Japan, Can the bottom bullet count since it explains it's merely controversial there?
Kira, I'm cutting "And there's what he did to Stella in Episode 32." since it was justified in context and something he regretted despite being necessary, unless it explains why he's Unintentionally Unsympathetic. The entry stands without that point.
I'm also removing the poll since 1. being hated in Japan is not this, 2. it only applies to the previous series, why was it not a problem there, or even when Destiny was most hated over 10 years ago? 3. the pole reeks of Hate Dumb (it's was a minor part of his character and story, ignores that FLAY manipulated him into it, and the rest of the hated are hated as villains suggesting it doesn't distinguish hate as popularity, I'm not even sure those who voted stated why they hate him and if the video's reasoning is inference). I removed Kira's The Scrappy entry per Scrappy Cleanup thread since we can't tell if this one pole is indicative of the whole fandom.
The same could be said for YMMV.Gundam Build Divers, too.
The caption and especially quote on Daikatana are very negative.
Keet cleanupI agree. I also think keeping the Stephen Hawking joke is in poor taste now that he's dead
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 2nd 2019 at 12:47:04 PM
Currently sick, so less active. If a Trope Repair Shop thread needs attention, holler or ask an engineer.Stephen Hawking died???
Jawbreakers on sale for 99ยขYeah, he's been dead for almost a year now.
Cut the quote and replaced the image caption with the game's infamous tagline.
Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!WesternAnimation.The Christmas Tree has a caption referring to the work's quality, not the work itself.
I'm also rewriting Laconic.The Christmas Tree to remove this:
"An extremely bad Christmas special filled with terrible voice actors, horrendous animation, and tons of Narm."
Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!I think the Laconic can just be added to the Cut List. Someone wanting to do it properly can start from scratch if that's done.
Currently sick, so less active. If a Trope Repair Shop thread needs attention, holler or ask an engineer.I already took care of replacing the laconic.
Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!
Heroes in Crisis is earning a lot of controversy, perhaps intentionally, but the YMMV page is full of complaints and negative comments about the story. Observe...
I would like to remind everyone here that 1) TV Tropes is not meant to replicate the reading experience and 2) TV Tropes is not the place to express negativity towards a work of art, outside from reviews. I understand not everyone is happy with this story arc but there has to be a limit on how much negativity a website like ours can allow before it becomes a vehicle for hatred.