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Removing complaining, bashing and other negativity from the wiki

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Inspired by this thread, I've noticed that this wiki doesn't have a dedicated cleanup thread for negativity.

As we all know, Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, Creator Bashing and other negativity isn't desired on the wiki, except in a few selected areas like reviews and several Darth Wiki pages (and even then, with limitations). And yet, it's one of the most common sins wiki contributors can make.

So, if you find a page, TLP or discussion whose content seems like a straight-up insult or any other bitching - including complainy soapboxing -, you might ask here for help with removing said content.

The sandbox for this project is located at Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining.

Edited by MacronNotes on Apr 27th 2022 at 5:36:47 AM

badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
#10076: Aug 25th 2022 at 8:15:15 AM

Found this in Sequelitis:

  • 101 Dalmatian Street was supposed to be a sequel to the Disney's 1961 film 101 Dalmatians; however, due to lack of advertising and promotion. No one was unaware of the series exisit. Also lack of character development, terrible writing, and Dolly being consider a terrible character. This series became underrated and a disgrace to the legacy. Irony the Cruella saved the Franchise and it's legacy and thus according to Word of God, the 101 Dalmatian Street immeditely became Canon Discontinuity.

I've generally heard the exact opposite about these two works (that Dalmatian Street is a hidden gem and Cruella is just bad), but regardless, there's no real explanation here as to why the series is inferior beyond "it's bad," which is Circular Reasoning by itself.

Edit: Nuked

Edited by badtothebaritone on Aug 25th 2022 at 10:33:18 AM

ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#10077: Aug 25th 2022 at 8:21:07 AM

[up]That's also just really hard to parse due to grammar. At the least it can go for being a ZCE.

My musician page
fragglelover Since: Jun, 2012
#10078: Aug 25th 2022 at 8:26:00 AM

[up][up] I brought this up on ATT the other day. The troper who added it made the same claim on the page for the show and the Canon Discontinuity page.

themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
#10080: Aug 25th 2022 at 8:35:40 AM

"Cruella saved the franchise"

Source: dude trust me

I'd like to see an actual source for that

fragglelover Since: Jun, 2012
#10081: Aug 25th 2022 at 9:47:05 AM

Seconding that part about wanting a source for this.

I guess the logic here is "101 Dalmatian Street only had one season, with the supposed second season being cancelled. Cruella is getting a sequel. Therefore, Cruella is better."

But I'm not sure if it's that, or just that the troper in question prefers Cruella to Dalmatian Street.

badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
#10082: Aug 25th 2022 at 9:51:31 AM

I think the question is if it's both or not, since the second seems to be a given.

FirstAidRules He/Him from House (Experienced Trainee) Relationship Status: Singularity
He/Him
#10084: Aug 25th 2022 at 1:30:47 PM

Is it possible to remove the [["TFWiki.net Bringing you pain for far too long"]] caption from the Transformers: Energon page? I mean, while people don't like it, most of the fans have moved on and even the TF Wiki has cut down heavily on the criticism because as an edit from 2017 points out, hardly anyone cares even more particularly because there are newer Transformers cartoons to hate on (e.g. Combiner Wars)

Hi!
Twiddler (On A Trope Odyssey)
#10085: Aug 25th 2022 at 2:30:46 PM

[up] I don't see any such caption. Did you mean to link a different page?

Reymma RJ Savoy from Edinburgh Since: Feb, 2015 Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
RJ Savoy
#10086: Aug 25th 2022 at 3:01:20 PM

Not sure where to put this, but this is under Common Knowledge in YMMV.The Flash:

  • A more egregious case is just how fast the Flash can be, and the assumption this makes them a Boring Invincible Hero and/or that the writers rely on the Idiot Ball to avoid it. Because a few of the Flash's, mostly Wally West's, biggest feats are known of among casual fans, it's often assumed that they should be able to handle any threat; after all if they can cross the distance of space to return to earth fast enough to outrun instantaneous teleportation, then they shouldn't have trouble fighting Captain Cold. What's missed here is that they don't not have trouble with the aforementioned feats, and pretty much all of their Awesome moments came at a great deal of duress and effort on the Flash's part, in fact in many cases they performed these feats while just barely avoiding being sucked into the Speed Force itself (meaning they were actively pushing themselves beyond their limits), something that they can't possibly do for every fight. This would be like expecting someone to be giving 110% of their effort 24/7.

The entry as a whole feels rather too defensive, even if it may be valid. (Also "they don't not have" is awful grammar.)

Stories don't tell us monsters exist; we knew that already. They show us that monsters can be trademarked and milked for years.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#10087: Aug 25th 2022 at 3:02:19 PM

I've never heard anyone say The Flash is "invincible", super speed is a neat power but that's usually a criticism you hear leveled at characters like Super Man. So I don't even know where this is coming from.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 25th 2022 at 6:02:35 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#10088: Aug 25th 2022 at 3:19:33 PM

Woah who added that?

I can't tell what its saying? They need a grammar notifier?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
#10089: Aug 25th 2022 at 3:31:20 PM

[up](x3) I don't always pay enough attention to communities though I can't confirm if that's true or not. However, that entry at least needs a rewrite imo.

Reymma RJ Savoy from Edinburgh Since: Feb, 2015 Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
RJ Savoy
#10090: Aug 25th 2022 at 3:37:56 PM

[up][up] It was added quite recently, and I've been looking through that editor's history. This edit strikes me as being essentially correct, but far too long and with chained potholes at the end.

Stories don't tell us monsters exist; we knew that already. They show us that monsters can be trademarked and milked for years.
FirstAidRules He/Him from House (Experienced Trainee) Relationship Status: Singularity
He/Him
#10091: Aug 25th 2022 at 4:50:48 PM

Well, I checked and the caption for Transformers: Energon was removed in November of last year for violating the How to Create a Works Page. Good to know.

Hi!
UFOYeah Since: Mar, 2022
#10092: Aug 26th 2022 at 12:16:58 AM

I recently received a notifier for the following edit. Do you think it has too much complaining, or is too negative? I know it's based on a common reaction people have had, based on the footage people have seen and various videos and comments, which is why I added it, but still. Here goes, from Sonic Frontiers:

  • It's the Same, So It Sucks: While the inclusion of Green Hill (yet again) was seen as disappointing, the reveal that both Chemical Plant and Sky Sanctuary (two levels from Sonic Generations) would be appearing didn't help matters. Then came the reveal that said game's exact same level designs were being ported over for these levels (as well as the design of tutorial stage matching Windmill Isle's first level from Sonic Unleashed one-for-one), and people weren't happy, to say the least.

Edited by UFOYeah on Aug 26th 2022 at 12:18:07 PM

RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
#10093: Aug 26th 2022 at 9:04:38 AM

[up]I could be wrong, though I think that was at least partly because of the "(yet again)". I also would rephrase that. It otherwise sounds fine imo.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#10094: Aug 26th 2022 at 9:15:47 AM

I've removed this from DrinkingGame.RWBY, which was added with the edit reason "Fuck Ozpin and cosmic fuck the God of Light."

  • Down an entire bottle due to how incredible naive Ozpin was to become the God of Light's puppet for petty revenge against the God of Darkness when Darkness showed more humility of understanding Salem's story.

I've sent a complaining notification, but I wanted a second opinion on whether I should send a rudeness notifier as well.


The second one's legitimacy depends on if this was a common opinion, or just that of the troper who added it. Were the videos poorly-received?

Regarding the Hbomberguy RWBY entry, RWBY has extremely active fandoms, hatedoms, hate-watchers and Caustic Critics. As a result, a lot of YouTube channels have discovered that including RWBY content does increase their exposure and help grow their channel. So, there are reaction-watch channels who have started including RWBY content for the fandom and hate-watch/Caustic Critic channels who are doing the same for the hatedom. This isn't unique to Hbomberguy, and as someone who is known for being a Caustic Critic, his video is tailored more for that side than the fandom.

While the video is very popular with the demographic it's tailored to, it did receive more controversy than expected from Caustic Critic watchers. The biggest difference between RWBY hate-watchers and Caustic Critics is whether they'll pull their punches when it comes to criticising the real people behind the show. So, for those people who enjoy Caustic Critics but dislike full-blown attacks on real people behind the shows they make, there was a feeling that Hbomberguy crossed that line. So, as long as the entry is about only this and is neutrally worded, it'll be legitimate. It needs to avoid commenting on fandom reactions, because the fandom isn't the right demographic for this video anyway.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Aug 26th 2022 at 9:26:56 AM

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#10095: Aug 26th 2022 at 9:20:31 AM

Re: RWBY drinking game: That does look a bit complainy. As for the edit reason, sending a rudeness notifier.

Edited by Berrenta on Aug 26th 2022 at 11:22:51 AM

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#10096: Aug 26th 2022 at 9:23:53 AM

Okay, I've sent a rudeness notifier as well.

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#10097: Aug 26th 2022 at 4:09:25 PM

I believe I've mentioned 88y53 here before for their edits to Moon Knight (2022) regarding the change from Marlene to Layla, that were deemed fairly blatant They Changed It, Now It Sucks! complaining and edit warring.

Recently they've also been making edits to Jake Lockley on the character page that give me the impression that they're still using these pages to complain about not liking the show's changes from the comics. What the show did with Jake Lockley admittedly is a touch more controversial within the fandom than replacing Marlene with Layla (who nobody took an issue with outside of diehards or, well, racists), and for potentially more justified reasonsnote , but their edits still reek of thinly-veiled editorializing.

Edited by AlleyOop on Aug 26th 2022 at 7:17:46 AM

wingedcatgirl mys. minty from the silly dimension from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
mys. minty from the silly dimension
#10098: Aug 26th 2022 at 5:41:20 PM

re RWBY, that's also just not how drinking games work, to our understanding? It's "watch show, drink when thing happens", not "show contains thing, drink".

Suddenly I'm... still rotating Fallen London in my mind even though I've stopped actively playing it.
themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him
#10099: Aug 26th 2022 at 5:47:45 PM

[up][up][up][up][up] Thanks a ton Wyldchyld!

I agree, based on that analysis then, that the second He Panned It Now He Sucks entry can be rewritten to be more neutral. Maybe also break up the two mentioned reviews into separate entries.

I stand by my comments about the Greenwald entry though. As Greenwald is a journalist and not a media critic, and he is not directly criticizing media, the entry is a shoehorn and can be cut.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Aug 26th 2022 at 9:14:19 AM

Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
#10100: Aug 26th 2022 at 6:19:03 PM

[up] Cut the first entry. There's many more complaining entries on that page than just the two I brought up, so I'd recommend a good and thorough cleaning.


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