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Removing complaining, bashing and other negativity from the wiki

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Inspired by this thread, I've noticed that this wiki doesn't have a dedicated cleanup thread for negativity.

As we all know, Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, Creator Bashing and other negativity isn't desired on the wiki, except in a few selected areas like reviews and several Darth Wiki pages (and even then, with limitations). And yet, it's one of the most common sins wiki contributors can make.

So, if you find a page, TLP or discussion whose content seems like a straight-up insult or any other bitching - including complainy soapboxing -, you might ask here for help with removing said content.

The sandbox for this project is located at Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining.

Edited by MacronNotes on Apr 27th 2022 at 5:36:47 AM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#9476: Jun 4th 2022 at 4:51:37 PM

...Moral Dissonance wasn't audience reaction, either. At least not officially. It was still a mainspace trope, which meant that it was also about narrative portrayal and not fan reaction... In theory, anyway.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#9477: Jun 4th 2022 at 4:54:54 PM

I know that I mean more in the way as it's not intentional. Either way that doesn't solve this issue I have that if we get rid of this example it has nowhere else to go due to that trope being cut despite the fact it is a good example.

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#9478: Jun 4th 2022 at 5:12:23 PM

I don't actually think we ever came to an agreement on if MD was meant to be intentional or not. For the sake of not arguing over a dead trope though I'll just leave it at the reminder that the topic was kind of controversial and ambiguous, and that your writeup still seems subjective ("comes across as", which leaves room for people to disagree with that opinion) so I don't think I'd support it being in main anyway.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#9479: Jun 4th 2022 at 5:13:38 PM

I do get that I am saying that the trope should be moved to something though at least instead of just getting deleted.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#9480: Jun 5th 2022 at 2:22:49 AM

That thread was a long time in the past though. The problem now though is that Moral Dissonance has been disambguated which used to be the Audience Reaction version of the trope but now we have nowhere to stick these tropes besides Hypocrite as they are valid examples so Hypocrite should cover both In-Universe and Audience Reaction. So there is nowhere to move these tropes if they are deleted so they should stay on Hypocrite for now.

All you're saying is that there's a reason to create a new thread. However, you're indicating here that you want to unilaterally decide to use a trope the way you want it used. We can't do that; we have to take the trope to a project thread.

I know that I mean more in the way as it's not intentional. Either way that doesn't solve this issue I have that if we get rid of this example it has nowhere else to go due to that trope being cut despite the fact it is a good example.

If there's no trope to put it under, it's not an example of anything. At the moment, the entry is written as Fridge Logic. My suggestion would be to place it there.

Note, it's not that I don't sympathise with what you're saying about the trope itself. It is a problem, which is why I took it to ATT in the first place. However, until we actually resolve the problem through a suitable project thread, we're stuck with the trope being what it is. The trope needs to be fixed, but we can't do that here.

Edited to add: I've had a look at the RWBY Fridge pages, and for some reason, they've split everything into Fridge Brilliance and Fridge Horror, despite the fact not all Fridge has to be "brilliance" or "horror"? Anyway, if we expand this entry to point out that this fridge might explain why Cinder felt it would make their Divide and Conquer mission even easier than before she found out Penny was a secret robot, it can be added to the Fridge Brilliance page without too much trouble.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Jun 5th 2022 at 3:06:23 AM

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#9481: Jun 5th 2022 at 9:21:19 AM

Most Fridge pages are split between Brilliance and Horror, and sometimes Logic, but other times Logic gets punted to Headscratchers. There'd also Fridge Sadness but it is extremely new and still catching on.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Cutegirl920fire Player 222 from the Squid Games (Five Long Years) Relationship Status: Paris holds the key to my heart
Player 222
#9482: Jun 5th 2022 at 11:39:49 AM

Is this entry on Estrogen Brigade a bit too... bashy?

* Though Reborn! (2004) is a Shōnen, it's safe to say that 80-90% of its fans are actually Yaoi Fangirls. Surprisingly there is actually a lot less headbutting, since any male fans tend to avoid most of the online forums or have their voices drowned out amongst the Squee. However, it has quite a lot of male fans too if you know where to look (hint: NOT livejournal and fanfiction.net). Over on FanFiction.Net, there seems to be an interesting amount of OC stories that either pair up the slew of existing characters with their soulmates or decide to go into the future with the Vongola whatever. However, those attempting to invert the trope, oftentimes end up failing hard.

CG for short
Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the "Retromancer"
#9483: Jun 5th 2022 at 11:42:07 AM

My eyes are melting because I don't see how anything after the first sentence is relevant to Estrogen Brigade.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
PhantomDusclops92 Nitpicky Nitwit from Italy Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Nitpicky Nitwit
#9484: Jun 5th 2022 at 11:42:33 AM

Just cut, it's bashing fans and nothing else.

Cutegirl920fire Player 222 from the Squid Games (Five Long Years) Relationship Status: Paris holds the key to my heart
Player 222
#9485: Jun 5th 2022 at 11:43:05 AM

So, cut anything after the first sentence?

Okie, gotcha.

Edited by Cutegirl920fire on Jun 5th 2022 at 11:43:54 AM

CG for short
good-morning Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles from Brazil Since: Nov, 2021
Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles
#9486: Jun 5th 2022 at 5:26:07 PM

This entry in Ptero Soarer looks too negative:

  • Journey to the Center of the Earth: One of the movie adaptations has pterodactyls that represent everything that is wrong with cultural perception of pterosaurs. Then again, the movie is really just horrible.

I wanted to correct it, but I don't know which adaptation of the book is the example talking about.

Edited by good-morning on Jun 5th 2022 at 9:27:33 AM

oh hey how are you doing?
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#9487: Jun 5th 2022 at 5:27:42 PM

Just cut it.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
wingedcatgirl mys. minty from the silly dimension from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
mys. minty from the silly dimension
#9488: Jun 5th 2022 at 5:43:58 PM

It's a Zero-Context Example too, since it complains instead of explaining. So yes, delet that

Suddenly I'm... still rotating Fallen London in my mind even though I've stopped actively playing it.
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#9489: Jun 5th 2022 at 8:00:33 PM

EsotericHappyEnding.Live Action Films

  • Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker:
    • The supposed Bittersweet Ending of Palpatine and the Sith being finally and decisively destroyed by Rey is hampered by her going through extreme, irreconcilable loss in the process. As such, she may be more at risk of falling to the Dark Side. It's also noted that with the Skywalker and Solo bloodlines gone, the Jedi still extinct as far as we know, the galaxy being in a state of complete anarchy due to the lack of a government and the First Order — while dealt a big blow to their forces — still in control of a lot of systems, the war will probably continue for some time. To cap it off, given how the similarly optimistic ending of Return of the Jedi was completely undone, there's little reason to assume it will stick this time.
    • The movie ends with Rey burying Luke and Leia's lightsabers in the sand at the Lars homestead where Luke was raised and adopting the last name Skywalker. However, many Star Wars fans pointed out that Tatooine was actually the source of many terrible experiences for the Skywalker family. Anakin was born a slave there and after his mother Shmi was murdered by Tusken Raiders, he had his Start of Darkness by slaughtering the tribe responsible for her death. While Luke was raised there, all he wanted was to leave Tatooine behind, leaving after his Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru were brutally murdered by the Empire. And as for Leia, she went there to rescue Han Solo from Jabba the Hutt in Return of the Jedi, getting captured and made a slave by Jabba in the process.

Esoteric Happy Ending was previously deemed not to apply per this ATT, which went over the same issues. The poor title formatting and being split into multiple bullets, one dedicated to something poorly thought out as opposed to big part of the ending is also suspect. The "First Order — while dealt a big blow to their forces — still in control of a lot of systems, the war will probably continue for some time" is inaccurate as it's shown and stated that they're being defeated pretty much everywhere, that such a quick defeat is illogical might be something else?

Thoughts? Any of this worth salvaging/keeping?

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Jun 5th 2022 at 8:00:47 AM

SpongeBat1 We stan Clippy in this house from Quittersville, Failuretown, and Loserburg (Y2: Electric Boogaloo) Relationship Status: It's a god-awful small affair
We stan Clippy in this house
#9490: Jun 5th 2022 at 8:54:37 PM

[up]My memory's a bit hazy on that film, but wasn't the First Order disbanded or otherwise defeated by the end? I mean, Palpatine's defeated, Kylo Ren redeems himself before dying, and Hux was Good All Along, so unless I'm forgetting something I don't see how they'd still be around, or at least they'd be nowhere near as big as before.

At worst I'd say maybe it's an Audience-Alienating Ending since I know not everyone likes it.

Came for the tropes, stayed for the cleanup.
BigJimbo Since: Dec, 2017
#9491: Jun 5th 2022 at 9:14:20 PM

There's this entry in DontTryThisAtHome.Western Animation that I'd like to question:

  • American Dragon: Jake Long: Supposedly part of an aborted plan to give Jake Long's dragon form a helmet was based on the prospect of children imitating it. Yeah, children turning into a dragon and flying without a helmet, makes perfect sense.
While the idea indeed doesn't make much sense, the final sentence seems like snarking for snarking's sake. I'd remove it, but that has the risk of making the entry a ZCE, and I don't even know if this entry constitutes a "Don't Try this at Home" warning since it's not a written and/or spoken disclaimer.

Edgar81539 Since: Mar, 2014
#9492: Jun 5th 2022 at 9:29:38 PM

It's not an example, though I think it could fit into "What Could Have Been" trivia and make it less bashy and more witty

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#9493: Jun 5th 2022 at 9:51:51 PM

By the way, I readded the entry I brought up here since nobody had any objections after three days per the Three-Day Rule.

ATricksterArtist Back from the grave. from CH 57 (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Back from the grave.
#9494: Jun 6th 2022 at 4:01:29 AM

[up][up][up] ...It's a kid's show, why would they turn into an actual dragon to begin with?

Well, while kids can try to imitate him, I don't think they'd have any of his "powers" that'd be necessary to do so.

Edited by ATricksterArtist on Jun 6th 2022 at 7:02:58 AM

How's your day been?
ShadowsandSwords Since: Mar, 2019
#9495: Jun 6th 2022 at 12:28:15 PM

Found this on the Western Animation subpage for Dude, Where's My Respect? for the Legend of Zelda cartoon. Maybe it's just me, but this explanation feels rather biased and complainy about how Zelda treats Link in the show sometimes. I feel this because, while there are moments in the show where Zelda treats Link in a way that can arguably be considered poor, Link also does sometimes act in a way towards Zelda that viewers can also argue as poor, such as persistently trying to get kissed by her and when he wolf-whistled at Zelda in "The Ringer" and he got slapped by her for it later in the episode. Could this be rewritten or should something else be done about it?

In the animated version of The Legend of Zelda, Link suffers from this in a different way than described in the video game section. In the cartoon, it's Zelda herself who refuses to accord Link any respect. She's often nasty to him; she compares him unfavorably to another wandering hero; she almost never thanks him for his protection; and when things are quiet in the kingdom, she forces him to earn his keep by doing chores and maintenance around the castle. To add insult to injury, her father the King genuinely likes Link, but can't seem to remember his name.

Edited by ShadowsandSwords on Jun 6th 2022 at 3:42:09 PM

PlasmaPower Piece of Cake. Since: Jan, 2015
Piece of Cake.
#9496: Jun 7th 2022 at 11:02:07 PM

UsefulNotes.North Korea has some snark towards the country in its description, including some potholes to NRLEP tropes.

Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!
MyFinalEdits Delete message from Parts Unknown (Spin-off Series) Relationship Status: Cast away
Delete message
#9497: Jun 7th 2022 at 11:17:22 PM

Zapped the potholes within the full name of the country. However, more will need to be done (I have just done a huge edit in another page and need to sleep).

135 -> 180 -> 273 -> 191 -> 188 -> 230 -> 300 -> 311
Bubblepig Rei from Tokyo (Apprentice) Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
#9498: Jun 11th 2022 at 12:34:21 AM

Someone brought me here. Found this in Horrible Judge of Character. The last sentence is complaining. Cut that?

  • In Byzantium, what's with nice guy Darvell later thinking Ruthven might be a good, noble recruit for the Brethren? Ruthven raped and forced Clara into whoredom and then abandoned Darvell, robbed his corpse, and stole his estate. WTF?

"Now it's starting to feel like a game!"
AdeptGaderius Otaku from the Anime World Since: Nov, 2018 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Otaku
#9499: Jun 11th 2022 at 2:17:23 AM

[up] Cut the last sentence and rewrite the entire example to be less snarky. It's not great writing for an example.

AnimationFan767 Since: Nov, 2021
#9500: Jun 11th 2022 at 9:27:53 AM

"Nice Guy Darvell thinking Ruthven might be a good, noble recruit for the Brethren, even though Ruthven raped Clara and abandoned Darvell, robbed his corpse, and stole his estate."

Simple rewrite, easy.

Edited by AnimationFan767 on Jun 11th 2022 at 9:28:44 AM


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