Inspired by this thread
, I've noticed that this wiki doesn't have a dedicated cleanup thread for negativity.
As we all know, Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, Creator Bashing and other negativity isn't desired on the wiki, except in a few selected areas like reviews and several Darth Wiki pages (and even then, with limitations). And yet, it's one of the most common sins wiki contributors can make.
So, if you find a page, TLP or discussion whose content seems like a straight-up insult or any other bitching - including complainy soapboxing -, you might ask here for help with removing said content.
The sandbox for this project is located at Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining.
Edited by MacronNotes on Apr 27th 2022 at 5:36:47 AM
DorkAge.Western Animation: You could win a game of "cartoon complaining bingo" with this entry. I'm not even sure if it's correctly using Dork Age.
- Not a particular show, but rather an iconic part of shows—Theme Tunes (specifically American and, to a lesser extent, British shows) in The New '10s are widely considered to have gone through this. Due to a combination of factors (including Executive Meddling, the rise of Web Animation and streaming services, and the ongoing fall of cable TV), many shows had infamously poor or low effort songsnote . Not even Long Runners or reboots were safe—The Fairly OddParents! had a lackluster recreation of the original theme with only two people singing instead of a choir and Chloe inserted and The Powerpuff Girls (2016) has a Broken Base behind it. The few theme songs that were well received (With The Loud House, Star vs. the Forces of Evil and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2012) being particular standouts) weren't enough to counteract the Sturgeon's Law that was plaguing that era. It's gotten to the point that some have wondered if Theme Tunes in Western Animation are dying off and whether or not it will ever recover going into The New '20s.
I feel that entry violates the "examples are not general" rule we have. Dork Age is supposed to be for franchises, and not specific elements of works.
Spidey, I was the one who put the two recently deleted ymmvs on the Origami King. I believe it was a mistake to delete those entries, more specifically the second one.
First off, I believe there is no misuse at at in play. Looking at the laconic entry for wasting a perfectly good plot, it says its when a plot point is brought up or potential is there, yet not used. The criteria is met for both of them, as the game does bring both up- therefore, it can and should be held accountable to the standards it itself has set up.
For the former, as the entry explains, Olly and others are legit made of paper. In light of how divisive the overuse of paper comments is, it is more than fair to come to the conclusion the issue could have been resolved only he and Olivia should have been regarded in-game as actual paper, while also giving Olly’s conflict more of an actual angle. The Vellumental praying example, involving the paper gods the game itself introduces and how they’re worshipped, also gives a case of not using new storytelling opportunities to address a longstanding issue, and builds upon points to further explain how this existing plot point is underdeveloped and not touched upon, which is what a good example should do. The one phrase that even sounds like a complaint is only there as a part of explaining this story beat, and authors do sometimes use new plot points to explain away past poor ideas for a positive result, which this plot point could have done. Heck- the Vellumental example didn’t have a single negative word, yet that got swept up too instead of just leaving it and deleting everything else if there was a serious problem.
The latter, meanwhile, and the one I really want to defend...the game itself keeps propping up the Toads as some indisputable beacon that can do no wrong, yet no-one besides Olly ever calls out the Toads or administers some lesser punishment to on anything. I didn’t go into this next part in the entry, but the game bends backwards quite a bit to absolve the Toads of any blame, such as having the cut wood be happy to be burned, making Grandsappy look wrong for calling them out. In addition, something the entry does touch on, Bowser is way too defensive of the Toads, despite them doing bad things to his troops that weren’t even their fault in this game, so it makes zero sense he has absolutely no anger with them at all. The entry even has a little bit acknowledging the writers may not have thought this through, but it’s still not good and can be interpreted as such by the audience, which is a very level and not-complainy thing to say.
In other words, the entry is based on a plot point the game itself brings up (characters having issues with Toads), going point-by-point to explain the problem (only the main bad guy has a problem with the Toads, his solution is way over-the-top, and no good guys calling out the Toads without some catch like brainwashing, making it easy to see Olly’s motive as a strawman, which people of both sides across the web have noticed), and ways that plot point could have been better addressed were even included (legit good guys calling out the Toads and having it stick/not be undone, or having the series villain mention some grievances before defending the Toads). Therefore, it was wrong and not justified to outright remove that example, as it met the words and spirit of all the rules. If there was an outright complainy part, you guys could have talked it out, bolded some problem parts like with other disputed examples, simply edit those parts out, and put it back in. Not skip that part altogether.
Edited by DarkChirano on Jan 7th 2021 at 3:00:33 AM
Nothin' much, just cookin'.![]()
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That entry is ridiculously complain-y and also speculative and weasel word-y ("some have wondered if Theme Tunes in Western Animation are dying off and whether or not it will ever recover going into The New '20s.") Torch it.
Here's the post, BTW.
The specifics of what Milky Way Wishes is don't really make the example any more or less complainy.
Could this paragraph on Even Stevens be reworded to be less derisive towards later Disney Channel shows? The "quirky gimmick" section is both complainy and vaguely defined (one could say that Good Luck Charlie does kind of have a gimmick in how it relies on Charlie's baby cuteness).
This would be the last "old school" Disney Channel original series (as in, a show without a Teen Idol as a lead character), before the paradigm shifter Lizzie McGuire premiered in 2001. It remained the last show produced solely by the channel note without a quirky "gimmick" as part of the premise until Good Luck Charlie premiered ten years later.
I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.I hope no one minds me asking, but do these edits
to Caillou come off as complaining?
The same person who added that also added Calliou as The Scrappy, despite the fact the hatedom he has is a Periphery Hatedom.
Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!From Another Life (2019), is the last sentence, which I've bolded, necessary?:
- Angst? What Angst?: Barely an episode goes by without a named character dying a horrible death, yet nobody ever seems to care much about it. Most are essentially forgotten about mere hours after their demise. This is especially weird because the initial crew is implied to be a tight-knit group that has been working together for quite some time under Yerxa's command. Kinda makes you wonder if it's just bad writing or if everyone in this universe is Conditioned to Accept Horror.
On Shrek 2:
- Designated Hero: Shrek and Fiona, mostly Fiona considering their abuse towards others during their honeymoon, which include Fiona throwing a mermaid into the ocean where it is eaten by sharks and where they trap fairies in jars and make them suffer from the smell of their flatulence.
Since it relies entirely on gags from a montage very early in the movie, I highly doubt this counts. Most people don't see Shrek and Fiona as bad guys.
I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Yeah, all of that is Played for Laughs, and isn’t important to the overall narrative. I agree on cutting it.
Edited by jandn2014 on Jan 7th 2021 at 4:59:56 AM
DorkAge.Television Networks: Focusing on the first bullet of the Disney Channel example because I have more reservations about it.
- Disney Channel:
- The channel went through one of these during the mid-2000s, generally agreed to have begun with the premiere of Hannah Montana (which coincides with the end of Kim Possible) and to have concluded with the premiere of Phineas and Ferb. The animated shows were sidelined in favor of a focus on the teenybopper demographic; even Mickey Mouse and the gang had a minor presence. This alienated Disney Channel's other demographics. It doesn't help that Disney in general was going through some rough times of their own. Fortunately, Phineas and Ferb helped to broaden the appeal of the channel. Interestingly, the shows such as That's So Raven and its sequel Cory in the House, The Suite Life of Zack & Cody and its sequel The Suite Life on Deck, Wizards of Waverly Place, and Hannah Montana are usually exempt from the Dork Age, with all of the aforementioned shows having large fanbases, especially now due to nostalgia.
Doesn't a Dork Age have to be a commercial and critical failure? Hannah Montana and many of its other similar shows were extremely successful with their target audiences, IIRC. Did it not do well early on? Also, it claims many of these shows are "exempt from the Dork Age" when they're describing the most prominent shows that brought a ton of success to the network. I think this is more just standard Network Decay.
Edited by mightymewtron on Jan 7th 2021 at 6:40:44 AM
I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Someone recently added a They Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot to YMMV.Paper Mario The Origami King, and at least to me, it just sounds complainy and maybe even misuse. Check it out:
Thoughts on the entry?
Edited by Spidey on Jan 5th 2021 at 4:19:57 AM
"Unite GUN/BAZOOKA/LAUNCHER/TANK!"