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Policy on singular "they"?

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JapaneseTeeth Existence Weighed Against Nonbeing from Meinong's jungle Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Mu
Existence Weighed Against Nonbeing
#51: Mar 9th 2012 at 8:38:49 AM

[up][up]Yeah, that is true. I don't think I've ever seen it used that way in modern usage, though.

[up]Same here, although I'm also an academic and some of the more formal writing quirks have worked their way into my informal writing.

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abstractematics Since: May, 2011
#52: Mar 9th 2012 at 9:22:51 AM

I meant that "one" isn't a problem since it carries that same generic meaning. I didn't mean that it's 1st person.

Now using Trivialis handle.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#53: Mar 9th 2012 at 11:51:11 AM

[up][up][up]I'll give you a pass, ccoa.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#54: Mar 9th 2012 at 12:11:59 PM

[up]If it's a pet peeve, okay. But you don't need to attack. Save that for things that actually cause problems here, like natter and complaining.

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#55: Mar 9th 2012 at 1:07:17 PM

I'm not attacking. And I'm joking with ccoa, as if she needs a pass from me. Yes, it's a pet peeve, just like any other bad writing style. To me, excessive usage of "one" is natter.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
ccoa Ravenous Sophovore from the Sleeping Giant Since: Jan, 2001
Ravenous Sophovore
#56: Mar 9th 2012 at 1:21:56 PM

Martello and I are on pretty friendly terms, he can joke with me without having his home destroyed by volcanic eruptions.

This is a gag based on my username. "Ccoa" is a Peruvian cat goddess that liked to destroy villages and crops with natural disasters if not appeased regularly.

edited 9th Mar '12 1:26:38 PM by ccoa

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.
lu127 Paper Master from 異界 Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#57: Mar 9th 2012 at 1:23:39 PM

Peru had a cat goddess?!

I approve. cool

"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer
32_Footsteps Think of the mooks! from Just north of Arkham Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Think of the mooks!
#58: Mar 9th 2012 at 1:59:19 PM

@54 That's not what natter means. Now, if all of this thread got plopped into an article where someone was using it, that'd be natter.

Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#59: Mar 10th 2012 at 9:53:07 AM

Ccoa, I got the joke, but only because I've looked at your profile. Never heard of that goddess before that.

Maybe I can explain my problem with "one" a little better for anyone who still cares.

You guys know those Vibram Five Fingers shoes, right? Well, they're quite popular with a certain type of Army guy who also love CrossFit. There's nothing wrong with Five Fingers or CrossFit in and of themselves, but many of the guys who wear them and do CrossFit are also raging hard-ons who think the way they exercise is peerless and especially superior to traditional weight-lifting. And they think that makes them superior to guys like me, who do the regular heavy weight-lifting. So every time I see someone wearing Five Fingers, I figure they're a raging hard-on who think they're better than other people just based on their preferred workout routine.

Use of "one" is like that, for me. I know plenty of people who use it and are perfectly cool and not "shut-in Internet nerds" or whatever. However, that usage is very popular with douche-bags who like to sound "educated" and just come off as giant tools. So when somebody who's otherwise cool uses "one," it's like a perfectly cool and unassuming fellow wearing Five Fingers — I just immediately assume tool status.

edited 10th Mar '12 9:54:02 AM by Martello

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#60: Mar 10th 2012 at 1:31:07 PM

[up] It's not always best to make assumptions about people.

To me, excessive usage of "one" is natter.
Whether or not something constitutes Natter is not a matter of opinion.

edited 10th Mar '12 1:35:53 PM by ThatHuman

something
FinalStarman from Clinton, Massachusetts Since: Nov, 2011
#61: Mar 10th 2012 at 1:50:50 PM

Singular they is only unacceptable in the absolute most formal/snobbish of writing. TV Tropes can use it fine. Even Wikipedia can.

edited 10th Mar '12 1:51:09 PM by FinalStarman

I'm not crazy, I just don't give a darn!
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#62: Mar 10th 2012 at 2:23:56 PM

[up][up]I know that, but I don't always have the time to figure out if my assumptions or accurate or not. Sometimes I have to just go on quick impressions.

Also, quick platitudes really do little for the conversation.

edited 10th Mar '12 2:25:11 PM by Martello

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
32_Footsteps Think of the mooks! from Just north of Arkham Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Think of the mooks!
#63: Mar 10th 2012 at 8:38:27 PM

Using "one" is no more a platitude than any other pronoun. To argue that it is a platitude would, by extension, argue against using any pronouns. And that, ironically enough, would lead to excessive word use - also known as natter.

Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.
FinalStarman from Clinton, Massachusetts Since: Nov, 2011
#64: Mar 10th 2012 at 9:15:58 PM

[up] He wasn't saying that using "one" was a platitude, he was referring to the part about assumptions.

Clarification on calling excessive word use "natter" above—this is not inaccurate. Here "natter" refers not to Conversation In The Main Page but to too many words of little significance—a type of Word Cruft.

Personally, I have no vehemence against "one." It doesn't make pages unnecessarily long and I don't immediately assume that anyone who writes it thinks that oneself is smarter than everyone else. Unless, of course, it makes the sentence make absolutely no grammatical sense, like the second half of that last sentence I just typed. "He" to refer to either gender is also fine and is technically*

more grammatically correct than singular "they"… although these days it is frowned upon by some, what with the word implying masculine superiority or some bullshit like that about it being "sexist." evil grin In the case of Adorably Precocious Child, the distinction that it can be either gender is necessary though, so adding "or she" is probably a better bet than replacing the word with "they," since "or she" is more explicit.

I'm not crazy, I just don't give a darn!
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#65: Mar 10th 2012 at 9:29:07 PM

The platitude I was referring to was "it's not good to make assumptions about people." So, Final Starman is correct.

edited 10th Mar '12 11:44:28 PM by Martello

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#66: Mar 10th 2012 at 9:39:44 PM

[up]I would say assumptions can work as long as they are guesses, and are able to change when given further information. Sort of like making an initial assessment.

Sticking to bad assumptions is the problem (not referring to you, but anyone that does that).

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#67: Mar 10th 2012 at 11:43:58 PM

[up]I agree completely.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#68: Mar 11th 2012 at 12:07:15 PM

Now your avatar is an adult white guy with his cap on the wrong way. One of my pet peeves. tonguetonguetonguetonguetongue

edited 11th Mar '12 12:07:36 PM by DragonQuestZ

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#69: Mar 11th 2012 at 12:14:33 PM

Ha ha ha.

Is it okay that I'm holding an adorable puppy though?

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#70: Mar 11th 2012 at 12:41:12 PM

[up]Did you even have to ask that? wink

Back on topic, it's clear there are plenty of options for this, and I say that whatever term goes best with the tone of a line is what someone should use.

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
bwburke94 I am mad scientist! It's so cool! from 1.048596% (Y2: Electric Boogaloo) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
I am mad scientist! It's so cool!
#71: Mar 13th 2012 at 11:10:35 AM

Singular "they" should quite obviously be used if you don't want to spoil a gender-reveal, though many reveals do fall under It Was His Sled.

2025: the year it all ends?
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