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A starting place for Batman?

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Rotpar Always 3:00 am in the Filth (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Always 3:00 am in the Filth
#1: Feb 20th 2012 at 11:57:38 AM

Becoming more and more of a Batman fan recently. Nowadays we have the kick-ass Nolan films, Arkham Asylum / Arkham City, and I only finally realized what I missed when I was a kid and didn't watch Batman The Animated Series. So, I'm looking for a place where I might have a chance of starting Batman.

Token Not A Comic Fan comment: Continuity Lock-Out, Archive Panic, etc.

Anyway, a few questions:

  • There is some archive of the original Batman comic available right? While I'm not attempting to read everything from the start, I would like to see the original origins of a character whose survived 70+ years and become a cultural icon.

  • I'm familiar with a few of the more notable, referenced stories, like The Killing Joke, Batman Year One, and (snicker) All Star Batman And Robin. Are these part of the main, modern continuity (I assume not Goddamn Batman at least) or just one-shot stories?

  • Is there a present, modern continuity that isn't utterly dependent on Crisis Crossover and the like? I heard DC's reboot was fairly half-assed and that instead of starting from scratch they left in a number of previous Crisis stories as canon. I'd really like to read about Batman, his close allies, his Rogues Gallery, and their adventures, not worrying about the Bigger Picture that Superman, Wonder Woman, and and half the DC universe are dealing with at the moment.

  • I prefer graphic novels to individual issues, not a question, but do keep in mind. I'd rather have a single $20 book then a pile of flimsy comics.

  • Did the Silver Age have some quality and enduring stories going on? I know about plenty of silliness like Bat-baby and Rainbow Batman that makes for internet snark, but there have to be some good, silly-but-not-ridiculous stories that came out of that period.

Thanks for the help.

edited 20th Feb '12 12:00:48 PM by Rotpar

But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you.
KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#2: Feb 20th 2012 at 12:28:04 PM

All the stories mentioned except ASBAR are in-continuity.

I would start with Grant Morrisons Batman (it will catch you up with the modern Batman), the 1990s Nightwing series, the first Robin series (starring Time Drake) and the first Batgirl series (starring Cassandra Cain). Also, Birds Of Prey isn't half bad.

TheConductor Since: Jan, 2011
#3: Feb 20th 2012 at 12:34:24 PM

Hey there, always nice to help a new fan enter the fold, so let's see what I can do;

1) For Golden Age Batman stuff, The Batman Chronicles series collects ten or so early Batman stories in each book.

2) Batman Year One and The Killing Joke are both part of the modern continuity. All Star isn't.

3) Crisis Crossovers are still canon, but they aren't nearly as big a deal as non-fans like to make out they are. You can more or less get by just ignoring them.

4) Most Batman stories get collected into graphic novels so no worries there.

5) I'm not really a Silver Age fan and I'd personally say that it was the WORST era for Batman, but others will disagree. (If you want good Silver Age stuff, look at the Flash or Spider-Man).

As for jumping on points, I'd suggest the September reboots. If you like, I compiled a reading order of most of the Batman trade paper backs, including the spin offs if you'd like me to PM you it.

NapoleonDeCheese Since: Oct, 2010
#4: Feb 20th 2012 at 12:37:54 PM

So, haven't you watched BTAS yet? If not, do so, and also try getting The Batman Adventures. They aren't in DCU continuity, but they're still worth it.

Seamus Another Perfect Day from the Quantum Savanna Since: Jul, 2009
Another Perfect Day
#5: Feb 20th 2012 at 12:41:14 PM

If you're into graphic novels and want to read something that directly influenced both of Nolan's movies, pick up The Long Halloween and its sequel Dark Victory. The former is easily one of the best Batman stories of all time, and both take place very early on in Batman's career. They're also follow-ups to Year One.

I've got two guns pointed west and a broken compass.
Sijo from Puerto Rico Since: Jan, 2001
#6: Feb 20th 2012 at 3:10:02 PM

Hey, not all Batman Silver Age stories were goofy. Let's not forget that many of his classic foes & supporting characters were introduced during it. Like Clayface and Two-Face. And did you know Alfred DIED in one!? He Got Better later, of course, but still, it was pretty shocking to see a supporting character die in those days!

edited 20th Feb '12 3:10:58 PM by Sijo

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#7: Feb 20th 2012 at 3:54:39 PM

At some point, read The Long Halloween.

Batman doesn't quite have a "start." It isn't quite presented as a chain of continuity from 1940 to now, though most things are in continuity of some sort Crises nonwithstanding. Rather, you can kind of see it as having "eras" of a sort with some lasting events.

Because of this, you don't really need to start at a certain place in order to understand the whole of it, but can pick up a few books of one era and, depending the closer to the present it is, get into the franchise as a whole right away.

Certain storylines can be seen as "benchmarks" that are more lasting - Knightfall, Death In The Family, War Games, etc. Origin anthologies, particularly ones that involve large-scale plots which are pivot points in the universe as a whole, can be seen as lasting as well: The Killing Joke, The Long Halloween, Hush, etc.

Gray64 Since: Dec, 1969
#8: Feb 20th 2012 at 10:35:59 PM

The Greatest Batman Stories Ever Told is a good primer, too.

edited 20th Feb '12 10:36:10 PM by Gray64

NapoleonDeCheese Since: Oct, 2010
#9: Feb 21st 2012 at 6:36:50 AM

[up][up][up] Two-Face was introduced in the Golden Age and disappeared through the whole Silver Age. He wasn't reintroduced until the Bronze Age by Denny O'Neil and Neal Adams.

SKJAM Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#10: Feb 21st 2012 at 12:51:59 PM

There was one story in the Silver Age that featured Two-Face...kind of. It was an issue of World's Finest in which Superman and Batman were asked which villains scared them the most. Then the bad guy used a Psycho Serum to turn Batman into Two-Face.

Rotpar Always 3:00 am in the Filth (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Always 3:00 am in the Filth
#11: Feb 21st 2012 at 5:48:30 PM

I picked up the Killing Joke. I figured it's widely considered one of the best and since learning she existed I freaking love Oracle. So, time to see the unpleasant reason why the first Batgirl "retired". And afterward I'd love to see more of her.

Also, with the reboot, will Oracle no longer exist at all if Barbara is Batgirl again? That's something I'd really like to know: the overall goal of the reboot. Are they telling old stories over again for newcomers or doing some new stories for all the veterans?

Now conversely, I hate Robin with a passion. All of him, because all I see is Burt Ward. And the idea that the Dark Knight, dressing as a bat to terrorize criminals, feels the compelling need to have a Boy Wonder bothers me. Are the Nightwing/Robin stories worth reading as part of the greater Bat-Mythos?

I made a joke with friends that instead of having Nightwing/Robin as a playable character in Arkham City, I'd rather have Oracle. Give her some batarangs, a line launcher, a grappling hook, and a seatbelt, and let her go to town.

Also, if the Killing Joke is the quintessential Joker story, do other villains have their big, critically-acclaimed days in the limelight?

But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you.
NapoleonDeCheese Since: Oct, 2010
#12: Feb 21st 2012 at 6:35:32 PM

For Two-Face, you should check The Long Halloween, and his origin story in an annual titled Eye of the Beholder.

Harley Quinn has Mad Love.

For Hugo Strange, try the Prey arc of the Legends of the Dark Knight title.

For more Joker goodies, check Going Sane and The Man who Laughs.

DrFurball Since: Jan, 2001
#13: Feb 21st 2012 at 6:39:56 PM

The Long Halloween has a lot of the major players of Batman's Rogues Gallery. But I'd recommend reading it after Year One, since it's a sequel to that story (also because Year One is awesome). I think Robin's introduction into the current canon is Dark Victory, the sequel to The Long Halloween.

I also really love and highly recommend The Dark Knight Returns, but it's not a good starting point. (But stay far away from The Dark Knight Strikes Again)

edited 21st Feb '12 6:44:50 PM by DrFurball

Seamus Another Perfect Day from the Quantum Savanna Since: Jul, 2009
Another Perfect Day
#14: Feb 21st 2012 at 6:57:35 PM

You can have Batman without Robin, but you'd be sorely missing out on a lot of good stories. As mentioned before, Dark Victory introduces Robin and it's excellent.

I've got two guns pointed west and a broken compass.
soulseller Dr. Snakes Since: Dec, 2011
Dr. Snakes
#15: Feb 22nd 2012 at 12:03:18 PM

Batfamily is a mayor point to the franchise. There're plently of people that like the family a lot better than Batman.
On a different note, while it's not a story you could read without some knowledge of the Batcomics and you have to accept the premise first... but No Man's Land still stands in my mind as one of the greatest Batman stories. It handles the family and the antagonists very well while things like Hush or The Long Halloween have their appeals they're also the bane for some folks*

.

Seamus Another Perfect Day from the Quantum Savanna Since: Jul, 2009
Another Perfect Day
#16: Feb 22nd 2012 at 2:50:37 PM

Two Face fans are not that taken with Lng Halloween for example.
..Huh?

I've never heard that. Why would that be?

I've got two guns pointed west and a broken compass.
SKJAM Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#17: Feb 22nd 2012 at 6:12:29 PM

The Showcase Presents: Batman volumes start in the early Sixties, but just as a new editor took over and moved the Bat-comics in a slightly less silly direction (Bat-Mite was banned, for example.) So it's not quite the high camp of the very early Silver Age. Howsomever, a couple of years in, the Batman TV show began, and some of the silliness of that bled back into the comics to attract the new fans. (Didn't last too long, and we got Batgirl out of it, so a positive overall.) Lots of stories for a reasonable price, and back then they used strong inkers so black and white works pretty well.

EnglishMajor All haill Atroticus! from The 5th Circle of Hell Since: Aug, 2010
All haill Atroticus!
#18: Feb 22nd 2012 at 8:01:15 PM

I'd have to recommend Scott Snyder's The Black Mirror. Yeah, it features Dick Grayson as Batman, but it's still excellent reading. And It's a great way to take a look at Batman pre-reboot.

With blood and rage of crimson red ripped from a corpse so freshly dead together with our hellish hate we'll burn you all that is your fate
SKJAM Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#19: Feb 23rd 2012 at 5:47:41 PM

Re some Two-Face fans not being happy with Long Halloween: The reasons for that are kind of spoilery for those who haven't read the story, so I'm going to go to spoiler tag now.

The Shocking Swerve of Gilda Dent into being the one behind the murders didn't mesh well with any prior characterization of her. Also, it was, given the facts presented earlier in the story, physically impossible for her to be the person responsible. The appearance of a physical impossibility is a tradition of mystery stories (see also the entire Locked Room subgenre), but in a good mystery, the detective shows how the impossible thing was in fact possible. Long Halloween skipped that step.

i-kun Persona! from Dark Hour Since: May, 2010
Persona!
#20: Feb 23rd 2012 at 6:12:43 PM

You should definitely start with the New 52 Batman. It's currently at issue #6, and it features an amazing storyline with little ties to the current Batman mythos.

Rotpar Always 3:00 am in the Filth (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Always 3:00 am in the Filth
#21: Jun 13th 2012 at 9:34:18 PM

Found a copy of The Long Halloween today and read about a third of it. Definitely seeing the inspiration for Nolan's films in here. Haven't found any of the stories recommended in this topic aside from this and The Killing Joke so far.

But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you.
supergod Walking the Earth from the big city Since: Jun, 2012
Walking the Earth
#22: Jun 14th 2012 at 4:44:43 AM

Not really a Batman comic, but pick up Gotham Central. You don't need to know much history to enjoy it (except that Gordon and Bullock are no longer on the force), and you can learn a lot about what goes on in the city around Batman. More importantly, it's good reading.

For we shall slay evil with logic...
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#23: Jun 14th 2012 at 11:49:01 AM

Are the Nightwing/Robin stories worth reading as part of the greater Bat-Mythos?

Yes. Very yes. Especially in recent years, with the Red Robin stuff, but Tim Drake's stories even decades back in general are very good and definitely deserve to be read.

Nightwing I read less of, but his world in Bluedhaven is also pretty good and worth a look.

edited 14th Jun '12 11:49:20 AM by KnownUnknown

NapoleonDeCheese Since: Oct, 2010
#24: Jun 15th 2012 at 7:04:55 PM

For my money, only Chuck Dixon, Alan Grant and Peter David have written a really good Tim Drake. Dixon especially made the character his and is the essential author on Tim.

Distortion00 Since: Nov, 2011
#25: Jun 17th 2012 at 11:38:00 PM

1. I really wouldn't recommend the Golden Age Batman stories. Things that were really impressive the 40s do not hold up well in the present day. The stories have too much text. The villains are really generic (Doctor Death). The gadget just really aren't as cool as they used to be (The Bat Gyro).

2. The reason why things like the Killing Joke and Year One are so well known is because they capture the spirit of Batman better than anything else. They in continuity but in broad strokes but I think any Batfan would enjoy them.

3. The new 52 really isn't as mangled as you make it sounds. Snyder's new Batman is unrelated to his old Batman.

Morrison's Batman Inc ties into the Batman stuff he's been doing for years now. I'd recomend reading the older stuff just because the plotline builds on itself and is more enjoyable as whole. That said, I don't think the reboot depends on you knowing what happened previously.

4. The animated stuff is all really good. I'd recommend you just find a series or movie which interests you and start there.

Nightwing is really good right now. So you might want to start with BTAS, especially the later stuff.

I really like Red Hood and the Outlaws. The Under the Red Hood Movie serves as a good introduction to the character.


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