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polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#1: Feb 16th 2012 at 4:22:58 AM

Recently I've seen a buch of talk about what the site can afford, or may have to cut, or whatever. Posts implying (without outright stating) that wiki isn't making money, that it's being paid for out-of-pocket.

This is silly: lots of ads + 90% text should == turning a profit on every pageview. If this isn't so, then something wrong on a fundamental level and ought to be addressed, rather than agonising about what we can 'afford' to 'support'.

What do people know (not 'can speculate', know) about the wiki's state of finances?

muninn 'M not Crazy, just Raven from Somewhere, out there... Since: Jan, 2001
'M not Crazy, just Raven
#2: Feb 16th 2012 at 4:53:39 AM

IIRC, the wiki is actually running a net loss, and Fast Eddie has to regularly support the difference out of his own pocket. Ads are only good if people click on them.

Now Bloggier than ever before!
CrystalGlacia from at least we're not detroit (Living Relic)
#3: Feb 16th 2012 at 5:08:16 AM

I remember either Eddie or one of the mods saying that the site only gets money if someone clicks on an ad. In addition, it sort of costs money to maintain the server space that the site needs to handle visitor traffic. And even if content factors into it (I don't know if it does) but we have a lot of pages, too. This can get pretty damn expensive for any site run by one person.

edited 16th Feb '12 5:09:22 AM by CrystalGlacia

"Jack, you have debauched my sloth."
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#4: Feb 16th 2012 at 5:14:28 AM

I know how webadvertising works. smile Hence my puzzlement that the wiki isn't making money.

Cracked.com (to pick a site frequently compared to our own) runs the same number (or a few less) ads, has orders of magnitude more images (the big bandwidth hog) and still makes enough cash to pay writers to write for them (unlike us, who run on love tongue.)

If a minimalist site like this couldn't turn a profit, the web economy would not exist.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#5: Feb 16th 2012 at 6:23:38 AM

Only Eddie and Janitor know the full extent of the site's finances, and they don't disclose them publicly for the same reason that any other private business doesn't. I do know enough to tell you that the wiki side is profitable, while the forums are not. Part of this is that Eddie has refused to permit some of the better paying types of ads, such as audio and pop-up/unders, so as not to annoy visitors.

As to why TV Tropes' fora get so few click-throughs, I can only speculate. Part of it is undoubtedly demographic; part is that people who read forums are not paying attention to the ads; part is that a lot of folks use ad blockers. I'm sure someone could get a nice research paper out of it.

The site's costs are partly bandwidth, partly server space, and partly CPU/processing time. A wiki is very processing intensive, and forums tend to use a disproportionate amount of all three resources, largely because people who use them spend more time there than on any other part of the site.

Now, Eddie hasn't griped about money lately, so I can only assume we're doing okay — usually the mods hear about it first if we're in the red by a significant margin. There are additional ways to contribute if you don't like ads; your Profile page has a donation link that turns off ads in the forums for a period of time.

edited 16th Feb '12 6:32:17 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#6: Feb 16th 2012 at 10:23:36 AM

I've neglected my ad clicking duties, so I will be working on remedying that.

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#7: Feb 16th 2012 at 11:14:04 AM

DO NOT click just to get the site revenue. That's fraud and can lose the site its ad contract.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#8: Feb 16th 2012 at 11:38:44 AM

Well I didn't know that. What's the proper thing to do, since I want to do this right.

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#9: Feb 16th 2012 at 11:40:23 AM

[up] If you want to contribute to the wiki financially, you can use the donation form.

edited 16th Feb '12 11:40:38 AM by ThatHuman

something
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#10: Feb 16th 2012 at 11:44:37 AM

Most Tropers Are Young Nerds. Most Young Nerds Dont Have High Paying Jobs.

edited 16th Feb '12 11:44:55 AM by Martello

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#11: Feb 16th 2012 at 11:59:21 AM

Well, see what Fighteer said. The advertisers didn't put up ads just so people can waste their bandwidth. And the money that goes into this wiki has to come from somewhere.

something
SilentReverence adopting kitteh from 3 tiles right 1 tile up Since: Jan, 2010
adopting kitteh
#12: Feb 16th 2012 at 12:00:02 PM

From what I know of web ad revenue models, you don't get money by impressions, probably do by clicking, and likely do if someone who clicked an ad actually ended up buying something. Thus the best way to contribute financially if you are already here (ie.: are a member), yes, is to donate. For visitors and random people the best and probably right way probably is if they happen to click an ad.

Martello: You've made me laugh and cry at once. Not sure if that's good or bad.

Fanfic Recs orwellianretcon'd: cutlocked for committee or for Google?
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#13: Feb 16th 2012 at 12:09:49 PM

@Silent Reverence: It's probably a good thing. tongue I used to be a young nerd without much money once, too. Then I graduated college and became an Infantry Officer.

I wish that I had noticed the donate button next to the profile edit thing before. It's not like it's not obvious, I just never really looked at it. I would have donated many times more if I had seen it.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
abstractematics Since: May, 2011
#14: Feb 16th 2012 at 12:45:24 PM

Huh, I didn't know that clicking on an ad gives extra revenue.

Now using Trivialis handle.
Rotpar Always 3:00 am in the Filth (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Always 3:00 am in the Filth
#15: Feb 16th 2012 at 6:36:17 PM

Just please remember: pay attention to the ads and click on those that are legitimately interesting to you. Don't try to artificially "help" the site by clicking randomly, Google knows all and does not approve. Past, present, future, all are one in Google.

But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you.
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#16: Feb 16th 2012 at 6:39:27 PM

You can also donate. 20 bones is only like two or three drinks, depending on what kind of bar you go to.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#17: Feb 16th 2012 at 6:55:54 PM

Or a bottle of rum if you buy wholesale.

Fight smart, not fair.
CountSpatula Possible Stomatopod from Oh, some lunar colony Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Mu
Possible Stomatopod
#18: Feb 17th 2012 at 2:36:40 AM

Perhaps some merchandise might not be a bad idea. I know that I certainly wouldn't mind being seen walking around in a Lampshade Hanging t-shirt, and I am sure there are others who feel likewise.

I draws things. And I seem to be some sort of marine entity.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#19: Feb 17th 2012 at 3:51:57 AM

[up] Merchandise, you say?

edited 17th Feb '12 4:40:28 AM by ThatHuman

something
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#20: Feb 17th 2012 at 4:34:50 AM

Broken link, dude.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#22: Feb 17th 2012 at 4:55:26 AM

It should be noted that anything you buy on zazzle after visiting with the * results in TV Tropes still getting moneys.

Fight smart, not fair.
Colonial1.1 Purveyor of Obscurity from The Marvelous River City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Purveyor of Obscurity
#23: Feb 17th 2012 at 7:07:42 AM

Hm... How much can be donated at one time?

"He could not know it. For it was not all a joke."
Martello Hammer of the Pervs from Black River, NY Since: Jan, 2001
Hammer of the Pervs
#24: Feb 17th 2012 at 7:27:36 AM

20 bucks. You can always do it more than once.

"Did anybody invent this stuff on purpose?" - Phillip Marlowe on tequila, Finger Man by Raymond Chandler.
Colonial1.1 Purveyor of Obscurity from The Marvelous River City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Purveyor of Obscurity
#25: Feb 17th 2012 at 7:34:47 AM

Any possible way to donate more in one sitting?

"He could not know it. For it was not all a joke."

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