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So what exactly is a trope anyway?

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Macbeth debonnair from Alba Since: Jan, 2012
debonnair
#1: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:25:40 PM

I've been a passive reader of the wiki for a couple years, and despite the fact that an article explaining what a Trope is exists I'm still kind of confused as to what this wiki's definition of a trope is supposed to be.

So basically a trope is like a metaphor in that the author uses one thing to represent something else, right? A trope is a recurring symbol through out not only a story, but also through many stories, throughout fiction, right?

I'm thinking of the Damsel in Distress, because it is the archetypical archetype (har har). The Damsel in Distress symbolizes a goal for the hero, and her love or marriage represents a reward for the hero's success. We can easily perceive problems with using the Damsel in Distress archetype because she is built for the benefit of the hero and not to be an independent character. A story that plays the Damsel in Distress straight makes the implication that women exist for the benefit of men and are not independent individual people.

The presence of this symbol inspires thought, theory and criticism—a myriad of academic literature has been produced on the topic of the Damsel in Distress. The Damsel in Distress is definitely something that can be thoroughly discussed and examined in an encylopedia article, and in fact it already has.

So that's how I understand tropes in theory. In practice, I have also seen something else, for example, in tropes like Cat Girl. The description doesn't seem to serve a purpose besides describing what cat girls look like, and the examples are only a list of cat girls that have occurred in fiction.

So what makes catgirl a trope? Like Damsel in Distress, it's something that many authors use in their fiction. Unlike Damsel in Distress, being a catgirl on her own doesn't seem to make a character a representation of any idea—she's just a person with cat ears and a cat tail. I see a what, but I don't see a why.

So a trope is just something that appears in fiction?

edited 29th Jan '12 12:26:04 PM by Macbeth

shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#2: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:29:02 PM

At it's very core a trope is a pattern in fiction that has meaning, even if that meaning is just ways in which the work diverges from reality.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Macbeth debonnair from Alba Since: Jan, 2012
debonnair
#3: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:29:59 PM

Yeah, that's what I think it is supposed to be.

But what is the meaning in cat girl itself?

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#4: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:32:16 PM

Catgirls are common in fiction, because cats themselves are delicate, clever and graceful creatures. So, giving women more feline qualities in turn makes them more graceful and clever. Also, characters like Catwoman use purring or crawling on all fours as sexual theming. There's also the parallel between a woman's long nails and a cat's claws.

To delve deeper, there's also a Fetish Fuel component to it. Take Felicia from Darkstalkers. Cats (and other animals) don't wear clothes, so this gives you an excuse to have a character that is an Innocent Fanservice Girl and functionally naked or dressed in a Fur Bikini. Even Marvel Comics uses this quite often. There is an entire fandom centered around sexual portrayals of animal men and women, and cat girls are common because of it. In Japan, a catgirl is often combined with Moe, because in addition to all of the above, cats are cute, and in Japan cute is a cultural phenomenon.

edited 29th Jan '12 12:34:37 PM by KingZeal

Macbeth debonnair from Alba Since: Jan, 2012
debonnair
#5: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:52:54 PM

Now I think we might be getting onto something.

So the trope shouldn't really be "there are women with cat ears in fiction" but "cat-themed women are used in fiction to represent the idea that women are perceived as having the grace of a cat" and having the actual physiological qualities of a cat is just one way of doing that.

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#6: Jan 29th 2012 at 12:53:32 PM

Yes, although that is a simplification.

Hydronix I'm an Irene! from TV Tropes Since: Apr, 2010
I'm an Irene!
#7: Jan 29th 2012 at 1:05:30 PM

Cat Girl already has a Trope Repair Discussion, so you could check that thread and perhaps add more to help it become more notable.

I agree it's kind of not super notable, but then again, none of the "Everything's better with" stuff. Somewhat debatable.

Anyway, for a Trope itself, it's something notable that helps tell the story or is a specific character trait.

edited 29th Jan '12 1:08:12 PM by Hydronix

Quest 64 thread
LordGro (Old as dirt)
#8: Jan 29th 2012 at 1:37:34 PM

I think you are wrong in your definition that a trope is a "symbol":

like a metaphor in that the author uses one thing to represent something else
A trope in itself isn't a symbol. It may suggest specific connotations to the audience that are not spelled out, but that doesn't mean it 'represents something else'.

edited 29th Jan '12 1:37:47 PM by LordGro

Jimmmyman10 cannot into space from polan Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
cannot into space
#9: Jan 29th 2012 at 1:48:42 PM

This thread should be in Trope Talk.

Go play Kentucky Route Zero. Now.
troacctid (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#10: Jan 29th 2012 at 1:55:48 PM

Tropes aren't symbols, per se; they're patterns and conventions. They represent certain things to the audience and serve a purpose in the narrative. Plummet Perspective doesn't have any innate meaning or symbolism behind it—it's just an effective technique for communicating to the viewer that "Woah! That's a long way to fall!"

Of course, we can't always pinpoint the exact narrative purpose of every trope. You've got to cut us some slack on that front—we don't all have Ph.Ds in literature. Identifying a pattern is a lot easier than analyzing a pattern, and we get more Wiki Magic if we're lax about it, so we have a separate Analysis section to discuss the deeper meanings of tropes.

Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#11: Jan 29th 2012 at 2:17:50 PM

Sometimes a trope is a symbol. Sometimes it's a shorthand way of communicating extra information. Sometimes it's simply a thing that creators have used so often and so consistently that it's now something the audience expects to have happen, even though it's not accurate to Real Life.

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#12: Jan 29th 2012 at 6:41:26 PM

I think things authors use frequently that are in accurate is just as good of a definition of trope that doesn't happen in real life. Now, purpose really helps, but sometimes an author does something just for giggles. If one thing in particular makes authors giggle, I'm inclined to call that thing a trope as well.

Fight smart, not fair.
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#13: Jan 30th 2012 at 10:30:55 AM

Tropes are sometimes used deliberately (meant to be symbolic), sometimes they are used incidently (a natural part of the genre) but either way they are building block components that create the story as a whole. That's why The Tropeless Tale is impossible, as once you use something unique it ceases to be unique and becomes a new trope in and of itself.

Bisected8 A casual tief of punk from Her Hackette Cave (Primordial Chaos) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
A casual tief of punk
#14: Feb 1st 2012 at 11:50:13 AM

My personal definition is; "A recurring element in fiction which follows an established pattern stemming from a root cause."

If you think about it every trope has some root cause to it, be it practical (for example conventions that originated from limitations) a reflection of real life or misunderstanding thereof (such as all the "Hollywood So and So" tropes and anything that belongs under Truth in Television), copying (because building on another idea is the whole basis of human ingenuity), convergence (for example Dinosaurs Are Dragons is a fairly simple jump in logic so it happens quite frequently) or a deliberate attempt to stir things up (such as everything on the Playing With Wiki or a Subverted Trope). This is followed by a pattern that comes from it.

I usually use that to work out whether or not something I've noticed is a trope or just a coincidence. It helps with the initial writeup in a YKTTW as well.

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