For those wondering about evidence of white privilege, well:
The Stephen Lawrence case changed race relations in Britain, after a 1999 report by senior judge William Macpherson said the murder had exposed "institutional racism" in the police force and also accused officers of incompetence and a failure of leadership.
Al Jazeera's Jonah Hull said that Eighteen years after Lawrence's death, "problems still remain" in the UK government and policing structure.
"Studies suggest that Blacks are eight times more likely to be stopped and searched 'at random' on the streets than whites," our correspondent said from London.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDhMNcVmGQE
So yes, white privilege does exist and is everywhere. And that's just with regards to law enforcement, and doesn't touch on education inequality, hate crimes, and income inequality.
So how do you end it? Well, as a lowly individual, there isn't much you can do, unfourtounatly. But not being racist is a great start.
edited 19th Jan '12 9:46:07 PM by kyfhv
@Starship:
I'm not sure how you're using "Oreo" since I've heard it used to mean a couple of different things. If you're talking about having biracial parents, then I can sympathize, because I did have more than a few problems growing up with a Hispanic stepfather when I'm blonde and blue-eyed.
If you're talking about it being used as a generic slur, I can also sympathize, because of the aforementioned blonde hair and blue eyes. When people want to insult me, they go for the "dumb blonde" jokes or make assertions that I'm a neo-nazi. Granted, it's not the same because I can dye my hair, but it still pisses me off.
And THAT my friends is how we'll beat this thing. I know I get flack for being all Pollyanna, but I don't give a shit. When we ALL join forces, problems tremble because they know their days are numbered.
I'm inclined to agree. Now, to get other people to realize this too.
"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -DrunkscriblerianI know Scrib you've asked repeatedly what can you actually do to combat this. Black Elephant's (long time no see bro(sis?) experience is a good example.
I've found that the vast majority of whites, like any other ethnic group, are decent hard-working folks who bear nobody any ill will. They simply might be ignorant, like any other ethnic group.
It never happened to me as much, but I have been eyeballed in stores.
One thing I find helps, a joke. Humor is a time-tested way to break the ice on sensitive issues. You can call the shit out, while at the same time leaving room for the person not to feel attacked.
One time, at a newly opened UNIQLO, a noticed a store clerk eyeing me. I simply said to her "Honey, don't worry about me stealing these, I can't fit these skinny jeans anyhow." Upon the shocked look on her face, I laughed out loud. So did she.
Again, many people don't want to be racist. Many don't know. Even if she was eyeing me because she thought I'd try to rip them off, that joke put it on the table that either a) if that's what you're doing, I'm on to you. If not then b) she got a good laugh as did I.
It was an honor@ky: I don't need proof that WP exists as a concept. What I'm asking for...aw fuck it, I've said it often enough.
@Starship, post 100: See, that's what I like to hear. prejudice is prejudice, and its evil shit all the way round.
And one of the reasons I'm asking the questions that I'm asking is; I think the whole issue of racism would be an easier sell to poor whites if it wasn't packaged as "White Privilege". It may be incorrect thinking, but when an impoverished individual who's one step from the street starts hearing about how he or she is supposedly "having it easy" *...well, DG pretty much explained that one. Class anger is rife in America right now; it doesn't take much to set it off, even in the wrong direction.
@Thread: Also, individuals like myself would really like some advice on how we can combat this in our daily lives; I'd rather feel like part of the solution, rather than simply be told that I'm part of the problem by default and there's nothing I can do about it on a day-to-day basis. Thus, the dialogue I'm engaging in.
And I don't think I'm being unreasonable OR dismissive by asking for that.
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~^ There's an essay somewhere on "The Pervocracy" about why the author of same refuses to use the word "privilege." I'll see if I can track it down.
Edit: On a related site
, but by the same author.
edited 19th Jan '12 9:54:33 PM by feotakahari
That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awfuledited 19th Jan '12 9:55:25 PM by kyfhv
Hey Ninja! How's Nevada?
Another suggestion as to what can the individual do, I point you to Brooklyn, NY, USA 1947. Jackie Robinson's first season as the first black baseball player in the modern era had him facing serious, SERIOUS, like put you in an institution abuse. Philadelphia was a particularly racially abusive city.
One day, teammate Herman "Pee Wee" Reese simply walked out during batting practice and put his arm around Robinson. Some Philly fans were shocked silent, some mumbled, some got even more pissed.
But that wordless gesture helped define Crowning Moment Of Awesome / Crowning Moment Of Heartwarming for the next half century.
It was an honor@feo: Excellent. I like this
Any word that requires this much explaining to not be insulting and untrue is not an awesome word. It shouldn’t take three pages and a bibliography to explain why you didn’t just say “shut up, rich boy” to someone who’s actually quite poor.
And this
@ky: You're conflating what I'm freely admitting exists as a concept with what I'm scratching my head on how to identify in my individual life. I've repeatedly said I'm of two minds on the subject, please stop doing that.
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~@Cats: Some people don't like announcing to the world that "Hey, I'm a klutz and hurt myself!" so they want bandages that match their skin.
However, it's the taken the same way as how Crayola used to have a "flesh" colored crayon that was decidedly Caucasian. I think that little things like that are types of unaware racism. The stuff you don't really think about.
"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -DrunkscriblerianNormally I use bandaids for paper cuts, and considering I work as a paper-shuffler, so papercuts don't seem like they're actually caused by klutziness...
So only white people want to hide the fact that they're a klutz and hurt themselves?
You know how Crayola released a pack of crayons with all different skin tones? They should do that with bandaids. Then nobody could complain, and the bandaid company gets more money from people who don't want to use bandaids that don't match their skin tone.
Everyone wins!
edited 19th Jan '12 10:05:53 PM by ohsointocats
Okay, so it seems what we've got so far here is, White's have privilege. Several whites, like our cool duo Scrib and his Girlfriend, are saying they are white without privilege.
So let's formally acknowledge that not all whites are part of this privileged set-up, nor are they party to it in deed or lack therof. Let's also acknowledge that this doesn't change the basic prevalence of the statement.
Also, Girlfriend - "Oreo" - n: a disparaging term for a person of Black descent who does not subscribe to Black characteristics of suspicious authenticity. syn: "White bread", "Poser", "House nigger".
It was an honorAnd then Starship won 1 well-deserved Internet.
@"Oreo": Ouch. I knew the term was disparaging but I didn't know it was quite that bad. -makes mental note not to use it ever-
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~
Oh So, I wish they'd stop penalizing people for having the gall to be (GASP!) who they want to be independent of others of their ethnic, religious, national, gender, or class group.
Hon, I could tell you stories. For. Days.
I like sushi. - Of course you do, you're trying to score Asian women. (Me) :O What?!
I like to ski. - Of course you do, you're trying to pick up White women.
I like Star Trek. - Of course you do, it's a white people's show.
I like hip-hop. - No you don't you're just trying to score "Black" points.
edited 19th Jan '12 10:13:35 PM by TheStarshipMaxima
It was an honorGonna be hopping around the thread a bit here:
Wait, that's a contradiction. You don't have to take our word for it, because we have the numbers that back us up.
Ah, I see you're still operating under the "colorblindness" fallacy. Fact is it's NOT as unjust to deny someone a job because they drink Pepsi as it is to deny someone a job because they're black, because the Pepsi-drinker has not suffered the past and current injustices that the black person has. Including especially the fact that everyone else is ALSO discriminating against the black guy.
In fact, despite what you say, you seem to think that racism is the evil in and of itself. It's not. The problem is that people are worse off because of the color of their skin. Treating people unequally isn't important, it's the EFFECTS on those people that are important. Which is why it's actually quite moral to give preferential treatment to non-white people: doing that actually makes people MORE equal because white people start out at a better position.
If you're refereeing a race and you notice the shape of the track gives some racers an advantage, it's not unfair to give the other racers a head start. That's actually making the race MORE fair. The UNFAIR thing to do would be to ignore the advantage and insist on not giving anyone special treatment. They're ALREADY GETTING special treatment, that's the problem.
For a very long time, I was very bitter about this, considering that I failed out of college because I was working and taking classes at the same time, since my scholarships did not go far enough. I felt that the happenstance of my birth was a direct disadvantage to me, and that my life would have been better if I had gotten the few extra scholarships that he's eligible for.
All evidence that I have seen (for example
) indicates that you (or at least, people like you on average) still should've gotten more money, because the scholarships that you can apply for are (implicitly) biased enough towards white people that it balances out the money you lose from not being able to apply for every scholarship.
Someday, we should get together, crack a few beers and swap stories about what its like to be judged on the basis of our outward appearance...and then, after much drinking, write a movie script about it. We could call it, "The Cracker & The Oreo".
It would be heartwarming.
EDIT in response to Starship's EDIT: Oh, I hear you. Apparently I must cook meth in my garage, because I'm a skinny white dude with a big-ass mustache and I like metal. The fact that I don't even have a garage is, apparently, beside the point.
edited 19th Jan '12 10:17:52 PM by drunkscriblerian
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~@Star Ship: What.
That's just...
Really dumb.
(though I can't see how anyone would like skiing or sushi).
@Cats:
Therein lies the racism of it.
@Starship: Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up.
I agree that white privilege is indeed prevalent and a problem in society today, I never meant to dispute it's existence, and I'm sorry if I came off that way to anyone.
Edit: I'm going afk for a bit now, but I'd like to continue this conversation later. It's been enlightening and it's nice to see someone with a reasonable counter-argument to my stance. Usually the most I get is a flat "You're wrong, and that's a terrible racist argument!"
edited 19th Jan '12 10:25:25 PM by DrunkGirlfriend
"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
What she said, regarding White Privilege as a concept vs. its presence in an individual's daily life. And in large measure the edit too.
edited 19th Jan '12 10:27:34 PM by drunkscriblerian
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~It would be heartwarming.
Scrib and Starship enter a bar. The bartender comes to take their order.
Bartender: Ah. So which of you is Crockett and which is Tubbs? (Scrib and Starship shoot her a look that says they've heard it a hundred times and it stopped being funny after the 3rd) Okay then. I'll be back with a drink menu.
The two of them notice two beautiful women. One's white one's black. They both walk over. As luck would have it the white woman talks to Starship, while the black one talks to Scriblerian. All is going well, then suddenly simultaneously both women get upset.
Beautiful white woman: (throws drink in Starship's face) You were looking at my tits weren't you?!!
Starship Maxima: What?! No!
BWW: Yes you were. All you black people are alike, thinking about sex.
Starhip: (draws a deep breath and wipes the drink off his face and shirt) I was looking at the aquamarine pendant you were wearing. I thought it was nice since my mother is also a March birthday.
BWW is stunned silent. Meanwhile
Beautiful black woman: (notices Scriblerian staring at her) What's the matter? (Scriblerian looks confused) Oh, I get it. Can't handle my afro huh? Wish I'd tame that bush?? Why don't you get yourself one of thse straight-haired bitches! Fucking cracker!
Is about to throw drink in Scriblerian's face but he grabs her hand.
Scriblerian: I was totally looking at your afro.
BBW struggles. Scriblerian pulls her close to whisper in her ear.
Scriblerian: You look like Pam Grier with that afro. You might be the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. (the beautiful black woman is stunned silent)
An hour later Starship is heading uptown with the white lady while Scriblerian and his Pam Grier-like model go to check out the Castle Geekhaven. Scriblerian laughs to himself when he notices Starship has texted him a high-five.
edited 19th Jan '12 10:32:42 PM by TheStarshipMaxima
It was an honor@Starship: ![]()
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Another Internet for the man! Someone serve him an Internet, goddamn it!
A friend of mine once said that "life is humor, enjoyment revolves around getting the joke". I can't say that he's wrong, really.
edited 19th Jan '12 10:35:47 PM by drunkscriblerian
If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~

Point me to anti-minority racism currently on the books, then.
Hail Martin Septim!