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NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
KnightofLsama Since: Sep, 2010
#202: Jul 28th 2012 at 4:39:53 PM

[up] Now let's be fair. He made it out of Troy and 15 (16?) Sharpe telemovies with his skin intact (mostly).

edited 28th Jul '12 4:40:33 PM by KnightofLsama

Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#203: Jul 28th 2012 at 5:37:27 PM

Ya know, reading The Dresden Files made me believe that Jim Butcher wasn't particularly skilled at writing romance. But Kitai and Tavi's relationship, especially the development in First Lord's Fury, has definitely changed my mind about that. I guess Harry's just not very good at romance.

Kitai is such an odd character to me. If you listed out her traits or tried to describe her on paper, I would think she was exactly the sort of character I dislike. But instead she's amongst my favorite characters. Same goes for Doroga. One of my few complaints for the series is that it doesn't have enough Doroga in it.

Btw, the Alerans just unleashed their Field of Fire on the Vord, and it seems to be implying that Ehren is dead or dying. I REALLY, REALLY hope not, Ehren is one of my favorites. I feel a special kinship with him since we share the same name, lol.

Fight. Struggle. Endure. Suffer. LIVE.
NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#204: Jul 28th 2012 at 5:58:59 PM

Your real name is Ehren? He's my favorite character.

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Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#205: Jul 28th 2012 at 6:11:50 PM

It's Aaron, but I pronounce them exactly the same, so close enough...

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3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#206: Jul 28th 2012 at 6:21:33 PM

hmmm, I pronounce it more like the german wort "ehren" (to honor something/someone, ˈeːʀən'), but thats YMMV either way...

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NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#207: Jul 28th 2012 at 6:35:22 PM

Again, Spanish background strikes. I read it exactly as wwritten.

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syvaris Since: Dec, 2009
#208: Jul 29th 2012 at 7:16:38 AM

@Kitai-her and Isana's discussion in Captain's Fury is one of my favorite in the entire series.

Plus you know, "he's good with his mouth" is one of my favorite awkward lines ever.

You will never love a women as much as George Lucas hates his fans.
Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#209: Jul 29th 2012 at 3:26:06 PM

First Lord's Fury spoilers: Yep, Ehren died. Crassus is incapacitated as well and hating Tavi and Max may be out of commission. I guess this is the darkest moment before the end.

Fight. Struggle. Endure. Suffer. LIVE.
Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#210: Jul 30th 2012 at 11:44:21 AM

More First Lord's Fury spoilers: And it turns out the rumors of Ehren's demise were grossly exaggerated. I should have known, Butcher almost never kills off good characters. While I will admit that Ehren, a small man with nearly no furycrafting power, managing to successfully assassinate the FIRST LORD himself is undeniably badass, I think it was an utterly moronic move. At this point in time, the Alerans are fighting a war of extinction, and there is almost no way that their race is going to survive. And yet Ehren chose to kill off the single most powerful crafter on their side, a man who also makes a disproportionately large positive effect on the morale of his people. Yes, he committed enough atrocities that he deserves to die. But throwing him away before the final battle of mankind is the stupidest thing that could have been done. I completely believe Ehren that the orders came from Gaius Sextus, it absolutely reeks of his influence. Sextus's problem is that he never paid enough attention to the big picture. He focused almost exclusively on maintaining his own power base and annihilating any threats to his regime. When you get down to it, he and Attis were pretty much the same.

It's even more odd to me that it was decided that Attis needed to die, when Captain Demos continues to be a complete Karma Houdini, and Fidelias has been more or less forgiven for his actions. Btw, I also got to give out a big facepalm to Isana during the attempted Queen assassination. All of the High Lords were fighting the Queen, this was the do-or-die-moment, there was never going to be another chance this good. And yet she just sits there on her ass, apparently forgetting that Araris is right there ready to go if she just releases him. She also had a sword and her own furcraft, sure she's not a fighter, but if the Queen survived she was going to die anyway, she has no excuse for not joining in the battle.

edited 30th Jul '12 11:44:39 AM by Bluespade

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Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#211: Jul 30th 2012 at 5:18:23 PM

This thread sure is dead. Anyway, I finished First Lord's Fury. It was wonderful, a very nice epic cathartic conclusion to the series. I have to admit, though, that I didn't enjoy it as much as most of the books in the series. The Vord just don't make all that interesting villains.

I loved seeing all of the plans for the future at the end. It's too bad the Vord in Canea are going to come and kill everyone. Considering how they're are going to be spending the next fifty years at least recovering from the damage caused by the Vord, while the other Vord host simply grows and grows, I can't imagine any possible way they can expect to survive. Especially since the Vord have likely already spread to other continents as well.

There was a big major plot hole at the end, though, which I find a bit odd considering how good the writing was elsewhere, so I believe I may have simply overlooked something. Tavi says that he doesn't have the power to bind Garados and Thana to him. The Vord Queen says that if they are released from her control, they will rampage and kill everything half across the continent. Out of desperation, Tavi chooses to release them anyway, and they start rampaging.... and are never mentioned again. How exactly did everyone in the Calderon valley survive the Great Furies attacks, and how did they manage to calm them down again?

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MasterGhandalf Since: Jul, 2009
#212: Jul 30th 2012 at 5:22:31 PM

[up]I believe that there's a blink-and-you'll-miss-it bit where it's established that Alera and Kitai managed to get Garados and Thana calmed down.

About the Canean Vord remember that the Vord Queen "fixed" her offspring queens so that they'd be sterile. There were two queens on the Canean continent, and Tavi and co. killed one. That means that while there's a really massive horde of Vord building over there, they've only got and will only ever have one Queen, which would make managing a horde that size and pain and could be a nice Achilles' Heel for the heroes' descendants to exploit. On that note, anyone notice if it was ever mentioned how long a Vord Queen lives?

Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#213: Jul 30th 2012 at 5:27:43 PM

The horde in Alera only had one Queen as well, and she managed to nearly wipe out their whole society. AND she suffered from emotional trauma that caused her to make a lot of stupid decisions. The coldly logical Queen of Canea is likely to be a more dangerous opponent.

Btw, I went and added Karma Houdini to the trope page for Captain Demos.

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MasterGhandalf Since: Jul, 2009
#214: Jul 30th 2012 at 5:32:11 PM

[up] The Canean Queen can't Furycraft- at least, her "sister" that Tavi and co. killed clearly couldn't, and the implication is that those two were functionally identical- though, and she's got a lot more minions to herd around, which gives her a numerical advantage but also means she's got a lot more variables to juggle.

NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#215: Jul 30th 2012 at 6:16:13 PM

The Aleran Queen was way more of a threat. And I need to re-read FLF before commenting on your impressions (I'm re-reading Princeps' now).

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NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#216: Aug 8th 2012 at 5:41:22 PM

Been re-reading. The Canean Queen doesn't understand Alerans, can't furycraft and can't breed. A simple assassination mission would suffice.


Also, I don't particularly see what's so hideous about Demos. Yeah, he's a slaver and a pirate. But slaving's technically legal, Tavi made him quit, and he's saved the main crew's lives more than once, plus, he's the most capable sailor in the series. Don't see why he should be hanged or something, particularly when it's wartime. Hey, if Fidelias got away...

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Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#217: Aug 8th 2012 at 5:44:56 PM

Just because the Queen can't furycraft now doesn't mean she can't learn.

As for Demos, because he's partially responsible for the annihilation of Canea and the loss of most of Alera. He smuggled the Vord Queen out of Alera and into Canea, allowing her to regain her strength, breed, and eventually return to Alera. He also acted as a go between to help Sarl and Kalare sync up their attacks. So basically, he has the blood of millions on his hands. And he ain't the slightest bit remorseful about it.

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NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#218: Aug 8th 2012 at 6:03:36 PM

Well, If you're adding up the factors, Tavi and Kitai awakened the Mama Queen. And that's why she can craft (she had their blood), so no risk of the remaining queen learning.

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Bluespade from Fort Worth, Texas Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
#219: Aug 8th 2012 at 6:08:39 PM

True, but I take intention and remorse into account. Tavi and Kitai had no clue that they were waking the Queen or that doing so would actually be dangerous. They most certainly regretted it.

Demos, on the other hand knowingly aided Sarl and the Queen escape after they attempted to assassinate the First Lord. He then helped Sarl coordinate with Kalare, despite being fully aware that he was working to help a foreign invasion that would result in a huge loss of life as well as a civil war perpetrated by a egotistical madman which, again, was going to cause huge amounts of death and destruction. Demos shows no regret for his actions. Oh, and he kidnapped all those women and kids from that island and sold them into slavery (while slavery may be legal, kidnapping ordinary people and forcing them into it is not). And yes, I'm aware he was doing it to save them from the invading Canim...but he could have just let them go instead of enslaving them.

Tavi and Kitai are responsible for a horrible accident. Demos did what he did under his own power, for purely selfish reasons.

edited 8th Aug '12 6:09:28 PM by Bluespade

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NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#220: Aug 8th 2012 at 6:38:17 PM

Yup, he's an asshole. But for some reason, I can't really dislike him. Maybe because of his "just business" attitude.

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theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#221: Aug 8th 2012 at 7:09:45 PM

Still reading Cursor's Fury. Fade seems to have a sort of Honor Before Reason thing going on at the moment, and I'm actually reading in big enough gaps in time that I'd forgotten who Ehren was before I finally remembered.

NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#223: Aug 8th 2012 at 8:39:31 PM

Yeah, the problem is that I'm on my laptop too much to really read it unless it's on a rather long car trip, or someplace that I'll be for a while and don't bring anything else.

NLK Mo A Since: May, 2010
#224: Aug 8th 2012 at 8:51:16 PM

I recommend you get a Kindle. Way worth the price.

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theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#225: Aug 8th 2012 at 9:07:32 PM

I...have it on my Kindle.

As I said before, I just don't use it except on trips XD


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