TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

How important are villains to you?

Go To

AssumeAVirtue 30 Watts of Madness from Hamilton, ON Since: Jan, 2001
30 Watts of Madness
#26: Jan 17th 2012 at 1:25:04 PM

More important than the hero. Die Hard wouldn't be a classic without Hans Gruber, and Air Force One would barely be watchable without Gary Oldman.

"Blundering!" - Eye Weekly
CommanderObvious intellectual rapist from Unmei no Itaru Basho Since: Jul, 2011
intellectual rapist
#27: Jan 17th 2012 at 2:39:38 PM

i watch a lot of works without villains these days
so i feel that the main characters and the side characters are the more important
villains may be entertaining but life doesnt work like that

This level of trolling is reasonable for Commander Obvious. What do you think of this, everyone?
juancarlos Faith in the self. Since: Mar, 2012
Faith in the self.
#28: Jan 17th 2012 at 2:55:33 PM

More important than the hero. Die Hard wouldn't be a classic without Hans Gruber

I don't think so, personally. I think it's both Mc Clane and Gruber and their interactions what make the movie. It's a perfect antagonism, as they're both polar opposites, yet they share the same characteristics (Resourceful, intelligent men who are willing to do anything to beat the other as long as it benefits them and fits their moral code)

And that's pretty much how I feel about villains, really. A good villain is a villain that makes a hero fight to their hardest capabilities till they win or lose. Same way a good hero is one that convinces us that the villain isn't being an idiot for not winning. In other words, they both have to balance each other and provide an spectacle for us to watch/read/play/whatever

edited 17th Jan '12 3:04:27 PM by juancarlos

"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.
drunkscriblerian Street Writing Man from Castle Geekhaven Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: In season
Street Writing Man
#29: Jan 17th 2012 at 3:00:30 PM

[up]Juan pretty much said what I was going to say; a good story is a balancing act between hero and villain.

If I were to write some of the strange things that come under my eyes they would not be believed. ~Cora M. Strayer~
gingerninja666 SCH-NEIGH-ZEL from Aboard The Damocles Since: Aug, 2009
SCH-NEIGH-ZEL
#30: Jan 17th 2012 at 3:03:31 PM

[up][up] But I don't WANT to think that the villain is an idiot sad

"Contests fought between two masters are decided instantly. An invisible battle is now raging between the two of them." Lulu vs Schneizel
juancarlos Faith in the self. Since: Mar, 2012
Faith in the self.
#31: Jan 17th 2012 at 3:04:13 PM

Erm, there's a missing negative there. >_>

"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.
gingerninja666 SCH-NEIGH-ZEL from Aboard The Damocles Since: Aug, 2009
SCH-NEIGH-ZEL
#32: Jan 17th 2012 at 3:05:39 PM

[up] Oh, I see it now! [lol] I hate reading negatives XD

sorry

edited 17th Jan '12 3:05:49 PM by gingerninja666

"Contests fought between two masters are decided instantly. An invisible battle is now raging between the two of them." Lulu vs Schneizel
BobbyG vigilantly taxonomish from England Since: Jan, 2001
vigilantly taxonomish
#33: Jan 17th 2012 at 3:17:14 PM

I would say I like well-written villains, but I use the term fairly loosely; a proper evil baddie can be great fun, but I would also count villainous protagonists and not-particularly-villainous antagonists so long as they're interesting characters.

A lot of my favourite works don't have unambiguously villainous characters, so I don't think they're essential.

Welcome To TV Tropes | How To Write An Example | Text Formatting Rules | List Of Shows That Need Summary | TV Tropes Forum | Know The Staff
gingerninja666 SCH-NEIGH-ZEL from Aboard The Damocles Since: Aug, 2009
SCH-NEIGH-ZEL
#34: May 3rd 2012 at 3:36:57 AM

Great, my villain obsession is pissing off the rest of the forum. I can't help it Dammit! No matter how often people try to shove it down my throat, Villains are always my favourite element in any media. yet when I ask for reccomendations, people continuously offer me things then go on about how cool the heroes are.

I'm going into Anagonist withdrawl, I swear

"Contests fought between two masters are decided instantly. An invisible battle is now raging between the two of them." Lulu vs Schneizel
Susanoo Since: Jul, 2012
#35: May 3rd 2012 at 6:31:04 AM

To me, it is important that a villain is believable. He or she should be more than a Saturday morning cartoon villain, with a believable motivation, and also should not be dumb and hence non-threatening. OTOH, I do firmly believe villains exist only for the sake of heroes. Villaisn need to be believable and competent not in their own right, but so that they are a believable foil to the hero. The problem I see with too much focus on villains is that we then reach such phenomena as Draco in Leather Pants etc., and that's usually a bad thing IMO.

OrionAurora Constellation from Andromeda Galaxy Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Constellation
#36: May 3rd 2012 at 7:39:37 AM

I figured this was your thread Ginger.tongue

Anyway, there are at least 2 things that bug me about villains. The first is villains being evil for no justified reason. I'm talking about "I'm evil just because I want to be" type of villain. Good and evil isn't a black and white thing in my mind. As long as there is some level of justification, I usually won't get bogged by the villain's motives.

The second bug of mine is when the villain obtains the macguffin of power and looses it hours after gaining it.

We are all made of star stuff. Very, very weird star stuff.
OrangeSpider Must Keep The Web Intact from Ursalia Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Must Keep The Web Intact
#37: May 3rd 2012 at 11:11:52 AM

Well, if that means anything, most of the time, in any movies whatsoever, I end up Rooting for the Empire.

Because devil's advocate and all that stuff.

I also like variety in my villains. Well-Intentioned Extremist is all fine and dandy to me; so Is the Complete Monster who does it For the Evulz and/or because he simply can.

...

Haven't put so many tropes in a post in a long time.

edited 3rd May '12 11:13:30 AM by OrangeSpider

The Great Northern Threadkill.
Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#38: May 3rd 2012 at 3:16:55 PM

But I don't WANT to think that the villain is an idiot

Idiot villains can work if done properly. Like, Voldemort was basically a prodigy with magic who happened to stumble on a wide variety of very powerful spells and resources that backed him up really well and complemented his natural affinities, but his methods were so needlessly bombastic and symbolic that they got figured out and undone by high schoolers, and he left himself so wide open he nearly got impaled with a sword before Harry could even get to him.

I mean, imagine how the seventh book would've gone if instead of the Horcruxes all being artifacts of very powerful ancient figures or sentimental bits of his own childhood hidden in places with significance to his upbringing, they were like...rocks and gum wrappers casually dropped into the foundational concrete beds of arbitrary London skyscrapers, or a banana peel launched to the moon or something? Or if he'd had the good sense to let one of his minions kill Harry at one of any of a number of previous junctures instead of the whole IT MUST BE ME BECAUSE POETIC?

And yet he's an iconic villain because he hit all the notes he was supposed to, and hit them damn well. He was a hilariously powerful sociopath who was intimidating as fuck and knew exactly how to make you shit yourself at any given moment, and even putting together a plan to confront the guy took a very smart man the better part of Harry's life.

edited 3rd May '12 3:30:42 PM by Pykrete

Add Post

Total posts: 38
Top