TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Anime/Yu Yu Hakusho [Revived]

Go To

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#626: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:16:50 PM

No, I'm not. I'm talking about the same fight, in the anime Elder Toguro reveals that he stayed below the tiles until the betting was closed so he could rig the odds and get rich off it.

Now, that line is anime only, but so is the line about him liquefying himself to avoid certain death - neither are mentioned in the manga, he simply just survives Kuwabara's technique, suggesting that Kuwabara does not have the means to kill him.

It's also extremely simplistic to say "Kuwabara won so he's stronger" - he won by taking Elder by surprise, who even said himself he had been careless. He wasn't brute forcing Toguro at all, and pretty well got his ass kicked head on.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#627: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:23:33 PM

Elder Toguro couldn't even hurt Kuwabara once he powered up. His tendrils literally couldn't pierce his skin. He was also almost disintegrated by the Spirit Flyswatter, it destroyed a lot of his body. Kuwabara TOTALLY won that fight legit, he crushed Elder Toguro.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 4:24:31 AM

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#628: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:40:55 PM

If Elder Toguro chose to throw the fight, it's impossible to say he won it legit. He doesn't have a means to defeat Elder Toguro either.

And you're wrong about Toguro being unable to pierce his skin. When Kuwabara powers up, he stops one attack that way, and Elder Toguro is able to pierce him again after that, then Kuwabara does his sneak attack.

Destroying "a lot" of his body doesn't mean anything when he can just regenerate the rest...

Edited by Saiga on Jun 18th 2021 at 4:41:24 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#629: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:46:11 PM

I don't recall hearing anything about Elder Toguro throwing the fight?

Where was this said?

One Strip! One Strip!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#630: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:52:04 PM

When Elder Toguro appears again, he says he waited below the tiles until the betting was closed before re-appearing.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#631: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:55:38 PM

It takes a while for Toguro to regenerate, and he hadn't by the time he came back up. Kuwabara's "sneak attack" used the exact same tunnel Toguro had previously used for a sneak attack against him, so it's stupid to hold that against Kuwabara like he cheated or anything. And it was the double-tap with the Spirit Flyswatter that won the fight and nearly killed Toguro.

Toguro absolutely did not throw that fight, Kuwabara beat him handily, much more so than anyone on Team Urameshi beat their own opponents barring Hiei.

[up]That doesn't mean he threw, that just means he decided to stay down rather than die, which was the only way for Kuwabara to beat him and Kuwabara would have done so if he had gotten back up.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 4:57:08 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#632: Jun 18th 2021 at 4:59:25 PM

Elder Toguro didn't throw the fight. He lost the fight, but survived, and chose to hide under the stage so he could work together later with his brother.

There's zero indication that, say, he got wrecked by the spirit flyswatter on purpose.

The comparison I would give is say, Cell in DBZ. He legitimately got into trouble with 16, and so there was a point where instead of coming back up to continue the fight, he sneaked around to use the appearance of him being destroyed to nab 17. While when he does pop up seemingly unharmed, there isn't indication that we was letting 16 win. He just used a bad situation to his advantage.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jun 18th 2021 at 5:01:03 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#633: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:02:40 PM

Yeah, Toguro could have gotten back up and continued the fight, but he knew he was beat. Kuwabara could have just killed him with the Spirit Flyswatter, and kept hitting him until he was gone. Toguro accepted defeat because he wanted to live.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#634: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:10:52 PM

Yeah. That sounds right.

Kuwarbara either loses, or win but fails to kill his enemy.

The only time he failed and someone threw a fight is because Toguro 1 and Toguro 2 took a dive, but that's the only time someone deliberately let him win.

One Strip! One Strip!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#635: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:17:06 PM

Rewatching some episodes of the Dark Tournament anime, the pacing is HORRIBLE. There's no reason the Team Ichigaki fight needed to take up three episodes, it would have been better with two, or even handled in one episode. Kurama vs the first two of the ninja team REALLY should have been just one episode, there's no excuse for padding them out into two.

AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#636: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:30:01 PM

I gotta say. I love you man, but I am kind of getting sick of pacing talk. People are NEVER happy with the pacing of any anime. It either is too fast or too slow. I wish these people (Not you mind you) just accepted that anime just isnt their thing and kept quiet. I for one dont really enjoy manga (SAVE a few exceptions) but I dont parade that around.

Edited by AegisP on Jun 18th 2021 at 5:34:10 AM

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#637: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:33:41 PM

I did like that the Dark Tournament treated every single team as effectively its own mini-arc, with its own stakes, character issues and conclusions. In this arc, Kurama is killing himself trying to hold out for the team since half of them are unable to fight, in this arc helpless humans are being used by an evil demon as weapons and Kuwabara is the only one who wants to save rather than kill them, in this arc each member of the team (except Kuwabara who's a moron this time) fights a member who counters their typical technique or personality, etc.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#638: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:41:44 PM

[up][up]I'm just saying that I see how the anime managed not to include any filler, by going for that classic DBZ/modern One Piece pacing. Having read the manga first, it's jarring to see half a chapter padded out into 20 minutes. In the manga, the Hiei vs Bui fight is one chapter. In the anime they stretched it into two episodes with half an episode dedicated to Hiei just summoning the Dragon of the Darkness Flame.

[up]It makes sense to divide each team fight into its own mini-arc, my problem stretching out the individual fights into their own episodes when some would flow better put into one. Like, there's no reason Genkai vs Suzuki needed to be a full episode with Suzuki just monologuing for the first half. It's meant to be a quick gag fight, they ruined the joke by stretching it out.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 5:43:39 AM

AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#639: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:46:54 PM

Ok that has to be infuriating. You win this one.

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#640: Jun 18th 2021 at 5:50:14 PM

Ah, yeah. Classic anime padding.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#641: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:13:41 PM

Kurama vs Toya, the ice ninja, is literally like four moves in the manga. Toya attacks him, Kurama dodges, Toya attacks him with a different move, and Kurama beats him with the plant-counter. It's super-fast, and the anime pads it out into one entire episode. I guess you can say Toya didn't live up to his hype and deserved more screentime, but even dedicating half an episode to this fight would be giving it extra screentime, much less a full episode.

Also, I can't stand the announcers and Koenma. They're fine in small doses, but it feels like a third of the dialogue in each episode is the announcers repeating what we just saw and Koenma doing random bullshit, both of which were not in the manga. The announcers existed, but they didn't do that much talking, and Koenma stayed in human form the entire time.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 6:17:29 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#642: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:22:27 PM

The series does that a lot. The fight between Yusuke and Hiei is padded to the point of being kind of funny: the anime turns something that was nearly a curbstomp into something that almsot seems like a fair fight.

It's more or less the reason animes always do that, at least with fights. A lot of manga fights in a lot of series are quick battles - even Single Stroke Battles - that are won less on long winded fights and more on fast force of will. Even Dragonball, with its plethora of curbstombs, turns most of its curbstomps into a lengthy fights for spectacle's sake. Sometimes it's a decent idea, sometimes it's not because the ruthless quickness is part of the point (my gripe about the anime version of Cell vs Gohan).

AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#643: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:22:30 PM

I know its infuriating but this has a reason. See,I heard the manga had some earlier chapters about Yusuke doing good deeds as a spirit and there were lots of comedy chapters the manga skipped. It skipped VOLUMES of it so its only natural that the anime had to make up for it.

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#644: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:26:42 PM

Which is dumb. The anime should have just adapted the "Yusuke as a ghost" chapters instead of rushing through them to get to Yusuke being a Spirit Detective. Even if it only added 6-10 more episodes, it would have given them a bit more time to compress the rest of the show a little bit more.

I will say that one place where the anime's expansions were good was the Three Kings arc, which is so short that even anime watchers complain about its length, unaware that most of the fights in the arc were totally original.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 6:26:57 AM

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#645: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:27:43 PM

I’m wondering if the live action adaptation will focus on those lighter chapters before diving head first into Spirit Detective stories.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#646: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:33:20 PM

I wouldn't bet on it. If the episodes are 50 minutes long each, I could see them dedicating the entirety of Yusuke being a ghost in one episode. And then the whole Sacred Treasures arc in one episode, and then the Genkai Tournament in two, and then the Four Beasts in 3 episodes and the Rescue Yukina arc in two.

I bet they'll cover the entire Spirit Detective Saga in one season, then the Dark Tournament in season 2, then Chapter Black in season 3, then 3 Kings (with all of the anime-original content and manga chapters at the end) in season 4. Assuming they even get past Season 1.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jun 18th 2021 at 6:33:43 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#647: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:54:50 PM

I bet they'll cover the entire Spirit Detective Saga in one season, then the Dark Tournament in season 2, then Chapter Black in season 3, then 3 Kings (with all of the anime-original content and manga chapters at the end) in season 4. Assuming they even get past Season 1.

Yeah, that makes sense. Beginning a season with Rescue Yukina and ending it with Yusuke killing Toguro makes for pretty good seasonal bookends.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#648: Jun 18th 2021 at 6:57:05 PM

Huh? That's not what I said. I think season 1 will end with Rescue Yukina and leave on the cliffhanger of Toguro forcing them to enter the Dark Tournament.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#649: Jun 18th 2021 at 11:55:14 PM

I will disagree with the pacing, at least with the ninja team it was good because yusque team already have a fight and they were cheating, so there was a recurring tension of "will they win?" I remember that being very nail biting(which make the anti climax hilarious).

I'm the only one who though the whole concept of territory was underuse? I feel togadashi want to changes thing up but didn't figure out how.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#650: Jun 19th 2021 at 1:21:25 AM

Yeah, I remember reading something from him where he said that the Chapter Black arc was him copying Jojo poorly. I think that's a bit harsh, the best parts of Chapter Black are easily better than the worst parts of Jojo, but Togashi didn't really take off with the creative gimmick fights until Hunter x Hunter.


Total posts: 863
Top