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Bcom Since: Jun, 2014
#448701: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:16:19 PM

wow, so it wasn't yugoslavia that made him like he is.

Boxen whatever he can Since: Jan, 2013
whatever he can
#448702: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:16:46 PM

it was ~*~plot~*~

dead devotion
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448703: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:17:17 PM

Unrelated to anything, but:

I find it funny that it seems like two of Heavy Rain's main flaws are the exact opposite of each other, in their own ways.

thespacephantom Jamais vu from the smallest church in Saint-Saëns Since: Oct, 2009
Jamais vu
#448704: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:18:00 PM

@pyro:t ell me

UN JOUR JE SERAI DE RETOUR PRÈS DE TOI
Rivux same old me from [a jump to the sky turns to a rider kick] Since: Aug, 2010
same old me
#448706: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:24:29 PM

[cross series] mega man fanart gives me so much life

mario is red, i am green, i try my best, but everyone's mean
Boxen whatever he can Since: Jan, 2013
whatever he can
#448707: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:25:03 PM

it's yelling at me to sign up or shut up

dead devotion
ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448708: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:26:11 PM

it was not

he didnt even know what the hell really happened at yugoslavia

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
Rivux same old me from [a jump to the sky turns to a rider kick] Since: Aug, 2010
same old me
#448709: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:27:10 PM

do you mean to tell me this treasure trove of mega man fanart is unviewable for you

That's A Shame

mario is red, i am green, i try my best, but everyone's mean
foxmccloud4387 Since: Mar, 2011
#448710: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:27:13 PM

He repressed the memories of the destruction he caused.

Boxen whatever he can Since: Jan, 2013
whatever he can
#448711: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:28:31 PM

freud: "tell me, von, about your mother"

dead devotion
ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448712: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:34:52 PM

he didnt do any of the destruction

von has no feelings for his mother

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448713: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:37:11 PM

@Space: Essentially (spoilers of course):

Heavy Rain seems to give the player far too much choice and far too little. Simultaneously.

On the side of "far too much choice" you have both big and little things. On the little side: no-one cares that you can shave. David, no-one cares. They wouldn't care in the movie that you want to create, and they certainly don't care about doing it. Sure, I'm picking on the tutorial here, but this continues throughout Heavy Rain from what I've seen of playthroughs. You can do so much completely irrelevant stuff.

It creates a horrible pacing and tone problem.

Contrast with Until Dawn. You can interact with not a whole lot, but everything you can interact with has some level of importance. A clue, a warning, something that will butterfly so you get that character murdered 3 hours later...

On the major side of things, you have the fact that David Cage, despite what he may say, does not want to give control of the game or its plot to the player. This is his plot, you need to take it SERIOUSLY and he doesn't want the players messing that up.

This leads to some serious dissonance where the player is given "control", but it's a pantomime. The game fights it. Like, a clear example of this is the part where you play as the killer, and you can listen to his thoughts because this is a video game and not once does he think about the fact that "oh yeah I killed those guys" despite having no reason to hide it, and plenty of reason to think about it.

This is the game fighting the player. Fighting the fact that it wants to control the story, rather than have the player "ruining it".

Yet it has to give the player choice and interaction because that's part of what it's selling itself on.

Again, contrast with Until Dawn which is both happy to keep big choices sparse, filling up the space with pre-written dialogue that remains in-character, but when choices do come up, every single one of them matters.

but maybe I'm completely off base it's just something that popped into my mind

thespacephantom Jamais vu from the smallest church in Saint-Saëns Since: Oct, 2009
Jamais vu
#448714: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:49:29 PM

you know what i think

you're pretty much exactly right there

UN JOUR JE SERAI DE RETOUR PRÈS DE TOI
ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448715: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:50:06 PM

oh noy you're completely right

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448716: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:54:46 PM

yay

but yeah this came to mind because I was watching two best friends play until dawn and I just started thinking "why does this work when Heavy Rain did not"?

ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448717: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:56:20 PM

i personally have some qualms with until dawn

but that's just cause how it handles one of its characters

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448718: Sep 12th 2015 at 7:58:32 PM

well I'm watching a playthrough that's only half done

so it could very much drop the ball later on

but so far it seems to be handling itself fairly well

ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448719: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:00:35 PM

oh no, a lot of stuff really does hold up throughout the entire thing

just

certain things kinda don't

and

it doesn't make it worse but there's certain a element of "man, they could have done this part better"

but not in like a bad unfinished way, more like a there was potential here kind of way

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448720: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:02:04 PM

oh yeah, that always sucks as a feeling

just thinking that they somehow missed the mark

ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448721: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:03:46 PM

yeah

when matt and pat get to it, you may feel it

probably not since i think they fucked up already

oh wait, no, looking over it again, it was just a totem

edited 12th Sep '15 8:05:23 PM by ChrissieMcNapkins

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448722: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:07:06 PM

I'll keep an eye out for it, if it does happen then.

ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448723: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:08:58 PM

agh, i wanna say what happens cause

i really do have a lot to say on it but

agggghh enjoy your product ill shut up

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.
ThanatoSeraph ARE WA DARE DA from The Land Down Under Since: Feb, 2012
ARE WA DARE DA
#448724: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:12:42 PM

when matt and patt finish

you can tell me then

I know it can be frustrating to want to say things but you can't because it'll spoil them

edited 12th Sep '15 8:13:06 PM by ThanatoSeraph

ChrissieMcNapkins bruhonetta from the traphouse Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
bruhonetta
#448725: Sep 12th 2015 at 8:12:56 PM

see you in a month

I live in a constant state of fear and misery.

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