HEY GUYS WHAT'S GOING ON IN THIS THRE-
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i'll come back later
"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."alright i'll be more constructive
Ramuf, just one thing.
I understand that you're frustrated with your lack of interaction, however the way you're handling this is stressing as hell. I don't even post in the FG and it stresses me out. I'm sure there are better ways of handling this than making vaguely passive-aggressive comments and making us feel bad.
That's all I can say, though. Since, again, I don't post in the FG, I'm missing out on a large part of this discussion.
edited 26th Sep '14 7:47:05 AM by WackyPancake
"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."Funny how this always happens on a Friday.
@Seer: First and foremost, I'd honestly like an apology. I don't like being straight up blunt like that, but that is what I want. You did not consider anything that I had said, and instead accused me of being ridiculous and lazy.
I'm not trying to accuse you of anything. I'm just trying to say, I've got some problems and you really struck a nerve.
@Jam: Okay, so I was right. I would have appreciated it if you had just told me that instead of keeping it to yourself. I can't improve in a vacuum.
I'm not going to say anything about the getting-interaction part, since if I had tried to interact with you, you wouldn't have wanted to. I had a suspicion you had a beef with me, so there's a direct example of why I'm passive.
I'll start with the easier one: Weird Stuff. I have a very, very pronounced distaste for mind rape and brain fucking and Spooky Shit. It honestly makes me feel like I should stop posting if my character is going to be controlled by someone else. And that's not just you, that's for everyone. That's why I tend to try to steer clear of freaky shit, because I have no material for it.
Yeah, Julie and Tallis aren't happy, and that is by my design. They are not meant to be happy, at least not quickly. They've got issues with each other and everyone else to work out. And now I know that at least one person finds it off-putting, I can take steps to rectify that.
As for their past: the intention is that you are supposed to ask them about it. Neither of them will sit down and say "oh yeah I used to watch giant man-eating serpents smash through cities." But if you see them not react to that, it seems that the logical thing to do is ask "why on earth are you now surprised? This is fucking insane." But hardly anyone does that. If asked, they will answer. It might be perfectly clear and they might be uncomfortable, but they will respond.
There are other things that I'd like to say about this, but I don't think they're as important as this: if you dislike my writing and want to avoid my characters, then do you want to just not interact with me at all, ever? It's fine if you do. I mean, yeah, it'll hurt pretty bad to be cordoned off like that, but I don't want to force you to do something you find displeasing.
@Wacky: That was never, ever my intention. I've said it before and I'll say it again, there is a very definite reason why I get extremely fidgety about being ignored when I'm not feeling good.
And since I tend to be hair trigger in those moments, bad things tend to happen.
It's not exactly an excuse, but it's my best answer.
edited 26th Sep '14 8:02:50 AM by ramuf
I don't have a beef with you personally it was just your writing. And I don't just want to stop interacting with you I want you to improve.
But anyway. I can get you not liking Weird Stuff, but its not someone else controlling your character. Its you having your character react to certain things. But if you still don't want to do that there are better ways of going about not getting involved in that stuff than having your character go "I'm unimpressed." That makes them seem, really inhuman, and unrelatable. You can just tell the other person, I'm not okay with this and just remove your character from the scene.
And I'm of the opinion that its better to show things rather than tell about them. I think a character shouldn't have tons and tons of things in their backstory because the more stuff there is the more it limits what you can actually write. That and we can be told that all this crazy stuff happened in the background but its not the same as actually going through it with the characters.
EDIT:Because I do have something to say about the interaction thing. I am only one of about 26 people currently playing the game. I have my own opinions and they aren't the same as the others. In fact they're often in direct conflict with the other people in the thread. So there might be others who wouldn't mind interacting with your characters. Heck I wouldn't really mind. Like I said most of the reason I haven't tried to interact with them is because of you clamming up like you have.
edited 26th Sep '14 10:25:45 AM by Azure
PM box is Closed, Indefinitely Friend Code: 3368-4181-6850A'ight, I'm back for about two hours.
While it's good that this issue is finally being discussed, I think it would have been better if it was brought up earlier. I know you were giving him a chance to improve, Jam, but he can't conceivably improve if he doesn't know there's a problem, and I do recall him asking if anyone had any issues before. Maybe you weren't there for that or something, but I think we all need to be quicker to bring up issues if they arise. This isn't something I've personally encountered with Ram's characters, so I can't comment either way, but at least it's out in the open now.
I hope I'm not putting words in Ram's mouth or anything, and I'm sorry if I am, but can we cease from making assumptions about him being underhanded or petty or any of that? I will not go into detail, but as he said above, he has some stuff going on, and it's complicated. To put it shortly, he's coming off differently than he's intending to, and there is way the hell less malice in his actions than some of you are assuming.
make it through this year if it kills you yet | 2001-2019Hell, sorry for the doublepost, but let me make that more general:
I think that immediately assuming the worst about someone's actions/intent has been a problem around here lately. I know I've said this before, but it has, and it sucks, because it's kind of dehumanizing. Someone does something weird or troublesome, and the first impulse is to say, "Wow, you're being a scumbag, fucking stop" without bothering to ask why or if something's wrong or any of that.
That's not gonna get anything worthwhile done. People are complex and have a myriad of reasons for doing things.
If there's a problem or it looks like someone's being a jerk, definitely say something, but don't say it in a way that implies "Hey, I know for a fact that you were doing that to be a jerk", because in all honesty, you don't. That person may have been being a jerk, but then again, they may not have even been aware they were coming off in such a way. You don't have to assume the best if it's really a huge problem, but don't assume the worst. I'm pretty sure nobody here is Skeletor or Darth Vader or anything.
This is a recurring thing that happens between several different people, and it depresses me, because it's building all of this distrust and animosity. Yeah, people are gonna rub each other the wrong way, such is life. But measures can be taken to prevent this psychic chafing, and it starts with considering the other guy's humanity. If there's a problem, yes, solve it, but ask why.
Again, might be mistaken, this is my opinion, yadda yadda. Felt I had to say it.
make it through this year if it kills you yet | 2001-2019

Okay. Here we go.
Ram first of all I'm going to echo what Mobile said. I get that some people have made you uncomfortable in the past, but if that happens you're supposed to let them know so they can stop doing that. We're all mature enough, I hope, that you're not going to hurt anyone by doing that. If anything its a bit worse to sit and pretend you like something when you really don't
Additionally if you want interaction, you have to seek it out, by either having your character inject themselves into a situation, or making what they're doing interesting enough to draw attention. Everyone else does this. And quite frankly it wouldn't be fair to the other players if the take away from this is that we should all stop what we're doing and interact with Ram's character. That also would bring back the original problem of you being made uncomfortable.
Secondly I am not sure about anyone else but there have been reasons for me to avoid interacting with Julie or Tallis. I didn't want to bring these up because I thought you were getting better on your own. But since you've now asked I'll go ahead and tell you. `
So similar to Cloud a while back, I don't feel like anything I do or say would affect your characters. Everytime I have Fen talk to them, recently anyway, its always the same. It can never just be a normal conversation. They start to complain about their problems and about how their problems can't be fixed because they're not normal problems they're God Problems. And eventually you just want to stop talking to people like that, because they do nothing but bring you down.
Another reason is this thing you do whenever weird stuff happens. You always have your characters react in the same bored way, or otherwise just have them not be affected by it. And you often use the excuse that they're gods they've lived forever and have seen this stuff a hundred times. But that's all in the background. We haven't actually seen what Julie has been through only sort of told about some of it. Personally I think that kind of attitude only works when you actually show stuff happening to your character. Because that way the audience has sort of been through this with your character and can actually relate to them when they go. "Giant serpent eating the city? Eh."
Aside from those honestly the thing where you've been having your character sit around, and do nothing, and then leaving messages that make it seem like its our fault no one interacted with them has really really ruined my taste for interacting with Julie/Whoever. Moreso than the other two reasons.
edited 26th Sep '14 7:35:18 AM by Azure
PM box is Closed, Indefinitely Friend Code: 3368-4181-6850