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Because, hey, Canada needs some love as well.

Now, then, as a Yank to the Canadians, what has Stephen Harper done as Prime Minister, what were the top parties and how did the general election turn out this year?

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3426: Feb 2nd 2017 at 7:51:48 AM

He probably won't be charged with terrorism, the definition is too narrow. And they've got enough charges to jail him for life.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#3427: Feb 2nd 2017 at 8:29:44 AM

I do think I understand what you mean about the lack of mourning (I mean there was mourning here, several candle light vigils not just in Quebec the day of) but it wasn't quite like say Charlie Hebdo or anything where there was a lot of response from the international community and other than a few things about the victims (I've seen some posts with say their pictures and their occupation and children) there haven't been a lot of that stuff, though I agree well some stuff about how the rising racism and Islamaphobia lead to this there shouldn't be too much of a focus on the shooter lest it glorifies him.

Well besides the response from Trump and Fox News which was pretend the Muslim witness was the suspect after it was clarified he wasn't. But we already know about the current US administration and it's tendencies, makes the world a scarier place.

edited 2nd Feb '17 8:35:57 AM by phantom1

Pseudopartition Screaming Into The Void from The Cretaeceous Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Screaming Into The Void
#3428: Feb 2nd 2017 at 9:02:28 AM

We're still talking about it over here. Three of the funerals are today, and they're expecting thousands of mourners.

But unknowing has a point, if the shooter had been Muslim we might just be hearing "Je suis Quebec City" right now from the international community, and I can guarantee the US Republicans would never stop talking about it, because they would see it as a justification for their discrimination.

Related, our government has gone after Fox News for spreading misinformation. TBH I wish they'd go after Spicer too, and demand an apology, but I guess I can understand why they're not.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3429: Feb 2nd 2017 at 9:06:01 AM

Spicer simply used to the incident to justify Trump's immigration decisions, he didn't blatantly give misinformation. Calling him out would be going too far, interfering in American affairs, and (most importantly) might anger King Trump the Spiteful.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#3430: Feb 2nd 2017 at 9:11:28 AM

Trudeau backs down on electoral reform.

Hardly surprised by this. Changing first-past-the-post was never going to happen and probably won't happen any time soon.

Oissu!
phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#3431: Feb 2nd 2017 at 9:27:28 AM

@Pseudo Yeah that's what I meant.

@Rational Yeah, yeah and our PM has been doing quite the balancing act with that.

edited 2nd Feb '17 9:28:25 AM by phantom1

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3432: Feb 2nd 2017 at 9:33:04 AM

[up][up]One electoral mandate wasn't enough, you need time to come up with a broadly accepted reform. And then you have to educate voters, a lot of whom don't understand how the current system works. That promise was too ambitious.

[up]So far, so good. Not sure how long it will last. Trump apparently flipped on the Australian PM, and he is right of center. Keeping Trump on your good side without prostrating yourself might be impossible.

edited 2nd Feb '17 9:46:37 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Pseudopartition Screaming Into The Void from The Cretaeceous Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Screaming Into The Void
#3433: Feb 2nd 2017 at 10:25:23 AM

Spicer simply used to the incident to justify Trump's immigration decisions, he didn't blatantly give misinformation. Calling him out would be going too far, interfering in American affairs, and (most importantly) might anger King Trump the Spiteful.
Oh okay, got it. Still, "these Muslim people were killed so that justifies us keeping them out of our country," is so completely inappropriate.

[up] Don't they have to play nice with us if they want Keystone construction to run smoothly, or has that ship sailed already?

phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#3434: Feb 2nd 2017 at 10:27:15 AM

@Rational And prostrating oneself to an authoritarian regime is less than ideal, so quite a thing Trudeau has to do.

@Pseudo Yeah it is.

edited 2nd Feb '17 10:27:37 AM by phantom1

LinkToTheFuture A real bad hombre from somewhere completely different Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
A real bad hombre
#3435: Feb 2nd 2017 at 1:09:28 PM

Can't imagine this'll be good for Trudeau's approval ratings.

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." -Thomas Edison
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3436: Feb 2nd 2017 at 1:14:12 PM

Maybe not in the short term. Which is why they probably backed out now, with an election in 2019..plenty of time for people to forget.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
HextarVigar That guy from The Big House Since: Feb, 2015
That guy
#3437: Feb 2nd 2017 at 1:35:58 PM

[up][up]Yeah, but thanks to your pet monkey, anything that happens here wll be small potatoes.

edited 2nd Feb '17 1:36:15 PM by HextarVigar

Your momma's so dumb she thinks oral sex means talking dirty.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3438: Feb 2nd 2017 at 4:42:34 PM

Leitch's campaign manager has resigned for "being a distraction". Said distraction included using the word "cuck" against an opponent.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/kellie-leitch-s-campaign-manager-nick-kouvalis-resigns-1.3268975

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#3439: Feb 2nd 2017 at 4:48:45 PM

@Hextar That assumes it won't happen here, that we will avoid Leitch and O'Leary.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3440: Feb 2nd 2017 at 4:50:52 PM

I'm confident that Leitch won't get far, too many in the party hate her guts for her opportunistic xenophobia ploy. O'Leary.....I'm more worried about.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3442: Feb 9th 2017 at 9:01:57 AM

So, Trudeau is meeting with Trump (in D.C., because Ottawa being filled with protestors would probably ruin our alliance) next week.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/pm-trudeau-to-meet-trump-in-washington-next-week-1.3277950

Welp, let's see if the North American alliance survives the next four years.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
phantom1 Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3444: Feb 13th 2017 at 4:33:07 PM

Looks like it went off without a hitch. And Trudeau is apparently a meme again thanks to his handshake skills.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Ghilz Perpetually Confused from Yeeted at Relativistic Velocities Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Perpetually Confused
#3445: Mar 1st 2017 at 1:01:33 PM

Some racist idiot(s) are calling a bomb threat at Montreal's Concordia University

This is one of the dumbest letter I've ever read. "These guys wear flip flops. We must make bombs and take up the fight!"

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3446: Mar 1st 2017 at 1:06:12 PM

How does one target a specific group bu threatening to bomb a public area?

Idiots.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
CenturyEye Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign? from I don't know where the Yith sent me this time... Since: Jan, 2017 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign?
#3447: Mar 2nd 2017 at 7:52:01 AM

Ok, apologies if this has been covered. This grew out of the Europe thread discussion, but:

  • What stake does Canada have in the commonwealth's monarchy (Or another way, if the British abolished the monarchy, would it seriously damage the Canadian constitution/ cause a constitutional crisis?)
  • Is there a tangible "special relationship" with the commonwealth realms?
  • And, in general, what kind of relationship do Canadian institutions or individuals have with the monarchy?

edited 2nd Mar '17 7:56:08 AM by CenturyEye

Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our lives
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#3448: Mar 2nd 2017 at 8:04:39 AM

In Canada, the monarch is mostly ceremonial, but they have one really big stick, the ability to force an election, which is usually in the hands of the Governor General. It's never happened in Canada, but it has happened in Australia.

If we dissolve our relationship with the monarchy, we're going to have to figure out a new head of state. Because it really shouldn't be the Prime Minister, as all the responsibilities and duties of the Governor General would fall onto the Prime Minister, and while the Governor General doesn't actually do that much of import, there's a ton of ceremonial stuff that's done.

My suggestion for picking a head of state, keeping it mostly ceremonial, would be to have a council of 13 people, one from each province and territory, chosen by the provincial and territorial governments, get together every 10 years, with a different group each time, to select the new head of state.

Since the Constitution Act of 1982, under Pierre Trudeau, our government has been separate from the British one, so there wouldn't be an issue there.

Although, fun fact: Elizabeth II's position as the Queen of Canada is entirely separate from her position as Queen of England. If the British dissolved the monarchy, we'd have to vote to dissolve the monarchy here too, or she would still be queen. The UK theoretically has the same issue, as the Queen of England is technically a different position from the Queen of Scotland.

And the Commonwealth realms...there's the Commonwealth Games every four years, and the governments tend to be pretty similar, making negotiation a little easier. The Commonwealth would probably remain a thing, just because it's less of a pain to keep it around than to figure out how to dissolve it.

edited 2nd Mar '17 8:06:19 AM by Zendervai

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#3449: Mar 2nd 2017 at 8:10:02 AM

As far as individuals go, the vast majority of Canadian citizens are apathetic towards the monarchy.

The problem lies with the Constitution, and the Canada Act. Abolishing the monarchy would require reopening this law (well, it would require changing literally every law and regulation in the country, but that's the big one), and no government wants to do that. It would quickly snowball as other subjects came up not limited to but including: Quebec's signing onto the damn thing, federal-provincial relations, the status/role of the courts, resource/wealth distribution, how seats in the Senate/House of Commons are allocated, First Nations' rights (more on this below), and the structure of government (do we retain a Governor-General as an unelected but ceremonial head of state? Do we go for a domestic monarchy? An elected but powerless presidentesque figure? Something else?).

These issues can bring governments to their knees, and they have. And at the very least you would need 7 provinces making up 66% of the population (so at least Ontario or Quebec say yes, and no more than 3 dissent) to pass this, which you means that if you piss off one segment of the country (incredibly easy to do), Central Canada, the West or the Maritimes can veto it. And these issues involve mutually exclusive interests, so at least a few provinces are going to vote no.

And that's assuming the courts don't demand that Ottawa gets a complete consensus among the provinces, which isn't out of the realm of possibility for something so big.

And failed constitutional reforms tend to cause the Sovereignty movement in Quebec to surge. And no one wants to come within 54,000 votes of the country breaking up again.

Now, there is also the issue of First Nation treaty rights. All of their rights are essentially enshrined in treaties that were signed between various tribes/bands, and the Crown (either the British Empire, or Canada post 1867). To this day many First Nations do not consider a meeting truly high level if the Governor-General isn't there, Ministers and even the Prime Minister aren't enough. If the Crown (which to the First Nations means the monarch/their heirs as an individual, not just a symbol of government power) goes away, the status of those treaties gets put in limbo. And considering that the First Nations have spent decades trying to get the government to actually obey the damn things (they are finally making some degree of progress), there is no way that attempting to abolish the Canadian monarchy wouldn't raise high hell from the First Nations.

The last party that tried to open the Constitution and get a national consensus essentially got split in three and exiled from the halls of power for almost 15 years. No one is going to go near that again without a damn good reason, and the status of a ceremonial monarchy isn't one of those.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_federal_election,_1993

Look at the net seat change for the Conservatives. And the Bloc and the Reform parties primarily came into existence because Mulroney failed to reconcile regional interests during attempted constitutional shifts. (That wasn't the only reason for the party's downfall, a recession and corruption scandals didn't help. But it was national unity that split the party) No Canadian politician would want to risk that again. It took us until 1982 before we managed to (barely, only sorta) agree on a homegrown constitution.

Now, I don't how about the issues in the other Realms. But I'm sure that they have plenty of other issues related to their government structure.

edited 2nd Mar '17 8:11:36 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
CenturyEye Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign? from I don't know where the Yith sent me this time... Since: Jan, 2017 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign?
#3450: Mar 2nd 2017 at 8:43:37 AM

NVM

edited 2nd Mar '17 9:06:24 AM by CenturyEye

Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our lives

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