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First, let me make it clear that shutting down OTC altogether would not harm the wiki's mission in any way. It is being hosted solely out of courtesy toward the interests of tropers wanting to have a conversation.

Secondly, if OTC regulars don't start to report derails and stop falling for troll bait, in short, become more self moderating and participating more in bringing in moderation help when needed, I'll have no problem at all with shutting it down.

Thirdly, I'll underscore that falling for troll tactics is the fault of the fish. This forum is expected to be more savvy, not less. Stop being made fools of.


2024 update:

There is a list of banned OTC topics here. Please read it. We take these rules seriously.

Edited by Mrph1 on Mar 29th 2024 at 11:08:22 AM

PacificState Love Saves from Reef Since: Sep, 2011
Love Saves
#301: Oct 15th 2011 at 10:35:13 AM

Gathering proof to support my claims would be difficult, that much I'll admit. I only have scant, anecdotal evidence, so you should take my claims with a grain of salt. However, emphasizing with italics doesn't make an opposing opinion seem more convincing, only more forceful.

edited 15th Oct '11 10:36:34 AM by PacificState

A case of true love has the same redeeming power as a case of genuine curiosity: they are the same.
TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#302: Oct 15th 2011 at 7:46:05 PM

We covered the holler system earlier. A properly worded holler on the right post is effective. A blank or a simply this is bugging me holler is worthless.

A proper holler is very effective and gets the mods attention.

Who watches the watchmen?
PacificState Love Saves from Reef Since: Sep, 2011
Love Saves
#303: Oct 16th 2011 at 1:41:57 AM

I have trouble parsing your post. Could you try a rewrite?

But your "people react differently to the same actions" is spot-on: people are special snowflakes, in fact they're much more unique and much more complex and special than any snowflake would ever hope to be, regardless of how "nerdy" they are. But, like snowflakes, there are regular patterns and laws most of them follow, which can make them predictable if you know what to look for and how to draw the right conclusions*

. Also And being a nerd doesn't mean being an outcast: in my school we were kinda the stars, especially the show-choir team and the debate team.

Er... but what does that have to do with kids talking about their unusual (and possibly temporary or even made-up) sexual interests?

Does this look to you like I have changed the topic to a person here?

A case of true love has the same redeeming power as a case of genuine curiosity: they are the same.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#304: Oct 17th 2011 at 8:13:40 PM

I just locked four threads created by the same troper in this forum which were utterly pointless. Nobody hollered them — I just saw one in passing and followed the bread crumbs. This is what we're talking about, folks. Don't swallow the dangly shiny things, report them.

[down] Replied via PM.

edited 17th Oct '11 8:41:51 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheProffesor The Professor from USA Since: Jan, 2011
#305: Oct 17th 2011 at 8:15:32 PM

Nvm, off topic. Is there any place I could talk about this?

edited 17th Oct '11 8:16:09 PM by TheProffesor

abstractematics Since: May, 2011
#306: Oct 17th 2011 at 9:00:01 PM

[up][up]Is that user doing this on purpose? Though I think it was a newcomer to OTC being confused.

Now using Trivialis handle.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#307: Oct 17th 2011 at 9:17:38 PM

Action was taken. We identified a very strong trolling pattern across multiple accounts. It is possible to appeal, of course, in the event it's a mistake, but that's up to the troper in question.

In the meantime, the threads very clearly violated the "one sentence topic, discuss" guideline we've been talking about.

edited 17th Oct '11 9:22:04 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
pvtnum11 OMG NO NOSECONES from Kerbin low orbit Since: Nov, 2009 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
OMG NO NOSECONES
#308: Oct 18th 2011 at 10:47:36 AM

Personally, if I can manage to do so, I like to respond kindly rather than assuming that the poster is a troll and holler, on the premise that they're just naive.

If proved to be a troll, then by all means, holler/ignore/whatever.

Also, why outright nuke those threads, as opposed to locking?

Happiness is zero-gee with a sinus cold.
PacificState Love Saves from Reef Since: Sep, 2011
Love Saves
#309: Oct 18th 2011 at 1:36:44 PM

When a post is thumped, the thumpee gets a message. Could there be a similar mechanism for getting hollered? (Whenever someone hollers one of your posts, you get a message, not of who or what, only that that specific post was hollered).

A case of true love has the same redeeming power as a case of genuine curiosity: they are the same.
BlixtySlycat |like a boss| from Driving the Rad Hazard Since: Aug, 2011
|like a boss|
#310: Oct 18th 2011 at 1:38:20 PM

Why would you need one? You're only in trouble if the post gets thumped, and you get a message for that.

go ahead and do every stupid thing you can imagine
PacificState Love Saves from Reef Since: Sep, 2011
Love Saves
#311: Oct 18th 2011 at 1:44:44 PM

You're in trouble if you piss people off, and you're in trouble if you attract mod attention. By that point, it may be too late, and bans have always been hard to reverse, here or elsewhere.

A "Your Post Has Been Hollered" message can be understood as a Strongly Worded Letter by your fellow tropers suggesting you edit that damned post or face the consequences. If, knowing this, you decide your post is fine and you ain't afraid of no mod lookin' at it, hey, it's your funeral.

A case of true love has the same redeeming power as a case of genuine curiosity: they are the same.
BlixtySlycat |like a boss| from Driving the Rad Hazard Since: Aug, 2011
|like a boss|
#312: Oct 18th 2011 at 1:46:30 PM

I've received dozens of thump notices in my time here, and have never even been warned about the possibility of banning. You're only actually in trouble if you get thumped, and if what you're doing is going to net you a ban, you'll be told so.

go ahead and do every stupid thing you can imagine
abstractematics Since: May, 2011
#313: Oct 18th 2011 at 1:46:35 PM

In such a case though, I would just PM the user instead of reporting the post.

Now using Trivialis handle.
whaleofyournightmare Decemberist from contemplation Since: Jul, 2011
Decemberist
#314: Oct 18th 2011 at 3:15:28 PM

I have a question, what happens if a troper does a wikipedia spam without creating an argument?

Dutch Lesbian
Ironeye Cutmaster-san from SoCal Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
Cutmaster-san
#315: Oct 18th 2011 at 3:35:16 PM

Note that you're not automatically in trouble because you piss people off. We have had several cases where it was the people who got pissed off who needed to be disciplined, but the person who made the original post had done nothing wrong.

In any case, we don't want Hollers to be "quick, the mods are coming—edit out anything that might be inflammatory". For one, it won't have any effect unless you are on right then or the mods are being usually slow. If the post doesn't end up thumped, then all the Holler tells you is that there is a troper in the thread who is perhaps over-sensitive, and if the post does get thumped, the Holler message was redundant. Additionally, Hollers are used for things other than reporting rule-breaking, and often one Holler is sent to report multiple posts. Finally, it has the unfortunate effect of turning the Holler system into an early warning system for rule-breakers—an equivalent to having every 911 call also give an anonymous tip to the suspected criminals. If people think there is a serious rules violation going on, they'll skip out on Hollering to avoid giving the suspected rule-breaker time to hide evidence from non-admins, while if someone is giving a friendly tip, they'll skip on the Holler to avoid moderator interference, making the Holler system worthless for reporting misbehavior (and annoying for more bureaucratic issues, since it will produce message spam).

Edit: @whale: Report it via the Holler system—it counts as dickish behavior. The most recent case was reported and has been dealt with.

edited 18th Oct '11 3:37:10 PM by Ironeye

I'm bad, and that's good. I will never be good, and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me.
abstractematics Since: May, 2011
#316: Oct 18th 2011 at 3:43:32 PM

[up][up]Isn't that just a long and article-packed version of someone linking to an article and saying "Discuss"?

Now using Trivialis handle.
Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#317: Oct 18th 2011 at 5:46:17 PM

That's very much what it is. And why it counts as "dickish" behavior.

BlixtySlycat |like a boss| from Driving the Rad Hazard Since: Aug, 2011
|like a boss|
#318: Oct 18th 2011 at 6:08:10 PM

What if someone says something, and "well this disproves your point" is a valid response?

go ahead and do every stupid thing you can imagine
Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#319: Oct 18th 2011 at 6:56:58 PM

If the link is relevant and to the point, and such that it couldn't be paraphrased easily, then fine. There's no rule against using links, and there isn't going to be one.

Use your common sense.

If it were a face to face conversation would you just hand the other person a book or magazine article and say "This disproves your point", or would you at least give them a rundown of what it says and suggest that they read it?

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#320: Oct 18th 2011 at 7:41:40 PM

@308: Why keep the threads? They serve no useful purpose. Locking is a courtesy to let people know what happened, but we don't need them cluttering things up. If you really want to discuss the topic, start a real thread.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
pvtnum11 OMG NO NOSECONES from Kerbin low orbit Since: Nov, 2009 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
OMG NO NOSECONES
#321: Oct 19th 2011 at 4:10:00 PM

Fighteer: I have no problem with it, I was just curious.

Happiness is zero-gee with a sinus cold.
kashchei Since: May, 2010
#322: Oct 20th 2011 at 6:24:16 PM

Could we have some formal discouragement of people popping in to say how they think the thread has derailed? Rerailing with actual content is welcome, just saying "this is off-topic" is irritating.

And better than thy stroke; why swellest thou then?
TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#323: Oct 20th 2011 at 6:32:19 PM

How do you know they have not been following from the thread from the begining and are tying to be courteous and prevent a thread from going further off track?

Who watches the watchmen?
kashchei Since: May, 2010
#324: Oct 20th 2011 at 6:48:18 PM

That isn't what I'm saying.

And better than thy stroke; why swellest thou then?
pvtnum11 OMG NO NOSECONES from Kerbin low orbit Since: Nov, 2009 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
OMG NO NOSECONES
#325: Oct 20th 2011 at 6:57:44 PM

Some folks may not know what to add, but can see the derailing clear as day, whereas those involved in the thread may be blind to it at the moment. Should they refrain from speaking up just becasue they don't have a stance or view on an issue? I don't think so.

Happiness is zero-gee with a sinus cold.

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