Something like Cute But Psycho or Adorably Crazy is fine. This is a lot easier to summarize in two or three words than yandere or tsundere are.
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Please at least try to skim the thread before raising questions and comments that have already been addressed in detail, so we don't end up with unwieldy threads covering the same points over and over. No the issue is not misuse (though we checked that as well). And no, the trope is not particularly limited to Japanese media (though Yandere might be), which is the problem.
I did read the thread over, entirely infact, and the only problem I found was something I addressed.
There's also the fact that its stuck in the anime/manga genres when its a much wider trope, and a re-name would help bring its usage out of a particular subsection of the community.
I think the description needs work. It doesn't need to be the huge essay Tsundere is, but I think it should go a tad more in-depth and be clearer on how it differentiates from other tropes. For one thing, you pretty much actually have to be cutesy and/or incredibly sympathetic to qualify for this trope.
And yangire isn't a snowclone, nor is it a -dere trope, it's just very closely related to yandere. It's basically yandere minus love interest.
I agree that there is probably a non-anime supertrope/ sistertrope we are missing. I support creating that rather than renaming and expanding.
edited 26th Aug '11 9:10:08 PM by NoirGrimoir
SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)@54: The problem is that this is being underused, rather than misused. I have yet to spot any misuse for Yandere, but there's very little use off anime pages. Other Japanese-named tropes, like Yandere and Tsundere, don't have that problem.
Of course, we do still need to do a rename crowner, but let's agree on what precisely the definition is first. Pretty sure we've got it, but there's a little question on what exactly counts.
For example: How does this compare to Axe-Crazy?
Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.Yeah... when I said there was confusion between Yandere and Yangire I was thinking about how Yandere keeps being mistakenly used for Yangire. So maybe that's not important.
I think there is under use of Yangire though. I'd be open to making Yangire an example-free fanspeak page and then creating a new page for the Sweet But Dangerously Crazy trope (where all the current examples would be moved to). Would that be a better way of handling it?
Edit: Edited the first line to be more clear.
edited 27th Aug '11 5:26:45 AM by Sackett
This trope is heavily related to Tsundere and Yandere, and just like those, the key point of the trope is the back and forth change between personalities, so a character that is initially introduced as cute but ends up being psycho and stays like that, is not that trope (that is either Stepford Smiler or Bitch in Sheep's Clothing).
So, the supposed underuse (the trope page has quite a lot of non-anime or manga examples) is becuase it's underused on non-anime or manga. Stepford Smiler and Bitch in Sheep's Clothing are far more common.
edited 27th Aug '11 12:43:59 AM by shark33
Of course it's related to Yangire, because it ''is yangire''.
@58 The problem with disuse is there is no use for it or it is being misused and/or mistaken in place for something else. It differs from an Axe-Crazy person as they don't have to be 'cute' or 'adorable' in any way other than with the tip of a gun or blade.
@59 I have the opposite impression, as I've reminded multiple people that what they're describing ([[Vocaloid Tei Sukone]]) isn't being yandere because the action they were preforming/reacting to wasn't love related. And don't say that just because she is yandere for Len makes her 24/7 or 100% of her actions have anything to do with being a yandere, including washing the dishes.
And one problem with the Cute but Psycho title: There is no indication that they're anything but 1. Cute or 2. Psycho, which means that they only qualify if they're both 24/7 (or 98% of the time). If you're going for a Western counterpart, try Cute but Bipolar.
Until death do we partAs I understand it, it's not merely incredibly cute (and symphatetic) cutie-pie who also happens to be a total nutca<se — there's the factor of surprise and deception, i.e. she isn't constantly acting all murdering maniac like and can pull off the cutie part convinvingly.. as long as her trigger isn't pulled.
Japanese trope - purge non-japanese or japanese influenced examples and keep the name, If you want a trope for similar behavior in the west YKTTW it, but the -dere's are stock Japanese character types which are not only preexisting terms but what they are known as on other sites outside of tropes.
Characters are designed to fit that mold, that mold has name.
edited 27th Aug '11 1:55:27 AM by Vyctorian
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1) This isn't technically a "-dere" trope. 2), and more importantly, I haven't seen any reasons whatsoever as to how this is a Japanese-specific trope besides "it just is". I asked this before on the first page - if you have any reason as to why this trope as done In Japan is different from how it's done elsewhere, besides just the fact that it was named by anime/manga fans, please give it, but do not make statements like that unless you're prepared to support them.
From reading this site, I've seen evidence on why we could theoretically create, say, a Japanese Media Stock Tsundere trope, as that one does have some specific stock behaviors and usage in Japanese media. Here, though - nothing.
edited 27th Aug '11 2:02:39 AM by nrjxll
1.) It doesn't have -dere attached but it is a sub-trope/archetype
2.) The -deres are stock Japanese character development archetypes shiting between two poles a surface persona and Although used by the fandom it has become very well known and even published in English guides to anime as Yangire. [1]
] and I've seen it mentioned in books prior to that one same with all the -dere's. Unlike Nakama, which truely was a fan-mistake.
As for splitting how their different, In japanese and japanese influenced works they are invoking these archetypes, frankly most western examples are due to either Trope Decay or Square pegging the exampling in.
Creating a stock Japanese character archetypes would work, or even a tsundere arch types, but just as Western comics have comic only tropes, Japanese influenced works have the same.
Also on an related note: The page has two mythology folders one of which has a music example. (Which seems a bit square peg round trope-ish.)
edited 27th Aug '11 2:26:44 AM by Vyctorian
Rarely active, try DA/Tumblr Avatar by pippanaffie.deviantart.comOkay. How? See, I haven't seen any differences in how this is played in Japan versus everywhere else. Maybe they were the first to name and define the trope, but, again, things like Tsundere have actual, specific cultural cues seen in Japan that they don't have anywhere else. I'm not seeing any way in how this trope differs in Japan from the rest of the world.
Just claiming that "they're invoking the archetype" doesn't make this a Japanese Cultural Trope unless there is some way there is a uniquely Japanese archetype that differs from how this trope is played everywhere else. You said that western examples are mostly due to Trope Decay or Square Peg Round Trope - how is that the case?
Most of the western examples are examples of Bitch in Sheep's Clothing, very few of the characters are in fact Homicidal most are merely temperament which would be Tsundere if it was anything.
As for how the trope is used over sees to here,Like I said above most western "examples" are just Tsundere's / Bitches In Sheeps Clothing with a really big ship on their shoulders. Where the Japanese examples for the most part remember this trope is for very -dere level cute outside, (not unassuming, not nice, not Hidden Depths) and being a violent mentally unstable killer on the inside.
In some cases they may overlap but if its a mostly Japanese trope it should keep a Japanese name.
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No but when they are Kawaii/ Moe Blob cute as what the trope is, then it's either them or highly influenced by them.
Yangire aren't simply cute shell, monster inside. They are Japanese style cute,with a monster inside.
edited 27th Aug '11 2:54:20 AM by Vyctorian
Rarely active, try DA/Tumblr Avatar by pippanaffie.deviantart.comThat's ridiculous. That's like me saying "In order to qualify as a Stepford Smiler, you must dress and act like a Stepford Wife."
Nowhere on the page does it say that. And to act as if those reasons were valid points would only encourage more oddly-specific trope pages, existing only for the sake of making people feel that the media they choose to partake in is somehow special.
edited 27th Aug '11 3:02:50 AM by DisasterGrind
Whats wrong with media exclusive/oddly-specific tropes? Answer nothing I'm a splitter on splitterVsLumper FYI., we have plenty of comic book exclusive tropes that I tried getting retracted but was told they can be exclusive (So I let it be) but anime tropes can't be exclusive. Seems like a double standard. Also it doesn't serve to make fans feel special, it's an educative way to show off how different cultures use similar yet different tropes.
Not just an excuse to Fan Wank.
Also your retort to mine is a generation base on a tropes name, where mine is based on how the trope was first portrayed in it's nation of origin.
edited 27th Aug '11 3:14:08 AM by Vyctorian
Rarely active, try DA/Tumblr Avatar by pippanaffie.deviantart.comThe problem with oddly-specific tropes is that it won't be long before everything becomes split up due to incredibly miniscule differences; imagine a Tv Tropes where every trope is the same thing, but only split off because it has to do with an anime character/western character. We'd have hundreds of the same page with the only difference being that "a MOE character did it!" or, "a WESTERN character did it!" It makes no sense.
And this is not one of those Tropes that actually has a primarily Japanese/ Japanese inspired origin (like Tsurime or Tareme) but a universal trope that is being made out be completely Japanese-specific when it is not.
And I can't understand that last thing you said. Sorry about that.
Again splitter here, so I say it can be split into two separate tropes here. As the current one is way to general.
Crown Description:
What would be the best way to fix the page?

If the only reason this trope is being renamed is because it's constantly being confused with Yandere (And I've read several Wrong Genre Savvy fan fics that do it), then all there is to do is fix the trope pages.
Yandere - A person who enters a psychotic state when some event around the person's love interest occurs that 1. endangers them; 2. tries to do away the love-bonds between them; or 3. another reason having something to do with the love interest. Yangire - A person that is adorable or cute that enters a psychotic state for a similar or different reason, not really for the yandere reason.
The term originated in Japan, so deserves it's foreign name. A reason not many western shows could count could be simply because it has another trope, or any of the characters have an archtype personality with another name, like a yandere ex-girlfriend could be called an obsessive ex, because it was the first word they knew of.
edited 26th Aug '11 3:41:39 PM by MikaruKeiko
Until death do we part