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Awful name: New Crowner 10/24/11: Dropped A Bridget On Him

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Nocturna Since: May, 2011
#376: Sep 13th 2011 at 11:35:12 AM

I just thought that it might get more visibility if it was attached. But if you think it would be better to leave it as is, that's fine.

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#377: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:12:01 PM

Considering the crowner only has twelve votes for three options despite being up for a few days, I say hook it, with a note and a link that the rename or not crowner is still running. Here it is.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#378: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:19:18 PM

Crowner swapped. Must have missed it first time it was posted.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
BooleanEarth And a happy new year. from Banned Land Since: Jul, 2011
And a happy new year.
#379: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:39:11 PM

Sounds good to me.

"In the land of the insecure, the one-balled man is king." - Haven
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#380: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:43:39 PM

Can we get a title change? Like "define (new crowner today's date) or something like it?

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#381: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:44:03 PM

As this trope is about the reaction to The Reveal being negative and disgusted, when we make it gender neutral, are we going to ban the female examples that don't have the proper reaction or are we going to remove the trope entirely? I'm still not sure how to make this gender neutral without discarding the trope definition.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#382: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:48:36 PM

A gender inversion would need the Shock factor yes, they just tend to be more broken hearted depressed than guys who tend to get violent

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
BooleanEarth And a happy new year. from Banned Land Since: Jul, 2011
And a happy new year.
#383: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:50:10 PM

[up][up]The current description is...bad anyway, so it's unclear whether it does (let alone should) include non-negative reactions. The page just indicates shock and refusal to accept the person as their non-physical sex.

Well, I mean that is negative, but there's some wiggle room there is my point.

edited 14th Sep '11 9:52:07 PM by BooleanEarth

"In the land of the insecure, the one-balled man is king." - Haven
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#384: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:50:16 PM

So they have a very different reaction, (sadness and heartbreak) instead of the trope reaction (disgust and anger). I would think that would mean that they don't count for the trope as that's not the reaction that this trope is about. It's not just shock. So we'd be making it gender neutral and then basically saying that the way it plays for one gender doesn't work for the trope. Or we write two separate descriptions of what the trope is on one page.

edited 14th Sep '11 9:52:01 PM by shimaspawn

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
BooleanEarth And a happy new year. from Banned Land Since: Jul, 2011
And a happy new year.
#385: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:53:23 PM

[up]The "two separate descriptions on the same page" is one of the options on the crowner, distinct from making it completely gender-neutral.

"In the land of the insecure, the one-balled man is king." - Haven
NoirGrimoir Rabid Fujoshi from San Diego, CA Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Rabid Fujoshi
#386: Sep 14th 2011 at 9:55:49 PM

I think it should be about any reaction the characters have, the shocking reveal part is what should be important. Whether they take it in stride or not should both be included, I think, just mention that taking it negatively is the most common Character Reaction.

edited 14th Sep '11 9:56:21 PM by NoirGrimoir

SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#387: Sep 14th 2011 at 10:43:22 PM

Yes it's the shock of the reveal that's the heart of the trope, what happens after varies wildly on both sexes. I have seen plenty of examples where the guy after the shock and such still tolerates the Crossdresser just not a potential Love Interest. IE MM. (unless it's crossdressing Yaoi type works then it's anything goes after the initial bomb.) Most of those paraphrase "I still can't see you as being a guy"

Dropped The Im A Guy Bomb so to speak.

edited 14th Sep '11 10:50:03 PM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
HiddenFacedMatt Avatars may be subject to change without notice. Since: Jul, 2011
Avatars may be subject to change without notice.
#388: Sep 15th 2011 at 3:14:52 PM

Why shouldn't we note the differences in reactions based on gender? That is a very significant aspect of this.

"The Daily Show has to be right 100% of the time; FOX News only has to be right once." - Jon Stewart
NoirGrimoir Rabid Fujoshi from San Diego, CA Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Rabid Fujoshi
#389: Sep 15th 2011 at 5:23:13 PM

We can note that there seems to be common tendencies, but not even necessarily a majority of characters of either gender react in the way suggested (Males disgust, Females heartbreak).

SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#390: Sep 15th 2011 at 5:45:11 PM

[up] Very much agree there. Also there might be some values differences here and there in western works tend to see rage in addition to disgust. (At least from what I have seen) reactions actually vary wildly

(Also from 8 minutes on this video is the girl version.)

edited 15th Sep '11 5:49:34 PM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
NoirGrimoir Rabid Fujoshi from San Diego, CA Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Rabid Fujoshi
#391: Sep 15th 2011 at 5:50:40 PM

Especially in Yaoi and Shōjo anime it's actually rarer for there to be a big freak out, If It's You, It's Okay is probably more common.

edited 15th Sep '11 5:50:50 PM by NoirGrimoir

SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)
ArtemisStrong Wizard/Father of Tom from The Mended Drum Since: Jun, 2011
Wizard/Father of Tom
#392: Sep 20th 2011 at 3:32:05 PM

I just switched my vote to "Edit Dropped A Bridget On Him to make it gender neutral, rename it, rewrite the description specifically to note the differences in reactions based on gender, and separate the male and female examples on the page."

Is it time for this thing to be wrapping up yet?

Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?
BooleanEarth And a happy new year. from Banned Land Since: Jul, 2011
And a happy new year.
#393: Sep 20th 2011 at 4:38:31 PM

Aye, the vote's swung far enough that we can effect the changes. I suggest we sandbox (or put here) potential revisions for the trope's description and put up an alternative titles crowner (this or this) here.

edited 20th Sep '11 4:38:45 PM by BooleanEarth

"In the land of the insecure, the one-balled man is king." - Haven
Nocturna Since: May, 2011
#394: Sep 20th 2011 at 4:38:32 PM

Ignore.

edited 20th Sep '11 4:38:48 PM by Nocturna

Twentington Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Desperate
#395: Oct 6th 2011 at 11:48:23 AM

Bump. Anyone doing anything?

BooleanEarth And a happy new year. from Banned Land Since: Jul, 2011
And a happy new year.
#396: Oct 7th 2011 at 11:29:41 PM

Well, nobody took either of my suggestions and I've been busy with other stuff, so...no. I guess nobody is doing anything.

"In the land of the insecure, the one-balled man is king." - Haven
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#397: Oct 7th 2011 at 11:40:33 PM

There's quite obviously a consensus on what to do, but it seems no one is doing it.

MetaFour AXTE INCAL AXTUCE MUN from A Place (Old Master)
AXTE INCAL AXTUCE MUN
#398: Oct 20th 2011 at 2:13:05 PM

Bumping for action.

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#399: Oct 20th 2011 at 2:16:14 PM

I've tried to rewrite the description to be gender-neutral a few times, but I'm not having much luck. My only idea is to scrap it down to basically its Laconic, then let wiki-magic flesh it out a little.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
suedenim Teutonic Tomboy T-Girl from Jet Dream HQ Since: Oct, 2009
Teutonic Tomboy T-Girl
#400: Oct 20th 2011 at 5:50:20 PM

Among the reasons I voted against the winning entry is that transgender trope descriptions tend to become completely confusing and/or unreadable when you try to write them in a "gender neutral" way.

Jet-a-Reeno!

AlternativeTitles: DroppedABridgetOnHim2
20th Sep '11 4:37:04 PM

Crown Description:

Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.

Total posts: 548
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