Reality Ensues is for isolated moments—think of it like a little Mind Screw for the audience.
A full on deconstruction will tear apart an entire genre.
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?then why do we have Genre Deconstruction
"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.That's what I meant. I feel like I'm in an Abbot And Costello routine.
Somehow we're all agreeing and disagreeing simultaneously.
Anyways, here's some more evidence of the term being used in the vein I've been advocating.
http://www.avclub.com/articles/lights-camera-deconstruction-19-movies-that-double,47629/
EDIT: Ah, well, there's a comma near the end there screwing up the link. Anyways, it's a real article if you search "Deconstruction Film" on google.
edited 18th Aug '11 11:04:38 PM by ArtemisStrong
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?Where's that XKCD strip... Ah, here we go.
The word 'Deconstruction' can be used in this context to mean something similar to how we define it, yes. However, it also has multiple other meanings, all related to literary criticism.
The trope name is one which can be interpreted in multiple ways, depending on how you've seen the term used before. If you come from a profession which uses the more serious ones, then you're going to have no idea what anyone is referring to when somebody says 'Puella Magi Madoka Magica is a Deconstruction of the Magical Girl genre.'
Meanwhile, the trope Reality Ensues cover everything that the Deconstruction trope does, without having the multiple meanings attached to it.
There are too many toasters in my chimney!As for the link, delete the '%20' in the U Rl when you open it and it'll work fine.
There are too many toasters in my chimney!No, deconstruction isn't just putting real life stuff into movies. It implies analysis, criticism, reinvention...
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?I guess what I'm saying is Genre Deconstruction pretty much says what needs to be said as far as most of the material on the wiki (and if people are using it as shorthand for Darker and Edgier, that seems like another issue), and Deconstruction is a supertrope, one of the Lit. Class Tropes, a metaconcept type dealie.
edited 18th Aug '11 11:15:08 PM by ArtemisStrong
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?If deconstruction is a Lit Class Trope...then why does it go against the actual definition that most literature students receive and learn?
"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.I'm saying it shouldn't. It should be edited. It should have the history of the term, but also acknowledge this newerish, less academic use of the term. I think there's enough use of it as a movie trope (and I mean "trope" in the more traditional sense) that the Deconstruction page should point to Genre Deconstruction as a subtrope.
edited 18th Aug '11 11:22:53 PM by ArtemisStrong
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?So, in essence, you are proposing a complete rewrite of the current Deconstruction article to talk about all the types of Deconstructions around, including the one we are currently talking about, and linking to the various Deconstruction-esque tropes (Reality Ensues, Genre Deconstructor and Deconstructor Fleet) there.
Meanwhile, we would use Reality Ensues as the trope for what Deconstruction is at the moment.
Yes?
There are too many toasters in my chimney!Honestly, Madoka Magica isn't even a Deconstruction, it doesn't apply "reality" to the tropes at hand, it just takes place in a harsher world than the average Magical Girl show.
This oh so much... however you tell that to the hardcore fans who just claim its this.
I don't think it is relevant to the discussion at hand whether X show qualifies or doesn't for an Alan Moore award for best deconstruction right now, so may I please ask to keep this on topic?
"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.Yeah, it definitely needs the academic, literary definition on top and dominant.
I like getting into the high concept stuff like Deconstruction, Satire, and Three-Act Structure (I prefer the term Freytag'sPyramid myself) that underpins everything else on the site.
I'm also a fan of holding on to the origins of terms, even if people "aren't familiar" with them. Because I think a secret benefit of this site is its ability to educate, inform, and expand users' vocabularies. I never knew heard of Tsundere until I came here, but am glad I know it now.
Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?Not really I mean we redo this and suddenly entire fanbases are misusing it completely... but its a source of pride that it is a "Deconstruction" of the Magical Girl well everything is going to lead to issues..
edited 18th Aug '11 11:52:42 PM by Raso
Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!![]()
![]()
Isn't misuse a rather large part of this discussion? I'm not interested in having an in depth discussion on Madoka Magica, but pointing out that the term is being used for works that it doesn't apply to seems relevant.
edited 18th Aug '11 11:49:03 PM by SakurazakiSetsuna
Hm, true, I suppose.
But the problem (From where I see it) is whether this misuse comes from the organization of the Deconstruction tropes (From what I understand, Genre Deconstruction and Deconstructor Fleet are pretty much "Deconstruction focused on genre" and the second one is...um...the same?)
Not to mention that from when it currently stands, there isn't much of a difference between Reality Ensues and deconstruction. as such, we have four tropes affected by misuse, and we need to get around rewriting the pages, reevaluating them, etc etc.
"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.
Crown Description:
What would be the best way to fix the page?

Why do we even...
Nah, fuck this.
We have Reality Ensues for when a trope is played realistically. This trope defines the concept as it is being used in this context.
We have Deconstructor Fleet for when a work plays many tropes realistically, rather than one or two at a time.
We have Genre Deconstructor, for cases like the Puella Magi Madoka Magica as people keep calling it a deconstruction- taking the elements of a genre and playing them realistically (I don't care if it's truly a deconstruction or not, that's a debate for another thread).
And then we have Deconstructor as a supertrope. What is the point of this trope? Is it defining the concept? No- Reality Ensues does that. Does it list all the subtropes under it? Pointless- there's only two that can easily be added under a sentence like "See Deconstructor Fleet for when a work does this to many tropes at once", etc.
So, what purpose is it serving?
There are too many toasters in my chimney!