TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Work that Doesn't Exist on Main: TV Tropes The Webcomic

Go To

Jeysie Diva of Virtual Death from Western Massachusetts Since: Jun, 2010
Diva of Virtual Death
#76: Sep 16th 2011 at 5:54:32 AM

So, yeah, where did this "everything needs to be moved" come form? I need to take my questions there.
Main thread where it was decided is here. (At least, I think that's the thread.) There's also the "Wick Migration project" thread.

And yeah, what namespace Multimedia works go in is a known problem. Unfortunately every attempt so far at a thread to hash out official namespaces for works that aren't already covered by existing ones never gets paid attention to. I'm debating trying it again for the nth time...

edited 16th Sep '11 5:56:18 AM by Jeysie

Apparently I am adorable, but my GF is my #1 Groupie. (Avatar by Dreki-K)
Koveras Mastermind Rational from Germany (OG troper) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Mastermind Rational
#77: Sep 16th 2011 at 5:56:38 AM

[up][up][up][up] Namespace lists all "Just For Fun" namespaces and JustForFun/ ironically isn't among them.

As for SelfDemonstrating/, I guess I could live with that. What about AATAFOVS and TVTTTVS, who is gonna start the moving threads for them?

[up][up][up] It currently doesn't exist in the sense that its intended function is not clearly defined. It also doesn't exist in the sense that at the moment, it only contains subpages of Mainspace articles and none of their own right, like it would do if we moved subj there.

edited 16th Sep '11 5:59:09 AM by Koveras

Stratadrake Dragon Writer Since: Oct, 2009
Dragon Writer
#78: Sep 16th 2011 at 5:59:53 AM

But we are not Wikipedia....
Then I'll call Insult Backfire, thank you very much.

We are more informal, including the rigorousness of fiction-real world segregation.
Yes, TV Tropes has no absolute rule regarding Attribution (Verifiability/No Original Research) but in practice, we do have comparable concepts:

  • Verifiability: If a claim is disputed, get something (Word of God when preferable) to verify your side with. Otherwise this tends to start Edit Wars.
  • Original Research: A.k.a. Wild Mass Guessing. Natter magnet, don't put on the main page.
  • Notability* : There Is No Such Thing As Notability, but there is such a thing as "tropability", and especially the lack thereof.
  • Reliable Sources: For our purposes Google is fine. Not perfect, but reliable enough.

edited 16th Sep '11 6:04:27 AM by Stratadrake

An Ear Worm is like a Rickroll: It is never going to give you up.
Koveras Mastermind Rational from Germany (OG troper) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Mastermind Rational
#79: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:05:26 AM

[up] Hate to interrupt your careful, if belated line of argumentation, but do you find the additional disclaimers I have, in the meantime, added to the introduction sufficient to make the nature of the page clear even to our slower-witted readers? I believe that was the starting point of this discussion. smile

EDIT: @Jeysie: About your suggestion to change the page type to "fun". I have just tested it out and it seems that if we do that, the "YMMV" tab would disappear, along with the "Crowning Moment" subpages, which is a shame since they all have considerable content. I would strongly prefer to somehow keep them on top of the article.

edited 16th Sep '11 6:11:00 AM by Koveras

Jeysie Diva of Virtual Death from Western Massachusetts Since: Jun, 2010
Diva of Virtual Death
#80: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:21:52 AM

[up] Well, unfortunately, it's a Just For Fun page, so it needs to have that page type, so it's just something you'll have to deal with.

Just put manual links to them in the intro somewhere. Or maybe ask Fast Eddie to change what tabs can show up on Just For Fun pages.

The page is only for those people who care about it, so it won't be a big deal for them to just click the text links instead of tabs anyway.

edited 16th Sep '11 6:23:00 AM by Jeysie

Apparently I am adorable, but my GF is my #1 Groupie. (Avatar by Dreki-K)
Koveras Mastermind Rational from Germany (OG troper) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Mastermind Rational
#81: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:42:19 AM

Hate the idea of manual linking. Ugly, cumbersome, and missing the point of content management software.

Sent a message to Fast Eddie, see what he replies.

MangaManiac Since: Aug, 2010
#82: Sep 16th 2011 at 12:12:53 PM

We could always make an exception on what page type it's listed for the sake of the other subpages, even if it is moved to the Just for Fun namespace.

FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#83: Sep 16th 2011 at 3:56:13 PM

Jeysie, just fucking chill out, will you? It is marked Just For Fun on the page. This insistence on black and white rule-following is just tedious. Loosen up. Be flexible.

Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
Jeysie Diva of Virtual Death from Western Massachusetts Since: Jun, 2010
Diva of Virtual Death
#84: Sep 16th 2011 at 5:51:13 PM

No, I don't see why I should "chill out". I don't mind breaking the rules when there's a good reason to. "Because it's funny" is not a good reason.

I mean, why do we have to break the rules? People who think the page is fun can still have fun with it being marked the correct page type and put in the correct namespace, especially since we have to move all non-tropes out of Main/ anyway. How does being consistent hurt anybody?

I mean, just, seriously. I'm being yelled at for advocating following the rules? Seriously? In a way that won't hurt anyone involved or do anything at all to remove or hurt the page in question? I just... wow. I have no words. This must be the only place I know where apparently following the rules means you're a horrible editor that's a detriment to the site.

edited 16th Sep '11 5:53:10 PM by Jeysie

Apparently I am adorable, but my GF is my #1 Groupie. (Avatar by Dreki-K)
Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
#85: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:03:39 PM

[up]If it makes you feel better, imagine this new rule: if a fictitious work has "TV Tropes" in its name and official support of the admins, then, and only then, it can go in main.

This prevents all of the problems you're so worried about, like being overrun by trolls, while still allowing you to not get into a persnickity, pointless, rules-lawyering debate with the site's owner which you will never win.

Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
Jeysie Diva of Virtual Death from Western Massachusetts Since: Jun, 2010
Diva of Virtual Death
#86: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:26:22 PM

No, it doesn't really make me feel better.

I mean, I don't see what harm it does to move a Just For Fun page to a Just For Fun namespace (since we have to move non-tropes anyway), or mark a Just For Fun page with the Just For Fun pagetype. Or how it makes me a "rules lawyer".

Did I advocate to delete the page? No. Did I say nobody should edit it? No. Did I advocate doing anything that would hurt the page? No.

I just prefer to follow the rules when there's no real reason not to, because it just makes life much simpler and easier when I don't have to check for special exceptions on every single page I edit. So sorry for fucking up the wiki for all of you as a result, apparently? I mean, my brain is in Flat "What" mode trying to process this.

edited 16th Sep '11 6:26:51 PM by Jeysie

Apparently I am adorable, but my GF is my #1 Groupie. (Avatar by Dreki-K)
USAF713 I changed accounts. from the United States Since: Sep, 2010
I changed accounts.
#87: Sep 16th 2011 at 6:54:56 PM

...

...

I thought we had a Just for Fun namespace... 0_o

I am now known as Flyboy.
Stratadrake Dragon Writer Since: Oct, 2009
Dragon Writer
#88: Sep 16th 2011 at 7:14:01 PM

@Koveras: Well ... I haven't edited the article so I'm unaware of the added notes. Ya got me.

I have to agree to some extent with Jeysie; it's analogous to insisting that subjective tropes be put in the YMMV namespace. We have a Just for Fun namespace. We have a Just for Fun page type (or do we?). This article is Just for Fun (and not describing an independent work of fiction), so if it isn't already, it conceptually must be classified with one and/or the other.

edited 16th Sep '11 7:14:25 PM by Stratadrake

An Ear Worm is like a Rickroll: It is never going to give you up.
ArtemisStrong Wizard/Father of Tom from The Mended Drum Since: Jun, 2011
Wizard/Father of Tom
#89: Sep 16th 2011 at 10:34:31 PM

It's also a page that reads like a string of in-jokes and/or the interior dialogue of someone's mind. That makes it very impenetrable for any reader who isn't one of the editor/authors.

EDIT— I can hear the retort already: Many works are impenetrable and filled with in-jokes. To which I'd reply: Yes, that is true, but their pages on Tv Tropes aren't.

But, all that being said, if some people are actually having fun around here, and it's cool with management, then I can't see why it's such a big deal. If anything, we need to hold onto the fun things around here before the legalistic naysayers spoil it all.

edited 16th Sep '11 10:41:26 PM by ArtemisStrong

Get a slant at this glossary of Pulp Detective terms. It rates. Pipe that?
FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#90: Sep 16th 2011 at 11:11:03 PM

Hear, hear.

Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
#91: Sep 17th 2011 at 4:29:35 AM

I just don't get why this is such a big deal. Sure, we don't want every little thing to be an exception to the rules, but this has tvtropes right there in the name, making it obvious metahumor and part of the site. It's in a category by itself, so it's not really going to set a bad precedent.

Boyond that, it's one little works page. It's not going to be misused or misinterpreted, like a broken trope. It just sits there, not conflicting with anything. On a relative scale of importance, this doesn't even register. Calling this a molehill greatly exaggerates its importance. Getting hysterical about how terrible and wrong it is just leaves me astounded! I would rather use one of our precious, few TRS slots on something that matters.

Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#92: Sep 17th 2011 at 8:42:45 AM

[up] This. Leave the page alone. Let's lock the thread and move on with our lives. Seriously.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#93: Sep 17th 2011 at 8:45:23 AM

A motion for sanity is always in order.

Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
Add Post

Total posts: 93
Top