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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#24101: Dec 21st 2014 at 6:50:50 PM

One of the first ideas I thought would be cool for Captain Marvel would be to have Rogue show up as an antagonist in one of her movies and then do the "absorbs her abilities, feels remorse and becomes a hero" storyline (albeit very compressed).

That, of course, is totally and utterly impossible, so meh.

I'm convinced Agent 33 from Agents of SHIELD is going to essentially be the MCU's Madame Masque, too.

edited 21st Dec '14 6:52:03 PM by KnownUnknown

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#24102: Dec 21st 2014 at 7:16:30 PM

I had a neat idea for Janine Thompson as the Beetle, basically doing her bit from the comics (by day HYDRA's lawyer who negotiates between them and other villains, by night teched-up mercenary).
I feel like she'd be a good Jessica Jones villain, or maybe Daredevil. Or She-Hulk.

I just want a comic-book lawyer fight.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#24103: Dec 21st 2014 at 7:18:20 PM

She-Hulk vs Phoenix Wright is possible through Marvel vs Capcom

That's.... close-ish.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24104: Dec 21st 2014 at 7:49:02 PM

@Known Unknown- Do you mean Janice Lincoln? Or is there another female lawyer Beetle? (serious question)

If you mean Janice, I'd love to see her. She'd also present an interesting rights issue since she was introduced as an opponent of Bucky/Sam Wilson, but was later revealed as the daughter of Spider-Man villain Tombstone.

If there's one thing Joss Whedon is good at it is Affably Evil villains, evil law firms and Affably Evil lawyers working for evil law firms, so she'd fit in perfectly with Wulfram and Hart HYDRA.

I also see her as filling the kind of role that Victoria Hand played in the comics (substituting Baron Zemo for Norman Osborn).

edited 21st Dec '14 7:52:16 PM by Hodor

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KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#24105: Dec 21st 2014 at 7:51:05 PM

Nah, I just misspelled her name. Derp.

I honestly don't know where she would apply . I think it would be something like how while she's related to characters not owned by Marvel atm she herself is free (which might be a moot point, since if Marvel gets rights to Spider-Man Tombstone will be theirs anyway). On the other hand, she's the only Beetle who isn't a Human Torch or Spider-Man thing - so the Beetle identity might be tied in Fantastic Four, even if she isn't.

edited 21st Dec '14 7:53:02 PM by KnownUnknown

Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24106: Dec 21st 2014 at 7:55:14 PM

Ah, I see, no problem.

That's interesting about the possible FF rights. I would think that she may be like Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver- useable so long as there's no mention of their parent.

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Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#24107: Dec 21st 2014 at 9:34:30 PM

@Female Villains: If the Enchantress isn't in Thor 3 I will be severely disappointed. We have Raina in Shield and Nebula in Guardians but more would definitely be nice. I can't really think of anyone right now except for Moonstone who could appear in the Captain Marvel movie nicely.

Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24108: Dec 21st 2014 at 9:51:18 PM

RE the rights stuff, it is confusing because needless to say in comics there's a lot of overlap of characters.

So, with Janice, on one hand, she worked for Zemo, but on the other, she ends up on a team that's an incarnation of Spider-Man's Sinister Six- the whole Superior Foes of Spider-Man is oddly both a spiritual successor to a Spider-Man comic Deadly Foes of Spider-Man as well as to some arcs of the Thunderbolts (who have always been more tied to The Avengers). There's also a plotline of sorts involving Doctor Doom.

The rest of the team are pretty clearly Spider-Man villains, although Boomerang (who would be cool as an evil!Hawkeye) was on a Thunderbolts team with Mr. Hyde (recently introduced in AOS) as well as Troll, who is tied to Asgard (and thus clearly could be introduced to the MCU).

Edit- So basically, because of the overlaps, I would think that even though the X-Men, FF, and Spidey can't appear in the MCU, a lot of their supporting casts probably could, so long as they were given an MCU-specific focus.

edited 21st Dec '14 9:56:17 PM by Hodor

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KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#24109: Dec 21st 2014 at 10:03:52 PM

Well, Janice Lincoln is a unique in that while there's no reason why she herself would have a problem copyright wise, being by all means a general Marvel character (she's introduced as a Captain America antagonist), she's related to a Spider-Man character (and appears in the pages of Spider-Man quite a bit) and is the Legacy Character of a Fantastic Four staple. If they were to use her, they could easily just not mention Tombstone (or say her father was a criminal but not go into details) and they likely just wouldn't be able to call her The Beetle (and Comic-Book Movies Don't Use Codenames anyway), but then there's also the possibility that, because she's a Beetle, she'll fall under the purview of the Beetle and Fox might call foul if they were being particularly spiteful about it (to the point where they might not even be allowed to make her look like the Beetle).

That said, Janice is likely too minor a character for that to be an issue anyway. And I get the impression The Beetle isn't high on Fox's Fantastic Four villain list.

edited 21st Dec '14 10:23:56 PM by KnownUnknown

Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24110: Dec 21st 2014 at 10:12:53 PM

Yeah, I'm probably overthinking it. Would love to see Janice on screen though.

By the way, are you sure Beetle would be tied to Fantastic Four rights? I know that the reformed original Beetle, Abner Jenkins, started out as a Human Torch antagonist, but he is much more tied to Spider-Man, and now, to the Thunderbolts.

A lot of these oddities are covered under Rogues' Gallery Transplant.

Edit, edit, edit, edit the wiki
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#24111: Dec 21st 2014 at 10:16:43 PM

[up]At this point it's tough to say. At the very least Beetle sounds like it could be similar to the Maximoff twins (in that Beetle was very briefly an FF villain but has been more primarily associated with other franchises).

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#24112: Dec 21st 2014 at 10:21:30 PM

Wherever the rights for The Beetle lie, it's more likely than not far away from Marvel.

The first and most notable Beetle was explicitly the Human Torch's archenemy for a decent length of time when they were doing solo stuff with the Torch, and crossed over back and forth with Spider-Man (since Spidey and the Human Torch used to interact pretty often). In the Ultimate universe, the same character is part of Spider-Man's Rogues Gallery. The second Beetle in the 616 universe was also Spider Man villain. And while Janice was introduced fighting Bucky-Cap, she has since only appeared fighting Spidey.

I really hope they can use Janice or someone like her, though. She's black and a woman, and the topper is I think the MCU could use a few more mercenaries and career supervillains: characters who are competent and powerful but don't have elaborate personal ties with the hero that demand certain narrative roles. IIRC, the first supervillains we've ever gotten like that are Absorbing Man in Ao S and arguably Rumlow (who isn't quite supervillain yet, but probably will be in the next Cap movie).

They might have to do something about that outfit, though - it's kind of sixties, and it actually looks more heroic than anything. It gives me the vibe of something Marvel or DC would give to one of their younger heroines. Reminds me of Wasp a bit, too.

edited 21st Dec '14 10:33:45 PM by KnownUnknown

DrFurball Since: Jan, 2001
#24113: Dec 22nd 2014 at 6:51:55 AM

Scott Derrickson (director of Doctor Strange) tweeted this image of Cumberbatch.

I'll admit, he does look the part (and while it's hard to tell, I don't think I see a goatee. Going for the classic look. Nice).

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#24114: Dec 22nd 2014 at 7:20:10 AM

[up]I like it. He looks less weird with facial hair.

edvedd Darling. from At the boutique, dear. Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
Darling.
#24115: Dec 22nd 2014 at 8:46:27 AM

I've seen him with a moustache and beard. He can rock it.

Visit my Tumblr! I may say things. The Bureau Project
Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24116: Dec 22nd 2014 at 8:54:45 AM

@Known Unknown- Thanks for the overview. Yeah, I can see how having anyone called the Beetle could run into some serious rights issues, and despite his later character trajectory in the comics, Abner is quite clearly off limits.

Re the costume, that is a good question. Super Foes really runs on everyone having a Cheap Costume as part of humor and overall desire for "realism". To that end, Janice's outfit doen't look like it would offer much in the way of armor (I suppose it might be some kind of futuristic-kevlar like material). If she did appear, although her comics costume is cool, I think she'd more likely wear something more armory (perhaps one of Abner's Mach-Whatever suits?). Ant-Man is a good comparision, given that the Ant-Man costume shown in the film does seems to be more in the direction of Power Armor than spandex.

edited 22nd Dec '14 8:56:39 AM by Hodor

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comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#24117: Dec 22nd 2014 at 9:01:53 AM

I've been thinking, and the best way to start the Inhumans film is to start by showing the terrigenesis of a couple of teens, as part of a coming-of-age ritual. Like, only spend ten minutes on this, and then only sparingly mention said teens. It's an origin story for the entirety of the Inhumans without doing a lot of exposition. Heck, you can even add a voice-over to explain what terrigenesis is. This way people who haven't seen Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. can understand what's happening.

Most likely they will use some of the newer, younger Inhumans like Inferno and Iso and then use them as Audience Surrogates to introduce Attilan and the royal family.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#24118: Dec 22nd 2014 at 9:24:55 AM

You know, this makes me wonder if Skye and Raina will be moved into the Inhumans movie should Agents of Shield end/get cancelled.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#24119: Dec 22nd 2014 at 9:52:19 AM

I expect Raina to be resolved by show's end.

There are a lot of Inhumans from the source material that can appear in the movie. They don't need to borrow a plotline from a show that would be on its fifth season by then, and I don't really see Raina lasting another three anyway.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#24120: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:28:45 AM

I get the sense Raina will be a Disc-One Final Boss that will be replaced in the season 2 finale by an Inhuman.

stingerbrg Since: Jun, 2009
#24121: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:33:43 AM

By an Inhuman character that originated in the comics? Because Raina is an Inhuman.

kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#24122: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:46:28 AM

Yes. I mean one that's actually part of the comics.

Hodor Cleric of Banjo from Westeros Since: Dec, 1969
Cleric of Banjo
#24123: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:47:50 AM

Given the condition Raina was in when last seen, I wonder if she'll be the MCU version of Tigra.

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#24124: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:52:32 AM

That would require her to be a hero, and a pretty unambiguous one at that.

Tigra is a cop who used her powers to be an even better cop. Raina is a far cry from Tigra. I realize the MCU takes some liberties with their characters, but that's like portraying Wolverine as a hippie protesting Vietnam.

edited 22nd Dec '14 10:53:33 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#24125: Dec 22nd 2014 at 10:53:48 AM

Doesn't Raina have porcupine quills or something? Not seeing how she could become Tigra.


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