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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#22451: Nov 12th 2014 at 3:27:31 AM

[up] True, but there are origins which lend itself more to be told in detail than others, and there is a limit how far you can stretch a source material. The Dr. Seuss movies are a perfect example of adding useless stuff just to meet a running time can ruin a story.

I just realized something...Marvel managed a new record. I mean a 10 movie franchise and not one single outright bad movie in it? No franchise ever managed that! Most of them decline in quality after the first movies, not improve with movie nine and ten.

kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#22452: Nov 12th 2014 at 5:02:20 AM

People would probably argue that. They've never had a movie bomb though which is incredibly impressive.

MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22453: Nov 12th 2014 at 5:07:57 AM

@Swanpride, it's probably more accurate to say that their movies aren't outright financial failures. Bad is subjective. Mostly. Like from my perspective they have had outright bad ones. Just not many outright bad ones. I mean 7/10 is still a good record as far as the film industry is concerned and even the bad ones have had things in them to enjoy.

edited 12th Nov '14 5:08:54 AM by MousaThe14

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Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#22454: Nov 12th 2014 at 6:01:55 AM

[up]For me, they have three remarkable good ones (Winter Soldier, Guardians of the Galaxy and the Avengers), two which are good, though I see room for improvements (Iron Man and The First Avenger) and five which are a little bit of a mixed bag, but there is nothing on the level of "Batman and Robin" or "Spider-man 3" in their line-up. And that is honestly remarkable. The only other franchise which kept a decent level for so long is the Harry Potter one, on the merit of being based on really good movies, and I would call none of those movies "outstanding" or "great". But Marvel has reached that level, and the fact that they have only gotten better instead of worse makes me hopeful that they might be able to keep it up for a while.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#22455: Nov 12th 2014 at 7:16:58 AM

Watched Guardians of the Galaxy again yesterday. My campus was showing it.

I still love the opening sequence with Come and Get Your Love. Really sets the tone for the rest of the film.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Mattonymy Mr. Dr. from The Evils of Free Will Since: Jul, 2010
Mr. Dr.
#22456: Nov 12th 2014 at 7:26:58 AM

Marvel managed a new record. I mean a 10 movie franchise and not one single outright bad movie in it? No franchise ever managed that!

Hey! What about Pixa - Oh wait you said Franchise? Nevermind.

You are displaying abnormally high compulsions to over-analyze works of fiction and media. Diagnosis: TV Tropes Addiction.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#22457: Nov 12th 2014 at 7:31:33 AM

Some DC characters COULD lend themselves to a good, solid origin story if the filmmakers were willing to take their time with it. Green Lantern's biggest problem was trying to be both a movie AND its own sequel in a single film.

But overall, I agree that Marvel characters frequently have more complicated origins; in fact, Word of God is that this is the entire reason why the mutants exist as a species. Stan Lee invented the mutant race for X-Men because he wanted to write a superhero team comic and didn't want to have to think up separate complicated origin stories for each member of the group, so he was all like, "Screw it, there's a Superpower Gene, some people are just born with powers."

The colossal X-Men franchise spanning so many books that it could rival the entire rest of the Marvel Comics universe is probably the most successful thing ever to be born out of sheer, unadulterated laziness.

edited 12th Nov '14 7:33:37 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22458: Nov 12th 2014 at 7:42:38 AM

Laziness is the mother of invention.

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Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#22459: Nov 12th 2014 at 8:24:36 AM

Totally N00b here, who's this Bendis joker anyway? Is he as fan- horrific as Quesada?

Late reply but I thought I'd give my two-cents since I've been following Bendis' comics for like a decade.

He works best when he gets to play in his own toybox. Bendis is like the Anti-Geoff Johns in that while Johns work is full of Continuity Porn, Bendis will retcon or completely ignore stuff in favor of what he wants to write. So in cases of smaller or AU titles like his Daredevil run and Ultimate Spider-Man, it works in his favor.

But when he does it to stuff like Guardians of the Galaxy and The Avengers...yeah.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#22460: Nov 12th 2014 at 9:56:01 AM

I just realized something...Marvel managed a new record. I mean a 10 movie franchise and not one single outright bad movie in it? No franchise ever managed that! Most of them decline in quality after the first movies, not improve with movie nine and ten.

That's the beauty of a cinematic universe. Its all the same franchise but you can jump around between storylines rather than just doing the same thing over and over. And if something doesn't work, it can be ditched without tanking the franchise.

Its really more of a meta-franchise with lots of baby remora franchise nestling in its belly.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22461: Nov 12th 2014 at 9:58:54 AM

And if something doesn't work, it can be ditched without tanking the franchise.
Or "What happened to the Leader when The Forgettable Hulk film failed"

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CassidyTheDevil Since: Jan, 2013
#22462: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:00:24 AM

And people thought Guardians of the Galaxy would be a stinker. People are bad at predicting things.

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#22463: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:03:32 AM

Does Tim Blake Nelson do television at all? Because Agents of SHIELD might be a good place to bring the Leader back.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#22464: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:04:57 AM

I had a theory that he was the Clairvoyant for a while.

I was a fool.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22465: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:09:12 AM

I was a fool for thinking the Clairvoyant was actually clairvoyant.

We were all fools, Bocaj.

And frankly, I found the fact it was all just John Garrett being an inside man to be a mite disappointing.

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Wackd Since: May, 2009
#22466: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:09:50 AM

[up]Do you also wear floral-print dresses?

(Honestly I was more disappointed that Garrett showed up so close to the reveal so it didn't have as much impact as it might've. And making Ward another double-agent was a smart character move but robbed us of the one guy we might've been able to vicariously feel that betrayal through. I like Triplet well enough but he also showed up super-close to the reveal.)

edited 12th Nov '14 10:11:48 AM by Wackd

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#22467: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:10:41 AM

I just can't get mad at Bill Paxton. Just can't.

MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22468: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:16:39 AM

[up][up]Well I'll admit did' used to be a Hawaiian shirt guy in my younger days...

I do agree it felt too close to the reveal. As I watched it, I was getting struck with "Dammit, you guys did not have enough episodes for this." If they had had more time to develop this guy and have the reveal later on...

I partially blame them doing Agents of SHIELD too early but if they didn't have those episode to establish the cast then the suspicion we would have after the HYDRA reveal would be empty since we don't get to know the cast as well.

Man, Ao S had a lot of corners to write out of, didn't it?

[up]I take it this guy is some kind of well known actor person?

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wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#22469: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:21:28 AM

Wasn't Tim Blake Nelson Blonsky/Abomination, and someone else was Leader?

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#22470: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:23:57 AM

Personally, I think AOS being so... oddly paced until the Hydra reveal was brilliant. A dumb move for a show that needs ratings, but brilliant from a storytelling perspective. Here you have this fun, but otherwise kinda forgettable monster of the week show, and right at the end, bam, everything changes.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Rvdz Don't mock the shocker from in a bar, under the sea Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22472: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:37:06 AM

You always know who the bad guy is: Their first name is Tim.

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MadSkillz Destroyer of Worlds Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
Destroyer of Worlds
#22474: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:42:17 AM

[up][up] Remarkably accurate.

[up] "he played the villainous matinee idol-cum-Nazi spy" Yes, even him.

edited 12th Nov '14 10:43:20 AM by MadSkillz

MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#22475: Nov 12th 2014 at 10:46:53 AM

[up][up]You mean Rassilon who is definitely a bad guy.

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