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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Theokal3 Since: Jan, 2012
#144626: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:12:33 PM

I mean.... technically speaking this Wolverine fixation to the detriment of other X-Men has mostly been Fox's work. Wolverine has received a lot of spotlight in comics, but they still usually leave room for the other characters to do stuff. So I think we can safely presume that when the X-Men show up, they won't have Cyclops killed off yet again after receiving almost no development.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#144627: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:13:20 PM

Yeah, I hope Marvel keeps an eye on what went wrong with Scott in the Fox-men movies.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#144628: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:16:04 PM

Maybe not do the whole Jean Grey love triangle again

One of the things X-fans hate is the absolute insistence that Logan has to have a thing for Jean

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#144629: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:18:53 PM

The inevitable rehashing of the classics is what I fear about MCU X-Men. love triangles. Days of Future Past, a third attempt at Dark Phoenix.

(Not) To be a doomsayer but it's coming.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#144630: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:37:58 PM

Love triangles are the lowest form of comedy, and the insistence on only characterizing him through one actively ruined Cyclops the first time.

I'd love to have as few love triangles as possible for as long as possible. I'm already pretty sure they're going to do one with Gamora in GOTG.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#144631: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:38:58 PM

I would love to see Scott with Emma Frost in Live Action for a change.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#144632: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:40:18 PM

we need more even shapes,a love circle or love square,love triangles are so..pointed and sharp

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Theokal3 Since: Jan, 2012
#144633: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:41:35 PM

Personally I fear mostly that they'll rehash all the stuff that has become used up by now. You know, them being feared and hated and NEVER making a progress on it to the point they get nuked whenever the status quo changes.

dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#144634: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:42:44 PM

I always loved Scott/Rogue in X-Men Evolution. Then they entirely dropped it with barely a word and went straight Scott/Jean as always. What's the point in doing something new if you don't... do something new?

And romance isn't exactly the MCU's forte, it suits a series more anyway.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#144635: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:43:26 PM

All I stress on the Inhuman stuff is that the Inhuman Royal Family be kept around and certain notable Nuhumans be kept prominent even if they do get reworked into being mutants. I have absolutely seem some vindicative-ass takes from fans suggesting to literally erase the entire Inhumans concept from all forms of canon because other than Black Bolt and Lockjaw who cares about some inferior mutant knock-offs anyway right? Just speedrun Krakoa and throw them into all the X-Men shit and everything's gucci. The comics side at least is all too willing to indulge, given all the unimportant Nuhumans have been killed off by Kree super-predators and the Inhumans are reduced to a motley crew adrift in space. And the last thing I want is for Kamala and Lunella to wind up like Gwenpool, who literally retconned herself into being a mutant so she could have happy Krakoa fun times and has been mostly MIA ever since.

I've similarly gotten like this on fandom takes that the MCU should leave Danny Rand lying in a gutter and have Colleen Wing be Iron Fist and train up Lin Lie, and I especially do not like the idea that this is the "correct choice" because Danny is too caked in White Savior tropes to be usable. I really do not vibe with this notion that anything is unworkable or not worth it at this point.

Edited by Watchtower on Jul 22nd 2022 at 5:44:06 AM

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#144636: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:43:49 PM

As for the canonicity of Freshman year, I could easily see it being canon... if it's his college freshman year. Of course they are saying it takes place beforehand, so I have no idea how that's going to play out.

Edit: Looking at the stills and character designs, there's no way it can't be an alternate universe. The continuity headaches would otherwise be unreal...

Edited by jjjj2 on Jul 22nd 2022 at 5:46:30 AM

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#144637: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:47:39 PM

“And the last thing I want is for Kamala and Lunella to wind up like Gwenpool, who literally retconned herself into being a mutant so she could have happy Krakoa fun times and has been mostly MIA ever since.”

The irony of her doing that to hold onto some relevance and getting only infrequent appearances and crowd shots

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#144638: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:49:49 PM

I can't really imagine Scott and Jean not being together

They are like the royal family of the X-Men considering how many kids they technically have

For reference here's the entire Summer-Grey family

The whole Summers-Grey family man.

Jean Grey

Phoenix impersonating Jean Grey

Scott Summers

Scott's brother, Alex (Havoc)

Scott and Alex's secret abducted-by-aliens (Shi'ar) brother, Gabriel (Vulcan)

Adam-X the X-Treme, the 4th Summers brother

Jean Grey's clone, Madelyne Pryor (Goblin Queen)

Scott and Jean's clone's son, Nathan (Cable), who then gets sent to the future and then time travelled back as an old man

Scott and Jean's clone's son's younger self, who also time travelled back

Scott and Jean's clone's son's clone, Stryfe

Scott and Jean's daughter, Rachel, from an alternate timeline (Days of Future Past), who then time travelled to 616

Scott and Jean's genetically engineered son, Nathan (X-Man), from another alternate timeline (Age of Apocalypse), who then also time travelled to 616

In Bishop's reality, Cyclops had a daughter with Emma Frost named Ruby.

X-Man brought Maddie, aka Jean's clone, back to life. A reminder that Maddie is basically Nate's alternate reality mom's clone. They kissed and there was this weird incest thing going on between them.

Later on, it was revealed that Maddie was the Red Queen, an evil version of Jean Grey from an alternate timeline (which makes it even worse since it's his alternate reality's mom instead of another alternate reality's mom's clone), but the retcon was messy and it's still not really clear what actually happened. Did Nate bring back Maddie and then the Red Queen replaced her, or was she the Red Queen all along?

Hope is technically not a Summers-Grey by blood but she was adopted by Cable (Scott and Jean's clone's time travelling son) who took her into the future and then time travelled back. Despite this, red hair, mutant messiah, Phoenix host? Yeah she's part of the family, blood or not.

Christopher Summers (Corsair), Scott's father and interstellar pirate.

There's also Hyperstorm, AKA Johnathan Richards. The son of Rachel Summers and Franklin Richards.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:52:39 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#144639: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:52:27 PM

You’ve just reminded me of the Summers family tree song that was on the Jay and Miles podcast

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#144640: Jul 22nd 2022 at 2:57:50 PM

There's even official family trees

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/summer_grey_family_tree_1.jpg

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/summer_grey_family_tree_2.png

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#144641: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:02:49 PM

Adam X the X-Treme is a Summers!? I did not know that.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#144642: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:05:10 PM

It was reputed for a while, then Vulcan happened, and eventually recently but retroactively they went and confirmed Adam in a weird way I don’t remember but it’s Shi’ar biz

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#144643: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:08:01 PM

It was confirmed in the 2021 X-Men Legends run which is intended for writers to write in storylines they originally planned to but were never able to

Fabian Nicieza was able to confirm Adam really is their brother in the first arc.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Theokal3 Since: Jan, 2012
#144644: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:30:32 PM

Watchtower I think summarized really well what I was referring to regarding this "Inhuman love". It's not that Inhumans are especially loved, it's that some people feel Marvel went overboard in the opposite direction.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#144645: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:34:57 PM

You mean first they kept shoving them into our face excessively, and now they act as if they don't exist at all?

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#144646: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:39:46 PM
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#144647: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:43:13 PM

Despite being the one who brought it up I honestly don't really care that much, but the abrupt shift from nonstop in-your-face Inhumans to nothing at all and pretending it never happened gives me a bit of whiplash and it does feel like overcorrection in the other direction, yeah.

I get that most of the writers didn't want to do Inhumans stories except under duress, and it was in general kind of a terrible time for the comics stories. But nonetheless there should still be some level of standing by the choices they made during that time as they weren't all terrible, and just taking those few lumps instead of pretending it never happened and fooling nobody with a brain.

Edited by AlleyOop on Jul 22nd 2022 at 6:44:26 AM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#144648: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:51:39 PM

I know I've banged this drum before, and I'll keep banging it until the skin wears off, but Marvel is writing most of these shows for general audiences, and if 90 percent of the people watching either don't know anything about Inhumans or only know of them because they hated the TV show, nothing is gained by adding them in when there are so many other things they can be doing.

Frankly, before Ms. Marvel I only really knew about them because of reaction videos on YouTube and the people on these forums constantly talking about how the show sucked. Well, I guess there's the video game to consider.

And heck, half the time the comics can't even agree on how any given character or plot point works, so if you're going to talk about accuracy, you then have to pick which version you're talking about, which sort of undermines the point.

On the other hand, Marvel goes out of its way to throw bones to comic fans in the form of Easter eggs, dialog lines, costumes, and so on. Given that, I can't blame people for feeling a sense of ownership. I just thought we were long past expecting comic accuracy.

My personal take is that if we are getting mutants (confirmed), then adding Inhumans as well makes no sense because it sounds like they steal each other's themes.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 22nd 2022 at 6:52:58 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#144649: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:54:36 PM

They really don't, or at least they didn't before the big Inhumans push back in the day.

Though I admit, I'm not totally sure what the Inhuman's thing was before Executive Meddling tried to make them into diet X-Men.

I think someone described them as Game of Thrones for Marvel or something.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#144650: Jul 22nd 2022 at 3:56:09 PM

[up][up] Not uhhhh really the point here.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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