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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#139576: Feb 5th 2022 at 1:02:18 PM

The story was she didn't express enough mourning for him or somesuch. It was very oblique even for the standards of social media.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#139577: Feb 5th 2022 at 1:08:02 PM

She didn't post a mourning message on her account about Boseman immediately after his death, when a bunch of other actors did, and people took it as proof she must've hated Boseman or something equally inane and subjected her to all kinds of vile abuse and harassment in response. IIRC she deleted her social media accounts entirely in response. No idea if she's since returned to any of them.

Edited by AlleyOop on Feb 5th 2022 at 4:12:50 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#139578: Feb 5th 2022 at 1:10:19 PM

Well thats just horrific.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#139579: Feb 5th 2022 at 1:29:22 PM

It really is.

There are probably like, a million reasons why she didn't post a mourning message right away.

Those assholes were just trying to pick a fight.

One Strip! One Strip!
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#139580: Feb 5th 2022 at 3:24:04 PM

Actually, Olsen has said that her deleting her social media accounts had nothing to do with being bullied over not paying tribute to Boseman.

Okey Dokey!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#139581: Feb 6th 2022 at 2:45:34 AM

Huh thinking of a character I would love to see in a Guardians movie, I would say Major Victory due to how batshit he is as a character.

A time traveler from the year 3000 (the future version of Justice ala the New Warriors even) stuck in a containment suit who can fire psychic blasts and wields Captain America's shield.

They really should bring in more crazy new teammates. Thats like half the fun of team-series, the wacky new members and what they'll bring to the existing dynamics.

Edited by slimcoder on Feb 6th 2022 at 2:45:46 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#139582: Feb 6th 2022 at 9:04:17 AM

Here's my dumb theory for Guardians 3: Quill will end up doing something that will cause him to be exiled to Earth permanently, resulting in him having to relearn how to live life on Earth.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#139583: Feb 6th 2022 at 9:07:05 AM

wild mass guessHe had a mid life crisis and decides he suddenly wants to settle and farm somewhere

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#139585: Feb 6th 2022 at 11:23:45 AM

He never married Gamora.

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#139586: Feb 6th 2022 at 11:32:57 AM

I'm reminded of the start of Secret Six where the death of Scandal's girlfriend Knockout due to the events of Final Crisis has left Scandal in a drunken depressed stupor and new teammate Bane witnessing the crew trying to cheer her up asks "Are things always like this?"

I can imagine something similar happening to Quill cause it is Quill.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#139587: Feb 7th 2022 at 11:01:17 PM

Y'know, I think that I'm starting to enjoy the MCU's Disney series more than the mainline movies lately. Sure, the movies are great spectacles and fun to see with your friends, but there's something I really like about the more character-focused and relaxed TV shows. Yes, I agree that each series could use a few more episodes and/or a longer runtime, but I like how each D+ series flows and is experimental overall.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#139588: Feb 8th 2022 at 6:10:47 AM

WandaVision was certainly a necessity when it came to developing Wanda as a character, to make her more of an A-lister than just a sidepiece.

The longer episode format definitely benefits being able to address themes like trauma and grief. Hell, for all the complaints about the Netflix Marvel shows having padding, one can't deny that their longer runtimes meant more time to explore themes that movies wouldn't be able to go as much in depth about (like Daredevil on gentrification, Jessica Jones on sexual assault and trauma, etc.).

Okey Dokey!
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#139589: Feb 8th 2022 at 7:43:24 AM

I just wish the shows had better villains, I guess. They haven't been all that strong so far.

Which I guess is a good thing for some, it means they're focused more on fleshing out the main characters and their dynamics, but the best seasons of the Netflix shows could juggle both of those pretty nicely.

Edited by GNinja on Feb 8th 2022 at 3:44:29 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#139590: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:01:38 AM

[up]Which ones are you talking about that "aren't so strong"?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#139591: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:08:05 AM

Agatha's probably the strongest villain if only because everything conspired to make her memorable but she still fell victim to the Marvel Third Act Curse. (Though that was apparently COVID's fault.)

The Karli/Sharon twofer's still the worst for me, since both were so built up but never got a chance to be particularly impressive and had to share precious screentime with nice-for-now-Zemo.

He Who Remains isn't so much a villain as he is a walking Infodump-slash-big winking teaser.

Edited by Synchronicity on Feb 8th 2022 at 12:09:06 PM

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#139592: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:13:59 AM

Yeah, the show villains have been kind of lacking.

Agatha was hammy as all hell but otherwise a flat character, Karli was… blegh, HWR is what [up] said and Kingpin was carried solely by his DD rep. The only one I can say really hit the mark was Ultron, and even then that’s only because he was cooler than his previous adaptation.

Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Feb 8th 2022 at 1:15:11 PM

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#139593: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:18:31 AM

The villains who reformed, John Walker and to a lesser extent Maya Lopez, are more interesting than the majority of the other TV villains.

The legend has returned.
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#139594: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:29:21 AM

Here's hoping Arthur Harrow and/or whatever the hell the Big Bad is in Moon Knight leaves more of a mark.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#139595: Feb 8th 2022 at 11:54:55 AM

I was always one of those people who thought there shoud've been a double reveal with Agatha, where she turns out to be just another figment of Wanda's illusions, a convenient, cartoonish villain to scapegoat all the problems with her town on so she could avoid taking responsibility.

As is, yeah, she's probably the best, but she's the best of a pretty middling bunch.

Edited by GNinja on Feb 8th 2022 at 8:36:32 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#139596: Feb 8th 2022 at 12:00:37 PM

it was Agatha all along but really it was ..Mephisto!

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#139597: Feb 8th 2022 at 12:09:33 PM

[up][up]Wait, I agree, this is a way better plot twist.

Hawkeye86 Spirit of Battle from Classified (Searching for Spock) Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
Spirit of Battle
#139598: Feb 8th 2022 at 12:30:14 PM

[up][up][up]I agree, that would have been perfect.

You and I remember Budapest very differently
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#139599: Feb 8th 2022 at 12:44:59 PM

Nah, I wouldn't have liked that. I didn't see the Agatha reveal coming, it caught me off-guard and it was neat to see all the ways she manipulated things behind the scenes. Plus, Wanda needed to end the show as a hero, a good guy to team up with Dr. Strange in the next movie.

PizzaDog11 Pizza is my business from closer than you think Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
Pizza is my business
#139600: Feb 8th 2022 at 12:50:52 PM

That double reveal idea with Agatha is fantastic.

I think the big problem with the Disney+ villains is that they’ve mostly been held back until an 11th hour reveal, so they’ve had this feeling of showing up then being dealt with really quickly. Kingpin and HWR didn’t appear until the last episode, Agatha’s reveal was with an episode or two to go, and Sharon’s wasn’t until the very end.

The other problem is that they’ve kind of been relying on the audience’s knowledge of these characters, which definitely varies. Sure it’s a huge deal to find out Kingpin or Kang was behind it all… if you know who they are already. Within the context of the show itself though it doesn’t actually mean much.

I think the two issues are related, and the villains have largely suffered from the need to have a “big reveal” near the end of the season, giving the villains very little screen time to actually develop within the context of the show. I’d much prefer the way Kingpin was done in DD, or Kilgrave, where they get time to establish themselves as a threat rather than coasting on meta reputation.


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