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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

J79 Since: Jan, 2015
#138826: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:13:18 PM

On a side note, who was Marvel's first recurring villain (as well as the first super villain, ie, having powers, not just a thug)? Red Skull?

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#138827: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:31:23 PM

It's either Namor or Red Skull depending if you classify the former as a sympathetic supervillain or a very dark anti-hero during his early "all-surface-dwellers-must-pay" days (the aforementioned emblematic crossover with the Human Torch is in fact Namor trying to sink Manhattan and Torch going "please stop").

It's actually kind of funny that DC's counterpart in terms of "the very first" supervillain is Ultra-Humanite (Superman's first supervillain), who isn't really as gigantic in status as The Red Skull (who's to this day a sort of hallowed figure of sheer terror in Marvel with his depravity).

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#138828: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:37:04 PM

What's funny is that the first Red Skull was not actually Johann Schmidt (who made his debut in Captain America #7), but George Maxon (who made his debut in Captain America #1). So, one of the most iconic villains in the Marvel universe was technically the second guy to have the title of the Red Skull.

Yeah, I know More Popular Replacement is a thing, but it's something to think about.

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#138829: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:41:05 PM

oh wait a minute. Tiamat is a creator deity who was sacrificed to save humanity

Is Tiamat Jesus

oh noooooooooooooooo

Edited by blkwhtrbbt on Jan 13th 2022 at 11:55:55 AM

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#138830: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:45:34 PM

Yeah, the two Ka-Zar's are separate people. David Rand and Kevin Plunder. Marvel just reuses superhero names a lot.

We're introduced to Kevin Plunder and the Savage Land for the first time in an X-Men comic during the silver age, and he has a way different backstory.

Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#138831: Jan 13th 2022 at 8:53:42 PM

[up][up] ... Think this is the wrong thread for that one, buddy.

Wake me up at your own risk.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#138832: Jan 13th 2022 at 9:28:14 PM

MAN, am I glad I watched Eternals today to deftly avoid that spoiler! Anyway, watched Eternals today, loved it.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138833: Jan 13th 2022 at 9:46:32 PM

I think Eternals is kind of an odd film, but it definitely is trying its best, and while not all the characters hit for me, I do like a few of them. Druig and Makkari are some of my favorites imo. The settings are really pretty as well.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#138834: Jan 13th 2022 at 11:30:51 PM

I really loved the character writing, action choreography, and cinematography, those were all high points of the film. I also really liked the pacing, that it was much slower and more deliberate than other Marvel movies really aided it in fleshing out the characters and drama.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#138835: Jan 14th 2022 at 4:34:28 AM

The main problem with Eternals is that it has so much to do that it rushes its climax. The Stock Betrayal and the Discovery of Hidden Inner Power come too abruptly to carry the necessary emotional weight.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#138836: Jan 14th 2022 at 4:40:29 AM

I don't think so. The betrayal was pretty heavily telegraphed from near the start of the movie.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#138837: Jan 14th 2022 at 4:46:10 AM

Hmm. That's actually true. The Discovery of Hidden Inner Power is a bit rushed, though.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#138838: Jan 14th 2022 at 4:50:07 AM

Maybe, but it's not that far-fetched to say that the golden orb Sersi is using to communicate with Arishem can be re-purposed to make this hypothetical Unimind between all of them, and there's quite a bit of story after that part.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#138839: Jan 14th 2022 at 10:09:41 AM

Tessa Thompson reveals Valkyrie’s new powers, including sensing death, taking the dead to Valhalla, reviving the dead, and inhabiting their body.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138840: Jan 14th 2022 at 10:45:21 AM

[up] If she had those powers before, what was stopping her from reviving her lover that died at Hela's hands? Or better yet, trying to resurrect some of Asgardians killed by Thanos? If she had remained on the Statesman, we could've had Valkyrie in Heimdall and/or Loki's body fighting Thanos. That would've been dope.

Edited by MatthewWayne on Jan 14th 2022 at 10:49:59 AM

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#138841: Jan 14th 2022 at 10:51:05 AM

There’s probably going to be some kind of limit to her abilities to keep them from being a Story-Breaker Power. Maybe her reviving power is a Pushing Daisies scenario where it’s only temporary. And it sounds like her body possession power is triggered involuntarily.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#138842: Jan 14th 2022 at 1:35:54 PM

Oh man remember when Marvel did those animated movies?

The Hulk vs Wolverine one was pretty dope.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138843: Jan 14th 2022 at 1:51:23 PM

[up] Yeah, Hulk vs. Wolverine was pretty awesome.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#138844: Jan 14th 2022 at 2:15:49 PM

It's kind of funny going back to watch Ultimate Avengers, which is technically the first Avengers movie to be made. That one took a lot more influence from The Ultimates (2002), except they got rid of all the edgy garbage like Hulk being a cannibal or Hank being an abusive asshole.

I actually watched it about a week before I saw the first Avengers film in theaters back when it first came out, so it was interesting to compare. The Chitauri retained their shapeshifting abilities from the comic, and I thought that would've been interesting to see that played out in the live-action film just for all the chaos that would cause. Of course, now that we have the Skrulls, we have a lot more opportunity to do that type of story.

Another thing I noted was how Ultimate Avengers actually gave more time to focus on Steve's feelings of isolation after he was thawed out, and showing him having to deal with most of his loved ones either being dead or senior citizens. I know the MCU film had similar scenes that were ultimately cut out, but it was something I noticed watching those two so close together.

It's also interesting since this was made about a year after the Winter Soldier storyline in the comics, so Bucky is still alive... but he's just an old man.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#138845: Jan 14th 2022 at 2:22:10 PM

The comical thing is both using the Chitauri in completely opposite ways, with the Ultimate Avengers Chitauri being a near-unstoppable wrecking ball alien invasion (until they figure out their weakness, that is) while the movie Chitauri get absolutely whupped the moment they step up.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#138846: Jan 14th 2022 at 2:22:20 PM

The movie came out in 2006 a year after the Winter Soldier storyline but is based on a comic that came out in 2002 made 3 years before the Winter Soldier concept was prolly in development.

Incredible to think about. The woman Bucky married isn't Peggy, its Gail Richard's who is a character exclusive to the Ultimate Comics setting.

Edited by slimcoder on Jan 14th 2022 at 2:22:52 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#138847: Jan 14th 2022 at 2:58:08 PM

Marvel recently put out a little Hawkeye animated short, and if they ever go into animated movies again I think the medium would be an excellent fit for adapting the Fraction/Aja run’s style.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jan 14th 2022 at 2:58:22 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#138848: Jan 14th 2022 at 8:58:49 PM

Really interesting thing about these movies is that they do act as time capsules of the current state of Marvel before recognizable additions and changes became regarded as common.

Like how people would be confused why Bucky is an old man in Ultimate Avengers instead of the Winter Soldier. Because that was made before the WS identity became the standard for Bucky. Bucky not being the Winter Soldier is unthinkable now.

Or say someone watches Spider-Verse and they go to a previous Spider-Man thing like Spectacular and be confused over why Gwen doesn't have powers or where is Miles. This can also apply to Venom since the movies is the first instance of Venom's more heroic characterization actually appearing in an adaptation.

Its interesting how the property's evolved.

[up] Damn I would watch a cartoon about that.

Edited by slimcoder on Jan 14th 2022 at 8:59:20 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#138849: Jan 15th 2022 at 3:11:00 AM

Black Panther: Wakanda Forever will resume shooting next week for a four week period; issues regarding whether Letitia Wright is vaccinated have been "resolved"; the restart is not expected to impact the movie’s release date

From what I've heard Disney used the whip to get her vaccinated. Not sure why they didn't just recast but okay.

Though something interesting.

Separately, sources say the Winston Duke, who plays M’Baku, negotiated a hefty raise for his return to Black Panther, due to what is being described as an expanded role in the Panther mythos. What that expansion looks like is unclear.

So M'Baku Black Panther? Would be down for that. Winston is way less toxic than Letita.

Edited by miraculous on Jan 15th 2022 at 3:11:15 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#138850: Jan 15th 2022 at 3:17:37 AM

Huh, so let's hope Letitia saw reason.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian

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