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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
I think I can add Wanda to that mix, since WandaVision finally gives Wanda room to be more central to the plot as opposed to be a benchwarmer who takes a backseat to other characters.
Okey Dokey!So...general question about the pre-Disney TV shows. Given the re-incorporation of a few characters in the mainline MCU, I'm wondering which shows are worth checking out? I'm still not interested in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D due to how long and weird it supposedly gets, but I do want to check out some of the Netflix shows and Agent Carter. I'm planning to watch Daredevil in its entirety, but I also keep hearing good things about Jessica Jones and The Punisher.
What I want to know is: are any of the shows required to watch before/during Daredevil, rather than just being optional checkout options?
"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."I'd recommend treating the Netflix shows like a single 13-season show, instead of as six individual shows, for the full experience. While it does have low points (Iron Fist S1, Jessica Jones S2) I'd say the package as a whole is still very enjoyable to watch in its entirety and worth the time, even at its lowest.
The watching order is the same as the release order: Daredevil S1 -> Jessica Jones S1 -> Daredevil S2 -> Luke Cage S1 -> Iron Fist S1 -> Defenders -> Punisher S1 -> Jessica Jones S2 -> Luke Cage S2 -> Iron Fist S2 -> Daredevil S3 -> Punisher S2 -> Jessica Jones S3
But if you don't care about that or don't have time to watch them all...
- Daredevil's first two seasons can be watched standalone, but season 3 absolutely requires Defenders.
- Jessica Jones' entire series is largely self-contained, and even mostly ignores her role in Defenders, but there's a scene in season 3 that hits harder if you watched Luke Cage's second season.
- Luke Cage's first season requires Jessica Jones' first season for context, and his second season requires Defenders.
- Iron Fist's first season is fairly standalone but makes more sense if you've watched Daredevil's first two seasons. Iron Fist's second season requires Defenders. Luke Cage's second season also helps but is not mandatory.
- Defenders itself is ideally watched after all five prior seasons, but you can get away with just Daredevil's two. Iron Fist helps provide a little more context, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage are largely unneeded as long as you're vaguely aware of the characters from them.
- Punisher requires Daredevil's second season to get started, but after that is fully self-contained.
Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Dec 30th 2021 at 5:08:07 AM
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Yeah, Defenders is the only show necessary for Daredevil. While it follows up on plot points from Iron Fist, you can probably get away with just reading the first season's wikipedia page.
As for the others... well, if you've heard good things about them, I'd say just watch them. While that other universe stuff ![]()
hasn't been confirmed or denied yet, whether it's canon or not shouldn't prevent you from enjoying them. I'm doubtful Cloak and Dagger will ever get mentioned again, but I still liked getting to explore all the cool Voodoo stuff.
Even the worst of the shows have something vaguely worthwhile to offer. Except, of course, for Inhumans and Helstrom, the latter of which actually has been officially decanonized. Both are garbage.
Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Dec 30th 2021 at 2:07:49 AM
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If you're that interested then I definitely recommend watching them all if you have the time. Then you don't even have to worry about which shows require which.
I'm in the process of rewatching them all myself. Currently in Jessica Jones' second season, and while I consider it the worst of all 13, I'm still having fun.
As for the shows' canonicity... Vincent D'onofrio says the Kingpin in Hawkeye is the same Kingpin from Daredevil and not just some hard-reboot version, for what it's worth.
Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Dec 30th 2021 at 5:18:48 AM
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Since Marvel seems interested in bringing back some pre-Disney+ show characters, I'd really like them to bring back Quake from Agents of Shield, liked her character and actress a lot. Could still have the show be her origin as Broad Strokes canon as well, it's only really the last bit that conflicts with the main MCU. Ghost Rider was also really good, so I wouldn't mind him returning either.
Unfortunately, Agents seems to be the unloved stepchild of the TV shows so far. Which is ironic, given how many times it crossed over in it's early days.
That said, I would love it, of course. Though it would have to retcon it's last two Season out of existence in order to fit, no way around it.
Which is how I would've prefered it to end anyways, tbh. Season 5 was the perfect ending.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianHere, I made a flowchart for both watching all the shows in order, and for watching just specific ones.
Solid line means mandatory viewing, dotted line means not mandatory, but helpful. Note that while there isn't a direct line connecting them, obviously you'd wanna watch Luke Cage or Iron Fist's first seasons before their second seasons. You just gotta watch Defenders in-between.
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Yeah. The irony of Agents, the show that tried the hardest to tie itself to the MCU being the one that seems to have become completely non canon is frustrating.
And it seems to be entirely due to the shit between Feige and Permulter.
I assumed they wouldn't really do it due to the series popularity, but it seems that's not nearly enough.
I figured they'd at least reveal it happened somewhere in another branch of the Sacred Timeline, but nope.
They may not have officially given the word (and they might not for now) but AOS has more than likely been Exiled from Continuity.
One Strip! One Strip!I'm sorry if this comes off as rude, but do we really have to go through the mopey "oh, what a shame, too bad it can't work" thing every single time the show gets brought up? Seriously, every single time someone mentions it there's five proceeding posts lamenting how it's not canon. Can we not just enjoy the show?
....You know what?
You're right.
It happened. It sucks. But that's how it is.
Maybe something to change that will happen down the line, but for now it is what it is.
...Now, everyone feel free to remember this if I complain about it again. I have an admitted issue with Aesop Amnesia that I've yet to overcome.
One Strip! One Strip!Ehh, sort of. What he said was this:
We can sell that character in so many facets. Story-wise we can sell it, if we keep him based in that emotional life. And I know that the writers, and the producers, and me, and everybody involved in the Hawkeye show, we were all on the same page about that. I have to say that they're very collaborative people and – not only to mention awesome people, very nice – but the producers, like I said, the writers and the directors were all just thrilled to work with so we kept along those lines. And I think that's what will continue to make the character interesting if there's anything next for me to do."
You'll notice that at no point does D'Onofrio actually say that the Netflix Kingpin is canon to the MCU Kingpin. What he said was that Marvel Studios tries to "connect as many dots" to the original 616 Marvel Comics as they possibly can, and have done the same with the DareDevil series. They've connected whatever dots they can to the original Netflix shows, and won't connect the dots that they can't.
So. That means that Netflix Dare Devil is about as canon to the MCU as the legendary Born Again arc of DareDevil (issues 227-233) is. Everyone's taking this as "NETFLIX SHOWS CANONIZED" but all he really said was that they want to retain the emotional core of his performance, to sell the same kind of Kingpin that the Netflix shows gave us, while still changing details such as making him much more powerful.
He's talking about the performance and presentation of his character, not the lore. Because. Y'know. He is an actor and that part of the story is the part that's his job. Lore questions should be directed to writers and producers.
Edited by TobiasDrake on Dec 30th 2021 at 3:29:56 AM
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.That's what I'm here for, Rob. To smack sense back into you when you forget your own repetitiveness.
As Rob demonstrated, it seems to be more about it's connection to the MCU proper then the show itself. It was allowed to do it's own thing but Daddy and Mommy Marvel were often away from home so it never got much attention and when they did come home, AOS had to move it's life around to accommodate them but never really vice-versa.
I haven't watched it too far but I heard things get interesting in the middle of season one so I'm willing to get back into it some day.
The Curse of the Media Backlog is strong with me.
Edited by fredhot16 on Dec 30th 2021 at 4:01:34 AM
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.![]()
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Right, my mistake. Even so, it's good that even if the canon itself is nebulous, the characterization and performance is the same, aside from slightly more comic-book-y physics.
Anyway, rewatching Jessica Jones season 2, and I actually laughed out loud when a frustrated Trish said "They're killers! They'll kill again! That's what killers do!" Pretty ironic as of season 3.

I personally was a big fan of Jimmy Woo. I was lukewarm towards him in Ant-Man and the Wasp, but they really made him likeable and cool(ish) in WandaVision. Really hope we get to see him more in the future, maybe as a new-age Phil Coulson or something.
In terms of the string women, I also thought Yelena was pretty cool, and I think Monica is underrated. But I dunno man, Contessa Valentina Allegra de Fontaine still really strikes me. I know she hasn't really done much yet, but she has such a strong presence and looks damn cool.
"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."