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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

FGHIK Since: Aug, 2013
#138326: Dec 23rd 2021 at 8:36:12 PM

Regarding multiverse contradictions, I like to think of it as a "multiverse of multiverses". So just as there are infinite universes, there are infinite multiverses combining all those universes in every possible way. And the boundaries between all those universes and multiverses vary in strength, but there have to be some that are entirely unbreakable, which is why the "destruction of the multiverse" in one story doesn't effect every other story, or our own reality.

Am I taking this too seriously? Probably.

lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#138327: Dec 23rd 2021 at 8:37:45 PM

Funnily enough, Marvel's official stance is that we did all die in Secret Wars.

As opposed to DC, who as soon as Crisis on Infinite Earths happened stopped pretending that Earth-Prime was ever actually our real world.

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#138328: Dec 23rd 2021 at 8:41:17 PM

Except when they need to take a swipe at Superboy-Prime

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#138329: Dec 23rd 2021 at 8:42:53 PM

Isn't a "multiverse of multiverses" called the omniverse? At least, I think that's what it's called when it's brought up in versus debates and that.

... Man, I didn't think I needed an advanced physics degree to understand superhero universes, but here we are. tongue

FGHIK Since: Aug, 2013
#138330: Dec 23rd 2021 at 9:06:25 PM

[up] Yeah, the omniverse is the ultimate top-level set that contains literally every other set of multiverses. But by simple logic, we know that any story that claims to operate at that level is false. If I write a story where Evil Batman destroys the omniverse thanks to millenia of prep-time, I'm wrong and he actually only destroyed a multiverse set one level below it at the most. Because we're still here, other universes are still here. That's why it has to be literally impossible to cross multiverses at this level, no matter what powers or magic or cosmic keystones or super science you have. If it wasn't, then not every possible universe could exist at once. For every universe like ours, you could imagine countless other universes invading it. So there couldn't be one that hasn't been unless there are some unbreakable barriers.

Again, I've spent way too long thinking about something that might not even exist.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138331: Dec 23rd 2021 at 11:22:25 PM

Incoming Multiverse rambling. Apologies if this is a bit much.

Y'know, there's something really Fridge Horror about how the Multiverse just comes into existence and how it affects the past. Like...imagine being in one of those alternate universes seen in What If, and how mind-melting it would be to discover your life is spiraling in a direction it wasn't supposed to go in because some lady from an alternate future killed a guy. Would you be grateful if your life was better, or depressed that your life is significantly worse? Or would it be the other way around?

One of the things that also intrigues me about the Multiverse is that from the Sacred Timeline's standpoint, the Multiverse's existence almost feels like some kind of Schrödinger's Cat. If you were to follow the MCU's Sacred Timeline with the knowledge of what Multiverse actually is, it feels like it simultaneously exists and doesn't exist. Because the Sacred Timeline doesn't seem to become affected by any of the branching timelines seen earlier in its history until during/after Endgame, from the characters' perspective, you can't really tell that the Multiverse's formation is happening at all. Unless you're one of those branching timelines, and you're now on a different path. And even then, you wouldn't know it unless you have some crazy omnipotence.

I guess one question I have is: is Doctor Strange and/or the TVA going to have to destroy the Multiverse and create another Sacred Timeline to prevent reality from breaking down? And if so, how are the countless variants of many universes going to feel about their lives and the world(s) they live in having to go up in smoke?

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#138332: Dec 24th 2021 at 7:41:01 AM

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if the different animated versions appeared as cameos in animated films, even the ones that were supposedly killed in the spider-verse (comic).

As far as I'm concerned, the versions that came out in the comic crossover are only variants of similar universes, and those that appear in movies are the "originals."

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#138333: Dec 24th 2021 at 7:47:42 AM

wrong post.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Dec 24th 2021 at 7:49:37 AM

Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#138334: Dec 24th 2021 at 8:04:27 AM

Erm, to the people being weirded out with America being a name, well, the continent was named after a man.

Same with Europe/Europa AFAIK, both the Eurasian peninsula and the Jovian moon get their name from the queen of Crete who happened to be quite fond of bulls.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#138335: Dec 24th 2021 at 8:06:59 AM

Don't forget Columbia being named after Columbus

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
Diana1969 Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#138337: Dec 24th 2021 at 11:27:59 AM

All this talk of multiverse hullabaloo just makes me feel like Austin Powers when he's trying to make sense of time travel and says "Oh no, I've gone crosseyed".

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#138338: Dec 24th 2021 at 11:33:25 AM

I still maintain my position that adaptations are a separate multiverse.

And any crossover between a comic universe and an adaptation universe is not canon for the adaptation.

Altris from the Vortex Since: Aug, 2019 Relationship Status: Not caught up in your love affair
#138339: Dec 24th 2021 at 11:36:17 AM

[up]x2 That seems to be my default response to universe-time-space-continuum shenanigans.

So, let's hang an anchor from the sun... also my Tumblr
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#138340: Dec 24th 2021 at 11:38:39 AM

At least there's still one Earth in the MCU,the comics have Earths by the number

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#138341: Dec 24th 2021 at 12:22:27 PM

I think the Infinite Hotel Paradox is a good thing for people to get familiar with when it comes to all this multiversal talk. Primarily because of the main concept that not all infinities are equal.

Rick and Morty's Central Finite Curve is actually a good example of this in action. The Council of Ricks take the entire multiverse and cordon off a sliver that contains all the universes where a Rick is the top dog. And the Curve's multiverse is clearly countably infinite, but at the same time logically cannot be greater than the greater multiverse as a whole.

The Marvel and DC multiverses can be thought of similarly, where you have this big "Marvel Omniverse" and "DC Omniverse" that contain everything they've every done, but then those contain their own multiverses and everything can intersect with each other every which way. The Arrowverse canonically consists of basically every live-action DC adaptation...and not really much beyond that, despite there clearly being more. The comics line being canon is something only a comic tie-in really suggests, and even then the more important discrepency is the Arrowverse flat-out ignoring the whole 52-universes gimmick of the comics to begin with.

Surely an MCU multiverse that consists at this point of every live-action Marvel thing (and a few animated things), one that was initially confined by the TVA before being sprawled out totally and retroactively, is fair game. tongue

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#138342: Dec 24th 2021 at 12:33:00 PM

Plus, if the multiverse encompasses all possible universes, then whenever you travel to a different universe, that universe will branch in two: one branch where you arrived there from your own universe, and one where you didn't.

Heck, even if someone creates a multiverse destroying energy wave or whatever, while they might destroy an infinite number of universes, in the process of doing so they might also create an infinite number of universes where the multiverse destroying energy wave failed.

Edited by RavenWilder on Dec 24th 2021 at 12:33:43 PM

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138343: Dec 24th 2021 at 3:28:37 PM

Quick question, are we a hundred percent certain that the alternate Doctor Strange seen in Multiverse of Madness's trailer is Strange Supreme? I was initially certain it was him, but considering how muted his live-action appearance is compared to his animated one, now I'm not so sure.

I get that animation tends to exaggerate the colors of certain things at times, but honestly I can barely tell if his skin complexion is paler than Sacred Timeline Strange or not.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#138344: Dec 24th 2021 at 3:34:21 PM

they missed an opptunity to call him Stranger The Danger

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#138345: Dec 24th 2021 at 3:38:07 PM

I'm fairly certain it's not Strange Supreme, tbh. It doesn't really look like him. Strange Supreme has a fairly distinctive appearance and color scheme that that brief blip in the trailer lacks.

My guess is it's the same thing as Evil Rey in the TROS trailer. An evil illusion, a prophetic hallucination, etc and so on.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Dec 24th 2021 at 3:39:12 AM

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#138346: Dec 24th 2021 at 3:57:38 PM

If Strange Supreme does show up in this movie, I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up pulling a Face–Heel Turn.

After all, if he were to find out that not only is Christine Palmer's death not a Nexus Event/Absolute Point in time, but that she's actually alive in the Sacred Timeline, I can see him potentially going mad from the revelation, and deciding to turn to villainy again out of spite.

Either that, or maybe he's just there to provide a cautionary warning for his Sacred Timeline self.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#138348: Dec 24th 2021 at 6:00:39 PM

Mr. Normal

He has a doctorate but he doesn't really stress about titles

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#138349: Dec 24th 2021 at 6:03:23 PM

And his deadliest Variant of all:

"Gentlemen...BEHOLD!"

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#138350: Dec 24th 2021 at 9:10:28 PM

It's amazing the things one notices when they have too much free time on their hands. This has to be intentional or very coincidental, having Wanda emulating Natasha's hairstyles.

Edited by dmcreif on Dec 24th 2021 at 12:12:41 PM

Okey Dokey!

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