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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#136326: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:15:39 PM

I think he's still dead.

Super dead in fact.

About as dead as you can possibly get.

Vision accidentally mooshed him and Ultron together. Then his soul got eaten by the Soul Gem and then double eaten by a monster inside the Soul Gem. And now the Soul Gem is best friends with a little robot boy and Ultron is going around thinking he's Hank just because he's coated in meat.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#136327: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:16:24 PM

[up][up][up]I say that because he comic... somewhat treats him as one? It's a bit weird how Unstoppable Wasp treats him in general, TBH. Sometimes he's a great inspirational figure to tell stories about, and sometimes he's "that wifeslapping asshole" again.

Granted that's a problem with the comics depicting him in general, but still.

Edited by lbssb on Oct 27th 2021 at 9:18:00 AM

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136328: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:18:16 PM

Oh fuck of course they do that. The one time and no one forgets. Even though the majority of Avengers have done plenty worse.

Fuck Janet was dating Iron Man at the time, and he's a fucking facist yet no one had any real problems with him.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 27th 2021 at 9:19:44 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#136329: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:21:18 PM

The weird thing is that it's never really brought up that he also unleashed a Killer Robot on the rest of the Avengers so that he could "save" them from it and get some cred back. He hit Jan because she found out and was trying to stop him.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#136330: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:24:13 PM

Weirdly Hank's infamous for like one of the least bad things he did that day.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#136331: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:25:09 PM

Yeah, I read your blog entry on that issue. Hank did and said some pretty fucked up shit that day.

Disgusted, but not surprised
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#136332: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:27:22 PM

I still don't understand why so many people hate Ant-Man and the Wasp. Yeah it's not exactly record-breaking by any means, but it's still a fun flick. I also like how the climax has everyone weaving through San Francisco in an epic chase scene.

Agreed. The stakes are smaller than the film it came out after, and it's refreshing. There's no villain plotting to destroy the world or take over the world. It's all about saving Janet from the Quantum Realm while other parties get in the way for their own reasons.

The opposing parties aren't villains either, just antagonists. Sonny Burch wants to steal the Quantum technology for money. Ghost wants to save her own life but never kills anyone besides that dirty FBI agent in Sonny's pocket. Then you’ve got Jimmy enforcing Scott's house arrest.

Edited by dmcreif on Oct 27th 2021 at 12:34:13 PM

Okey Dokey!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136333: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:30:11 PM

Thats the funny thing, everyone always holds Hank against that one specific thing. Even aside from doing other bad stuff he gets so much grief over it that in Secret Empire Tony straight-up tells Pymtron that Hank slapping Janet is somehow single-handily responsible for every bad thing that happened to the Avengers.

Like if we're holding Hank's actions against then everyone else is free game really. Tony and Captain Marvel are facists, as well as Reed Richards who especially created the Negative Zone prison along with being a terrible husband and father. Then there's a third of the Avengers being former supervillains, Wanda losing her mind at multiple times, Mockingbird lying about being raped and then having a guy killed just to cover up an affair, and thanks to Secret Empire at least half of the Avengers are now former Nazis including Captain America.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#136334: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:32:53 PM

[up][up] Are you agreeing with me, or do you dislike those things? Sorry, I just can't tell the tone of what you're saying.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#136335: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:33:51 PM

[up] Agreeing

Okey Dokey!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136336: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:36:19 PM

Plus there was that one time Wolverine set-up X-Force so they could murder a child.

Out a team comprised of Logan, Psylocke, Archangel, Fantomex, and Deadpool, literally only Deadpool was completely against it.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#136337: Oct 27th 2021 at 9:37:19 PM

Its weird for modern comics to harp on that moment as well because the immediate aftermath of the actual book doesn't treat it that way.

Marvel turned Hank Pym into wife slap guy all by themselves because he had a lot of content over the years between the Trial of Yellowjacket arc and modern days where he just kept going. Stayed away from superheroics for a while, became a superhero again. Him and Janet tried dating again before ultimately not working out.

It was a bad thing he did on an exceptionally bad day but it wasn't his single defining characteristic.

And now it is. And its something Marvel did to itself.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#136338: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:19:51 PM

Weirdly Hank's infamous for like one of the least bad things he did that day.

Basically because hitting your partner is something we have real life perspectives about, creating a killer robot not so much (yet.) It feels more realistic and therefore like more personal harm.

It's a bit weird how Unstoppable Wasp treats him in general, TBH. Sometimes he's a great inspirational figure to tell stories about, and sometimes he's "that wifeslapping asshole" again.

I think it’s more complex about him. It’s made evident that Nadia holds a very idealized image of him because she never met Hank, which devastates her when she learns he’s done bad things too. The story also implies Hank was dealing with untreated bipolar disorder. Janet urges Nadia to not paint Hank as completely good or evil, and accept that one can be capable of both.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Oct 27th 2021 at 10:25:09 AM

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136340: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:23:13 PM

That would actually mean more if Hank actually shown consistent pattern of abuse. Which he doesn't, its basically just an accident done in the middle of a mental breakdown.

Which again Reed is more of an actually abusive husband. He actually does treat Sue like crap a lot of the time.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#136341: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:30:42 PM

I blame Mark Millar's Ultimates for this because its easy to do and fun too.

But seriously aside from porting over some jerkassery that infected the heroes circa around abouts Civil War, the infamy of Hank's abuse of Jan in that continuity has been conflated into the 616.

Not helped by Chuck Austen's short run on Avengers in 2004 where he introduced the idea that it wasn't a one off incident, that Hank abused Jan a lot and that the other Avengers knew and were appalled. But also never did anything about it.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#136342: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:31:02 PM

And it's important to note that the breakdown he had when he slapped Janet was like...his fourth or fifth.

Hank Pym has never been a well man.

His first breakdown happened when his first wife (who would be Nadia's mother) was murdered. Dude's had a rough life.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136343: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:32:28 PM

He has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder so really is a very unwell man.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#136344: Oct 27th 2021 at 10:38:54 PM

One comic also had him reveal that he had an inferiority complex towards his fellow Avengers, Tony Stark in particular. Even before that comic, Hank was often defined as feeling inadequate compared to the other Avengers. He basically felt like an ordinary man trying to measure up to gods.

Disgusted, but not surprised
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#136345: Oct 27th 2021 at 11:34:42 PM

I've never seen anyone hating on Ant-Man and the Wasp. Its issue seems to be more that it's considered solid but unremarkable and forgettable, and I honestly can't disagree? I had a blast in the theater but don't really remember a ton of the scenes that were in it outside of Jimmy Woo, Scott's home arrest, and Ghost.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#136346: Oct 27th 2021 at 11:51:25 PM

One thing I've noticed about MCU Scott is that he doesn't have much character development. But then again, he doesn't need much. He started out as a Screw the Rules, I'm Doing What's Right! guy who loves his daughter, and he more or less stays that way even after becoming a superhero.

Disgusted, but not surprised
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#136347: Oct 27th 2021 at 11:55:04 PM

I do hope next time Ghost appears she picks up on her comic counterparts more wackier traits cause from what I read comic-Ghost is a hoot.

He’s this insane weirdo who can’t stand social interactions, is a total slob who never cleans out his suit even after vomiting in his helmet, and is so insanely anti-corporation that Tony apparently once got him to stop fighting by telling him he’s broke meaning he’s no longer a rich guy which got Ghost to back off immediately.

He’s a crazy-ass mofo and I so want to see that on the big-screen. [lol]

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#136348: Oct 28th 2021 at 1:01:31 AM

As far as the bad hygiene goes, have you seen MCU Ghost's teeth? tongue

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#136349: Oct 28th 2021 at 7:24:07 AM

He’s this insane weirdo who can’t stand social interactions, is a total slob who never cleans out his suit even after vomiting in his helmet, and is so insanely anti-corporation that Tony apparently once got him to stop fighting by telling him he’s broke meaning he’s no longer a rich guy which got Ghost to back off immediately.

Wait? Does Ghost attack rich people on general principle? Like, he doesn't care how they use their money, he'll go after them just because their rich?

One Strip! One Strip!
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#136350: Oct 28th 2021 at 7:54:22 AM

[up][up] Must be hard to brush when you're intangible.

Okey Dokey!

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