TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134776: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:30:35 PM

Like I can get DD showing up for a team-up, that is within the realm of possibility as unlikely as it is.

But Echo being a set-up for a new DD show is bullshit. Hell Echo itself is a spin-off of Hawkeye, so what the fuck would this be? A spin-off of a spin-off, how fucking recursive are we gonna get?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#134777: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:32:27 PM

People just want the MCU to throw away everything new they're trying to set up and instead put all of their time and effort into retconning every previous Marvel show or movie into the MCU.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#134778: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:39:18 PM

Watch they bring back Daredevil... but it's the Ben Affleck version. I would use that salt on my fries evil grin

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#134779: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:40:32 PM

Yeah, people are really going all in with these trojan horse theories. "Wandavision is actually going to be about canonizing the X-Men!" "Dr. Strange 2 is actually going to be about Wanda, and also about canonizing the X-Men!" "Spider-Man No Way Home is going to be Dr. Strange 1.5, and is going to minimize MCU Peter in favor of Raimi and Garfield Peter!" "Guardians 3 is going to be a Thor movie!"

And now "Echo is actually going to be about Daredevil."

A lot of the way you can tell these theories aren't accurate is in how often people forget that thse shows are going to be about the people they're stated to be about, and how often people forget that "X character is appearing in this story" isn't the same as "X character is going to be taking over this story entirely."

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:41:18 PM

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134780: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:48:49 PM

Yeah. As others have said, they seem to be more invested in fanservice than in actual stories.

"Dr. Strange 2 is actually going to be about Wanda, and also about canonizing the X-Men!"

And another reason I know the Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness leaks are fake is because if they are true, I honestly don’t know how they'd redeem or even get the audience to sympathize with Wanda in later movies/shows.

Okey Dokey!
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#134781: Oct 2nd 2021 at 12:50:02 PM

Blatant fanservice dished out to cater to nostalgic fans is a poison to any future works, and is always a horrible idea.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134783: Oct 2nd 2021 at 1:01:58 PM

Oh fuck right No Way Home.

That prolly doesn’t help with perception.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 2nd 2021 at 1:03:53 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#134784: Oct 2nd 2021 at 1:04:18 PM

It would be a devilish thing to do for sure.

They wouldn't dare.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#134785: Oct 2nd 2021 at 1:06:38 PM

their Shoulder Devil and Shoulder Angel are arguing about it

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134786: Oct 2nd 2021 at 1:59:33 PM

For what it's worth, I think Charles Murphy can describe it best: "Surrounding Alaqua Cox, in her own series, by a primarily white cast who don’t look like her would be nothing short of insulting and undermine having made her the star to begin with."

Okey Dokey!
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#134787: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:27:53 PM

Does Echo have a primarily Native supporting cast?

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134788: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:31:07 PM

I don't think she even has her own supporting cast, she hasn't even had her own comic before.

Before she was basically a supporting character to Daredevil then Moon Knight before being killed off in the latter's comic.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:38:27 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#134789: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:32:37 PM

She’s Phoenix now

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#134790: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:33:16 PM

One thing the theory does have going for it (and, imo, the only reason it's gotten as far as it did as even halfway credible) is that Echo doesn't really have a setting of her own and kind of weaves in and out of the stories of Marvel's other street level heroes, which includes Daredevil (including major role from the Kingpin) but also Moon Knight, Hawkeye, etc.

The theory is just taking that opening all the way and going "it's gonna be Daredevil Season 4!"

She's one of those characters who has a hand in everything and no specific place, though. As [up] says, she's the freakin' Pheonix right now.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:34:30 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134791: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:34:30 PM

[up][up] And her first solo soon.

Which I believe is being written by a Native American writer so kudos there.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:34:57 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Aleistar Since: Feb, 2018 Relationship Status: Hugging my pillow
#134792: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:34:47 PM

Having only broad knowledge of Bendis/Maleev Daredevil (the run where she debuted), I believe Echo's father was an enforcer/friend to the Kingpin, and when he died Fisk took her in as a way of repaying her dad.

Edited by Aleistar on Oct 2nd 2021 at 5:37:02 AM

ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#134793: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:35:56 PM

Echo was not killed off in a comic written by her creator.

Different writers. Just like it was a third, separate person who wrote her return.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134794: Oct 2nd 2021 at 2:38:01 PM

Oh fuck I thought she was created by Bendis.

Shit my bad folks.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#134795: Oct 2nd 2021 at 3:31:39 PM

Echo's nothing like Daredevil anyway besides the both of them being examples of the Disability Superpower trope. Daredevil's a blind lawyer who fights with sticks, Echo's a deaf mobster's kid who can mimic people's fighting styles.

The legend has returned.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134796: Oct 2nd 2021 at 3:34:24 PM

So she has similar abilities to Taskmaster?

Have they ever met?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#134797: Oct 2nd 2021 at 3:35:19 PM

So, how much will they have to create to give her a supporting cast or whatever? Or any other characters in Marvel that could be included?

Edited by Blueace on Oct 2nd 2021 at 7:35:42 AM

Wake me up at your own risk.
lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#134798: Oct 2nd 2021 at 3:39:59 PM

Loki's never worked with the TVA before, and Shang-Chi's supporting cast was mostly original characters with a villain he's never actually met in the comics. Echo will probably be fine on that front.

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#134799: Oct 2nd 2021 at 4:37:13 PM

[up][up] It is possible that we'll see the Kingpin, given her backstory.

Beyond that, it's a toss up as to whether they'll give her a supporting cast of comics character or OCs to be honest. After Shang-Chi being full of Canon Foreigners, it's difficult to tell.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#134800: Oct 2nd 2021 at 5:30:12 PM

Yeah. As others have said, they seem to be more invested in fanservice than in actual stories.

This is what has me sour about a lot of MCU talk this year, up to and including the Venom 2 victory-lapping: it's not just that people are more invested in fanservice over storytelling, it's that to said people the fanservice is the only thing these movies are good for. It legitimately rattles me that the "craftsmanship" that people so often praise the MCU for achieving is possibly as simple as efficiently tying together lore and fanservice, past, present, and future. The MCU is by no means high art but I didn't think I was being an elitest fanboy dumb-dumb for thinking of the MCU as more than just vehicles for quips and punching.

And like, one thing I legitimately respect about the MCU is the level of legitimate care that's placed into the storytelling. When I brought up Perlmutter forcefully integrating all of the FoX-Men films, story be damned, I don't think I mentioned how critically and commercially acclaimed such a move would be. They could literally air-drop Hugh Jackman's Wolverine randomly from the bloody sky and receive thunderous applause. I like that there's a legitimate concern for introducing them naturally in the narrative, I like that they actually want to tell stories with themes and messages. If the Venoms prove anything it's that they could get away with so much less and I'm glad they try to have just a bit more meat to them than that.

For what it's worth, I think Charles Murphy can describe it best: "Surrounding Alaqua Cox, in her own series, by a primarily white cast who don’t look like her would be nothing short of insulting and undermine having made her the star to begin with."

I would agree with this too. An Echo show needs to be, deserves to be, an Echo show. They threaded the needle getting a deaf First Nations actress to play a deaf First Nations superheroine, literally plucked her out of school, and the worst thing they can do to her is exploit her show as a stealth revival of another series.

Edited by Watchtower on Oct 2nd 2021 at 8:31:44 AM


Total posts: 186,763
Top