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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#134451: Sep 25th 2021 at 4:37:13 PM

He had a moment very close to it in Infinity War with "BRING ME THAAANOS" but sadly they passed on the opportunity for him to just say "THANOS! WE WOULD HAVE WORDS WITH THEE/YOU!"

Incidentally in the ensemble films I think the two moments of Thor that really made an impact in audiences were "Bring me Thanos!" and him decking Hulk with the Mjolnir in The Avengers.

He could really have done with "Ultron! We would have words with thee." and "The difference between a god of thunder and a mortal man in a suit of armor".

Another moment I really missed in Thor's showing was "For Asgard!" "For Midgard!" "For MYSELF!", but that's more a Loki moment.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134452: Sep 25th 2021 at 4:58:29 PM

Though in regards to Thor him having cool moments is noticeable since he kinda gets really shat upon. It’s an odd thing but writers seem to fall back on him constantly being broken so he can rebuild himself back up only to be broken again leading to the same shit happening again.

In Ragnarok hammer is destroyed so he spends the movie to build himself back up, Infinity War he gets his shit kicked and people majorly killed so he spends the movie building himself back up, and in Endgame he undergoes depression and spends the movie building himself back up.

And of course this applies to the comics. The 2010s was effectively the Jane Foster era which began at 2013/2014 and meant that in order to prop up Jane, Thor was basically dogshit on being portrayed as this weak and pathetic thing whining about being worthy for the better part of a decade.

It’s like no one wants to do any other story for Thor other than the worthiness crap.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#134454: Sep 25th 2021 at 5:56:47 PM

So what you're telling me here is that the film's runtime is...eternal?

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134455: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:02:39 PM

In Ragnarok hammer is destroyed so he spends the movie to build himself back up, Infinity War he gets his shit kicked and people majorly killed so he spends the movie building himself back up, and in Endgame he undergoes depression and spends the movie building himself back up.

A lot of these issues probably stem from Thor being handled by so many different directors who do as they please and ignoring previously established things. I mean, in Ragnarok he loses his right eye, and Mjolnir, while tapping into his innate lightning powers. Then in the very next movie, Infinity War, they immediately do a 180 by giving him an electronic right eye and Stormbreaker.

Okey Dokey!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#134456: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:11:25 PM

I mean, he still has his innate lightning powers in Infinity War. Stormbreaker is an amplifier.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#134457: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:17:12 PM

[up][up]This is just comics writing basically [lol]

At least we actually see Thor change in Ragnarok; OTOH it feels like Bruce's development occurs mostly offscreen.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134458: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:20:47 PM

The point isn't that he gets a new weapon its that he gets his shit kicked and broken all over again.

Thor is consistently miserable these 3 movies straight.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#134459: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:22:54 PM

Well, Love and Thunder might change that.

And at the very least, he keeps coming back better and stronger.

Hell, once he loses the extra weight he put on during the five year gap, he might be stronger than ever.

....just...in time for Gorr the Godbutcher to probably make him question everything about himself since the whole point is that Gorr hates all gods equally and shit....

Shit.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#134460: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:23:39 PM

Really, him getting Stormbreaker is a continuation of the misery toboggan ride.

He unleashes his Full Real Power against Hela. And its not enough. He's got to blow up the entire kingdom with her on it.

Thanos kicks his shit in. He practically dies. He goes to Nidavellir to get a new weapon. And practically dies.

I don't see him getting an electronic eye from a butt and a new weapon as reversing course in that sense.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#134461: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:23:46 PM

I love Stormbreaker, but I do wish he kept the eyepatch look.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134462: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:41:25 PM

[up][up][up] What can Gorr even say at this point?

There are aren't even many Gods now. I think Thor is the last Asgardian deity and he well knows that Gods are not infallible after finding out about his father's imperialism.

Gorr's anti-God spiel has even less validity here and it never had any validity to begin with.

Edited by slimcoder on Sep 25th 2021 at 6:42:17 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#134463: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:42:31 PM

Gorr: “Gods suck!”

Thor: -lighting up a massive joint- “yup”

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#134464: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:44:52 PM

[up][up]Reportedly, Russell Crowe is playing Zeus in this movie, so yes, other gods do still exist.

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#134465: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:49:32 PM

With Thor, it's not even that he doesn't get big cool lines in the ensemble movies, he doesn't get one-to-one confrontations with most of the villains at all. Outside of the first movie, in which he got a lot of personal time with Loki, Thor doesn't really have a consistent emotional connection with the villains of the non-Thor films, not the way the other do.

Even in Infinity War, where he's trying to avenge Asgard after Thanos destroyed it, that doesn't end up translating into face time with the movie's antagonists. He gets a very pivotal two seconds with Thanos at the end of the film, but it's still two seconds.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 25th 2021 at 6:50:03 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134466: Sep 25th 2021 at 6:50:22 PM

Like you can't do another break the haughty because there's no haughty anymore.

Thor has been profoundly miserable for the past decade. The man has lost his family, his kingdom, his people have been whittled down to a fraction, he regards himself as a failure due to Thanos' snap happening.

What is even left for Gorr to take?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#134467: Sep 25th 2021 at 7:05:38 PM

Gorr will take.....

....HIS BEARD!

Truly, the most diabolical revenge he could have.

One Strip! One Strip!
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#134468: Sep 25th 2021 at 7:20:01 PM

What about his glorious golden locks?

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#134470: Sep 25th 2021 at 7:29:01 PM

wild mass guessGorr will take away Thor’s Fortnite account.wild mass guess

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#134471: Sep 25th 2021 at 8:36:56 PM

It's pretty common for superheroes to get stuck on a specific bit. Iron Man gets the "tony fucks up and has to atone" and Thor gets the "he has to hit the dumps and prove his worthiness every time", Cap gets "he angsts about being a man out of time", e.t.c

Thor struggled a lot because the drastically contrasting and inconsistent creative visions for him. Personally I thought the best Thor ever looked in the MCU was during Infinity War with the revenge and Stormbreaker storyline. Waiti's "human golden retriever" approach to Thor is fun too, but I really like him as more intense and gritty. Thor holding the sun forge open with his bare hands as it sears and almost kills him is a pretty classic Walt Simonson-esque Thor moment of superhuman resilience and sacrifice.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134472: Sep 25th 2021 at 8:59:54 PM

Infinity War is more cosmic adventurer and Godlike.

Man Thor does not feel like a God at times, he’s way too vulnerable.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#134473: Sep 25th 2021 at 9:11:09 PM

Gorr: “Gods suck!”

Thor: -lighting up a massive joint- “yup”

That actually happened in the comics (minus the joint). Thor came to believe that gods like himself failed mortals so badly that none of them were worthy of worship anymore. It was bad enough that he couldn't lift Mjolnir for a while.

A joint would be ooc anyway — Thor's drug of choice is alcohol.

Edited by M84 on Sep 26th 2021 at 12:12:19 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134474: Sep 25th 2021 at 9:14:39 PM

Why would failing us be that bad a thing? It’s not like mortals are any worse than Gods.

Thor’s such a drama queen.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#134475: Sep 25th 2021 at 9:16:15 PM

Because gods in the Marvel verse used that as justification to have authority over mortals too in a "listen to us because we know better" way.

If they're not actually better, then they're just assholes using their power to lord it over others.

There's a bit of that in the MCU too, with Thor: Ragnarok revealing that Asgard gained its power and wealth the way real life empires did — through bloody expansionism. Makes it more fitting that Big Bad Hela's power-set in that movie was based off of Gorr's All-Black.

Edited by M84 on Sep 26th 2021 at 12:20:39 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised

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