TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134151: Sep 22nd 2021 at 9:00:27 AM

And of course it varies by character but for people like Scarlet Witch and Vision, the Avengers definitely were their real family.

I feel like WandaVision drives this home more than anything, given that when Agatha gets to the post-Age of Ultron flashback, present Wanda frames the scene this way:

Agatha: Ooh, Wanda, moving on up! So where are we now?
Wanda: The Avengers Compound. It was the first home Vision and I ever shared. Pietro was dead, and I was in a new country; I was all alone.

Edited by dmcreif on Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:00:38 PM

Okey Dokey!
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#134152: Sep 22nd 2021 at 9:16:30 AM

Thing with the Avengers is, they're usually a mix of characters who have their own, ongoing series, and characters who (while they might make guest spots elsewhere) only make regular appearances in Avengers stories.

So for some of them, the Avengers are just co-workers and casual friends, ones they hang out with when their solo series (where all their most important stories and relationships happen) don't keep them busy. While for others, the Avengers comprise all of their closest relationships (at least for the time they spend on the team). So saying "the Avengers are a found family" requires specifying "which Avengers are we talking about?"

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#134153: Sep 22nd 2021 at 9:46:55 AM

The avengers feels like a club. For some people clubs are their life, for others they're political, and for others it's just something they do.

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134154: Sep 22nd 2021 at 10:06:02 AM

Think about how they do tryouts. You get to join if you defeat an existing member.

Wanda passed her tryout:

And Scott his:

Of course, I keep thinking Scott should've been like, "Can we just talk about the fact that I fought Captain America before he was even Captain America?" when talking about it with Hank and Hope afterwards.[lol]

Okey Dokey!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#134155: Sep 22nd 2021 at 10:25:04 AM

Hah. Scott can honestly say he once beat up Captain America.[lol]

One Strip! One Strip!
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#134156: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:06:14 AM

Which is quite funny given how much he worships Cap. He's gonna have to say it and then quickly clarify he doesn't mean Steve - he calls him Steve because they got real close you see - but Sam, even though Sam is a cool guy because he was almost as close with Steve as Scott was.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134157: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:11:13 AM

On further thought places like Avengers Mansion does give them a local to hang-out in their downtime.

Ya gotta love pool parties.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#134158: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:13:03 AM

Ugh. I'll never get the sensation of sexualizing cartoons^^

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134159: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:17:24 AM

So some anime anyone? tongue

Edited by slimcoder on Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:17:33 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#134160: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:17:47 AM

i'd hardly call that sexualisation, fan service yes however

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#134161: Sep 22nd 2021 at 11:23:07 AM

Too bad for Hawkeye. He really needed to work on his tan.

Wake me up at your own risk.
Whowho Since: May, 2012
#134162: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:00:59 PM

I do like we got to see the Avengers hosting a party in Ao U, I definatly want to see superhero poker nights when The Thing gets his debut.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#134163: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:27:02 PM

I do get that the Avengers feel more like a government organization with team members and agents more than an actual family of choice ala Guardians of the Galaxy or X-Men. The fact that each Avengers member was hand-picked by Fury and his "employees" to hire the Avengers definitely helps give off that vibe. And for the most part, co-workers get along, but there are fights, some of them particularly nasty to the point you don't want to see those people ever again. Hence Civil War.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#134164: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:29:49 PM

I mean, Nat and Tony f.e. never really had much interaction, did they? And that is despite Nat debuting in an Iron Man movie.

Edited by Forenperser on Sep 22nd 2021 at 9:35:31 PM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#134165: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:30:54 PM

Amusingly Net and Tony did get married in the Ultimate Comics which is notable since the UC was a big source for the MCU.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#134166: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:31:46 PM

[up][up][up]I mean it depends. Some of them are clearly close.

Nat and Hawkeye, Nat and Steve, Tony and rhodey,

All together though uh...not really. Lol

Edited by miraculous on Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:32:01 PM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#134167: Sep 22nd 2021 at 12:43:20 PM

That is one issue with civil war is it try to have a emotional beat of tony and steven being friend turn enemies(since the whole "so was I") but it dosent particulary work snce before tony and cap barely seen to like each other, you can see wheedon and the russo did treat the whole thing diferent and it kinda shows.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#134168: Sep 22nd 2021 at 1:19:14 PM

[up] That is actually a fair point I never thought of before. Tony and Steve don't seem to be particularly close outside of combat or the Avengers as a whole. At least Ragnarok lampshaded that Bruce/Hulk and Thor barely knew each other even when on the team, and made it kind of a plot point for them to work together in spite of that.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#134169: Sep 22nd 2021 at 1:21:28 PM

Yeah, they really only got close during Endgame, come to think of it.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#134170: Sep 22nd 2021 at 1:22:00 PM

I would argue that Tony wasn't really a super close friend of anyone on the team barring Rhodey and I guess Bruce.

He proved to be a loyal teammate who you could mostly count on, but he tended to throw that all away on really stupid stunts.

One Strip! One Strip!
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134171: Sep 22nd 2021 at 1:35:35 PM

That is actually a fair point I never thought of before. Tony and Steve don't seem to be particularly close outside of combat or the Avengers as a whole. At least Ragnarok lampshaded that Bruce/Hulk and Thor barely knew each other even when on the team, and made it kind of a plot point for them to work together in spite of that.

I've seen it argued that the way Tony handled the PR fires concerning Wanda during Civil War further reinforces his disconnect from the other Avengers. Because he'd never gotten to know her, he probably viewed her as "the HYDRA asset that sweet-talked her way into a spot on the Avengers". Had he gotten to know her, he would've handled things differently than "intern her in the compound with Vision as her jailer".

Edited by dmcreif on Sep 22nd 2021 at 4:36:27 AM

Okey Dokey!
Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#134172: Sep 22nd 2021 at 2:21:40 PM

I mean, I'd agree with that assessment for the most part, thought I'd frame it more as "HYDRA asset who Cap and company took an inordinate amount of pity on". tongue

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134173: Sep 22nd 2021 at 2:48:20 PM

For Tony, it plays out like this:

The first time he encounters them is when Wanda ambushes him in Strucker's lab and gives him the vision of his dead teammates.

The second time he encounters the twins is on Klaue's ship. That fight ends with Wanda incapacitating everyone but Clint, while the Hulk goes on his rampage (to distract Tony).

The third time he encounters the twins is when they walk into Avengers Tower with Steve. He wasn't there in South Korea when they turned against Ultron and saved Steve's ass.

So it's a case of Tony not having the full picture everyone else has.

Okey Dokey!
Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#134174: Sep 22nd 2021 at 2:56:28 PM

If the only part he's missing is the part where the bad guys turned against the worse guy, and only then because he's functionally planning to destroy the planet, which they live on, I don't think he's missing an awful lot of the picture that matters.

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#134175: Sep 22nd 2021 at 3:14:05 PM

You wonder if Steve had some degree of sympathy for the twins that was influenced by what he had learned about what HYDRA did to Bucky. (The only real difference being that Wanda and Pietro volunteered for experimentation, Bucky didn't)

Okey Dokey!

Total posts: 186,763
Top