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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#132676: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:29:50 PM

[up] I've been running with the theory that they're not literally the same characters, but that Strange's spell rewrote Peter's past so that these versions of the characters came into existence in the MCU.

The further they go into "this is literally the X version of X character," the more they'll have to make the story of movie about those X versions rather than what they want the plot to be about.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 26th 2021 at 2:30:39 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#132677: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:30:14 PM

I'm guessing they're only from a universe very similar to the movie's ones, but not exactly the same.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#132678: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:33:43 PM

Maybe it's the Doc Ock from the David Koepp's original script for Spider-Man 2, who killed Peter's parents.

Also, that version of Doc Ock could use rotate his robot arms to fly like a friggin' helicopter.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#132679: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:34:04 PM

When Ock showed up the thought crossed my mind his motivation here would be trying to save Rosie (his wife and Morality Chain who passed away in Spider-Man 2, precipitating his fall to villainy). It would make sense, character-wise, for even the more heroic Ock we saw at the end of Spider-Man 2 to slide back to villainy if his goal is just to see his beloved Rosie again. It would also maintain the Tragic Villain aspect he had in spider-man 2 that's so beloved without repeating his arc all over again.

Granted, that'd be A) similar (though not exactly like) to Kingpin's motivation in Spiderverse B) very dependant on the context of Spider-Man 2.

Edited by Gaon on Aug 26th 2021 at 2:34:36 AM

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#132680: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:35:31 PM

But isn't he an undead corpse now?

Just Makima.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#132681: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:36:54 PM

You'd just need a handwave that he was simply knocked out by falling into the river and woke up conscious as he was being sunken to the depths. Tobias outlined last page that it's pretty boilerplate comic book Never Found the Body shenanigans.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#132682: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:37:28 PM

Molina claims his character would pick up from “that moment in the river” but I agree they probably won’t have a very detailed explanation given how many villains this movie has. They might just handwave it with “the tentacles took over his mind again”.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#132683: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:39:06 PM

That would be pretty lame though tbh. Would devalue his Heroic Sacrifice.

Just use some Multiverse Shennanigans, easier explanation (yes, I know how oxymoronic that must sound wink).

Anyways, my bet is that Norman will probably take center stage. He is pretty much the most vicious of all the villains confirmed so far. He is also far darker than any of the ones who have appeared in the previous movies yet. He will probably target Peter's loved ones without hesitation.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#132684: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:40:27 PM

wild mass guessOck literally just shows up to ask Peter for Aunt May's number.wild mass guess

Just use some Multiverse Shennanigans, easier explanation (yes, I know how oxymoronic that must sound wink).

Tbh, it's actually a harder explanation in the long run. It gets the characters to the universe faster, but makes everything surrounding them harder to explain - motivations, plot stakes, etc. Like, for instance, "why do these versions of the villains give a shit about this version of Peter, and vice versa?"

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 26th 2021 at 2:43:03 AM

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#132685: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:41:21 PM

Hey they both look younger thsn usual so...

Just Makima.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#132686: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:41:42 PM

-slaps-

NO

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#132687: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:46:03 PM

Huh the school will prolly be a backdrop this movie, prolly the first after the first 2 kept making it out like a big deal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#132688: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:49:49 PM

The further they go into "this is literally the X version of X character," the more they'll have to make the story of movie about those X versions rather than what they want the plot to be about

This was why I actually hoped those Evan Peters casting rumors were untrue, and ultimately liked that WandaVision didn't take the "mutant time!!!!" opportunity and focused solely on Wanda and her emotions.

I just pulled some crossover tropes from the Spider-Man: No Way Home page earlier today, too. Ain't no reason why they aren't just J. Jonah Jameson-type reprises.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#132689: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:50:57 PM

Despite how exciting this all sounds (and it's fantastic to see those actors again) I would say in my opinion this all is pretty risky, in my opinion. It's dredging up the baggage of three separate film franchises and continuities (Raimi trilogy, the Amazing duology and the MCU Spidey himself) into a single film with six villains that still has hooks from the previous film to solve. Not to mention context from the MCU at large (e.g Doctor Strange).

There's a lot that can go wrong here.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#132690: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:51:59 PM

[up] I agree, on top of Spider-Man usually being associated with more grounded stuff.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#132691: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:53:20 PM

As excited as I am yeah I agree, I honestly would have preferred something more grounded.

Like Hell are we ever gonna follow up on Gargan from the first movie? Dude we have Jonah now, who is generally responsible for the procedure that turned Gargan into Scorpion.

Fuck thats some perfect set-up.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 26th 2021 at 2:53:48 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#132692: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:57:00 PM

…so is Hobgoblin Ned still happening? tongue

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#132693: Aug 26th 2021 at 2:59:41 PM

Before all of this, me and Known used to kick around the idea that film 3 would just be Spider-Man/Pete having a price on his head now that his secret identity is out and we get supervillains crawling out of the woodwork to come after him, with Kraven the Hunter (who else?) leading the pack.

I'd have been fine with that.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#132694: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:05:35 PM

In before Kraven the Hunter shows after the credits

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#132696: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:14:00 PM

So will Gargaran, /Scorpion ever be solved.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#132697: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:19:23 PM

I don't think he necessarily has to be. Like how Curt Connors never became the Lizard in the Raimi-verse. If it doesn't happen, then he's just a reference rather than foreshadowing.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#132698: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:22:52 PM

In Scorpion's case, it feels like an initially intended plot point that never got followed up on. Like the original plans for the Ten Rings in Iron Man.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#132699: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:32:16 PM

That's the thing about superhero movies. You get to tell one Spider-Man story every 2-3 years. There are a lot of characters that might have to wait twenty, thirty, forty years for their shot on the big screen - especially when reboots bring the A-Listers back for another round.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Aug 26th 2021 at 3:33:22 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#132700: Aug 26th 2021 at 3:35:29 PM

Every Batman incarnation does have to waste one movie on the Joker.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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