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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#130476: Jul 25th 2021 at 4:56:56 AM

Honestly, I loved it. It's sad that it was cancelled without a third Season, especially with that Cliffhanger at the end.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
DoubleOG (Apprentice)
#130477: Jul 25th 2021 at 5:46:39 AM

All this discussion about Magneto and the X-men has made me realized no matter what option they chose with them some will not be satisfied.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#130479: Jul 25th 2021 at 6:12:19 AM

[up][up] Pretty much like always.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#130480: Jul 25th 2021 at 7:49:49 AM

I’ve always been down with the idea of simply transferring Magneto’s backstory to another, more recent genocide. Human history - even recent human history - certainly isn’t hurting for human atrocities and genocides that resonates tragically with the X-Men’s themes and plights,

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#130481: Jul 25th 2021 at 7:59:59 AM

I guess the biggest problem people see is swapping out minorities for each other. While certainly not on Whitewashing-levels, I can see why this is problematic, especially when it comes to the Jews.

Edited by Forenperser on Jul 25th 2021 at 5:00:07 PM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#130482: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:06:33 AM

I mean, I can see people wanting him to stay that way for Jewish representation purposes, but framing it as “it has to be the Holocaust or it’s not the same” instead makes a lot of the arguments I’m seeing here come off as “this is the only genocide significant and important enough to be featured in this way,” which is kind of unfair to say the least.

As for not swapping out minorities, this is the same franchise that swapped a Tibetan major character for a white one because it was convenient with minimal complaining, so it’s not something I imagine the MCU would have much issue doing if they felt it was the past of least resistance.

At the very least, the argument that the character wouldn’t be the same if the specific genocide was changed doesn’t hold a lot of water, given that previous films have only ever used Magneto’s race as an excuse to put him in a genocide in his youth, rather than ever exploring him culturally. In the Fox movies, besides not allowing the later period pieces to happen the same way, Magneto could’ve been - say - Rwandan and written exactly the same with only the names and dates ever being changed.

The films have only ever used Magneto’s race as an excuse for his backstory, and not a major personality trait.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jul 25th 2021 at 8:10:22 AM

Mario1995 The Dishonorable from Atlanta Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
The Dishonorable
#130483: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:10:57 AM
Thumped: This post was thumped by moderation to preserve the dignity of the author.
"The devil's got all the good gear. What's God got? The Inspiral Carpets and nuns. Fuck that." - Liam Gallagher
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#130484: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:13:33 AM

Gee, I wonder why it's not doing well?

It's on the tip of my tongue. Fandemic, plancemic, manchemick... Damn it, I can't think of anything that could cause this! It's a mystery!

DoubleOG (Apprentice)
#130485: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:13:39 AM

[up][up][up]Keep in mind that there was a a lot of backlash for that decision and Kevin Feige has said that they regretted it. So I doubt that they would be willing to do it again.

Edited by DoubleOG on Jul 25th 2021 at 8:14:56 AM

Diana1969 Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#130486: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:15:47 AM

No way this thing turns a profit. Chapek will almost certainly revoke Feige's creative license after this for the sake of profit.

Stop needlessly speculating. This doomsaying is pointless and has nothing to back it up.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#130487: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:18:40 AM

They clearly want to come true hence why they're saying it

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Mario1995 The Dishonorable from Atlanta Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
The Dishonorable
#130488: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:19:49 AM

[up]I mean if theaters are forced to close again or movies this fall and winter are pushed back then it may end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy.

"The devil's got all the good gear. What's God got? The Inspiral Carpets and nuns. Fuck that." - Liam Gallagher
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#130489: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:23:28 AM

But see, if you made Mangeto a survivor of the Rwandan genocide, you'd have a villain whose core trait is going too far in lashing out against bigotry, now being played by a black man. That would invite so many hot takes calling out the Unfortunate Implications (especially if Professor X remains a white guy).

And, I'll repeat, as far as the MCU is concerned, I don't think covering Magneto's origin is necessary. Of course, that's largely because I don't envision Mangeto as being a major character. I'd hope the MCU would hold off on introducing him for several movies, since he was so overplayed in the Fox films, and when/if he is introduced, an antagonist who appears in one or two movies doesn't necessarily need an in-depth backstory explaining how he got the way he is.


You can't look at just box office numbers here, since Black Widow is being simultaneously offered on Disney+ (for a fee). Obviously, if you make a film available on two different venues, neither venue is going to get as many viewers as if one venue had it as an exclusive.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#130490: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:27:55 AM

We keep telling you to stop with that and you keep doing it.

The legend has returned.
Mario1995 The Dishonorable from Atlanta Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
The Dishonorable
#130491: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:29:26 AM

[up]Eh, sorry. Every time I'm on Film Twitter my brain just melts.

"The devil's got all the good gear. What's God got? The Inspiral Carpets and nuns. Fuck that." - Liam Gallagher
Diana1969 Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Joshbones Since: May, 2015
#130493: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:54:17 AM

Yeah, them following up making the Maximoffs not Jewish by making Magneto not Jewish would be a baffling choice, all things considered. That's the main reason I don't see them changing Magneto's backstory, even if they have to fudge the numbers a bit.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#130494: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:56:11 AM

Wanda is not a mutant though.

Just Makima.
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#130495: Jul 25th 2021 at 8:57:27 AM

What's even the twins' deal at this point, anyway?

Wake me up at your own risk.
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#130496: Jul 25th 2021 at 9:02:01 AM

Wanda had a natural talent for magic, so minor she never even noticed it, that got supercharged by the Mind Stone. No explicit explanation for Quicksilver, but he got his powers after her when he was exposed to the Mind Stone next. So the general theory is that she unconsciously altered probability in his favor, but whether that means he was a latent mutant or what is still unclear.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#130497: Jul 25th 2021 at 9:35:30 AM

She reality warped him into a mutant clearly

After he’s revived to be in the X Men movies he’s going to get kicked out for being a pretender. Then he’ll be sad because he made a lot of new friends there

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#130498: Jul 25th 2021 at 9:40:20 AM

Or they'll kick him out for being a jerkass, which is far more likely with Quicksilver, since most writers don't ever seem to know what to do with him beyond him being an insufferable dick.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#130499: Jul 25th 2021 at 9:43:14 AM

I actually liked the level of dick MCU Quicksilver was

He nailed that ratio of cocky but still charming

Again what a shame that he died in his first movie. I really hope one of the What Ifs is for Quicksilver

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#130500: Jul 25th 2021 at 9:48:32 AM

I like how he took a candy to Klaude once he understood they werent coy him into submission, it was ponitless petty.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"

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