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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#130451: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:28:28 PM

[up][up]I believe this thread has had many conversations about exactly what type of “bullshit” is supposed to explain that and in a way that doesn’t come off as a lazy hand-wave.

Edited by fredhot16 on Jul 24th 2021 at 8:03:34 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#130452: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:31:51 PM

Having someone leap from a burgeoning mutant present to a future where nobody is aware that they're a thing would make the MCU a Bad Future for the X-Men, which makes me laugh.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#130453: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:48:24 PM

....A Bad Future for the X-Men?

Wow, that's exactly why it's the perfect solution!

In fact, the X-Men being brough to the future and finding it super shitty is pretty much exactly what happened when the original 5 X-Men were put in that situation.[lol]

One Strip! One Strip!
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#130454: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:48:53 PM

[up]x4 ... God... fucking... how did I not...?

Excuse me, I need to scream in a pillow.

[up]x3 I legitimately don't care what reasoning they use, that was just me making my post more "flavorful."

Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Jul 24th 2021 at 7:49:03 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#130455: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:51:31 PM

Blame the Phoenix. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#130456: Jul 24th 2021 at 7:55:43 PM

I mentioned the bad future to my friend and they suggested that the X-Men would go back to their own time and defeat whatever and then future MCU movies would just have mutants from then on with no elaboration given as to how this affected movies already released.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#130457: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:03:24 PM

[up][up][up]...Good for you? The explanation does matter, anyway. Not anything in any little way will just do.

Edited by fredhot16 on Jul 24th 2021 at 8:03:59 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#130458: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:06:51 PM

I'm perfectly aware it's important. It's just that I, personally, don't really care. Mostly because of the aforementioned "many conversations" on these threads that have just left me bored of the topic.

Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Jul 24th 2021 at 8:07:20 AM

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#130459: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:09:17 PM

[up]Uh-huh...and you still came...

You know how you hear somebody say something but you don't remember seeing it written so you just have to take a stab at it?

Edited by fredhot16 on Jul 24th 2021 at 8:10:14 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#130460: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:09:23 PM

For me, I'm in favor of this scheme for getting mutants into the MCU.

Mutants have always existed, but have been astonishingly rare. Like no more than a half dozen on the planet at any one time rare. The mutant gene itself is more common, but is almost always inactive.

Then SOMETHING happens that causes a much higher percentage of people with the mutant gene to start manifesting abilities. Perhaps not all at once, but over the course of a few years. This process could of already began if say, the incident was the surge in cosmic energy caused by the infinity stones being used on Earth three times.

This allows for historical mutants to exist when it's especially important for their backstory (Magneto being a definite example), but in low enough numbers that they've managed to mostly slide under the radar. While at the same time allowing for a large population of modern mutants and all the stories that entails.

While this does have some similarities to the Inhumans, I feel like it's an acceptable tradeoff and there's no option without tradeoffs.

Edited by Falrinn on Jul 24th 2021 at 8:11:30 AM

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#130461: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:32:46 PM

I do feel like Feige is going to say "Inhumans? What's that?"

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#130462: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:51:06 PM

He is using Ms.Marvel though.

Just Makima.
GeneralGigan Godzilla from A New Empire Since: Sep, 2020 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Godzilla
#130463: Jul 24th 2021 at 8:56:02 PM

[up] Personally speaking, they’d probably make Kamala a Mutant (or something else entirely), considering the sheer overlap between the two that it’d be easy to merge the different species into a single MCU conglomerate, plus I’m pretty sure Marvel wants nothing to do with the Inhumans after the Dork Age.

SKREEEEEEEONK!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#130464: Jul 24th 2021 at 9:01:47 PM

The Inhumans don’t even have a comic now.

Like even during the Inhumans push they still gave the X-Men something. Now the Inhumans have been basically put on the shelf on their entirety barring Kamala and Lockjaw.

Yeah they don’t want anything to do with them.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 24th 2021 at 9:01:59 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#130465: Jul 24th 2021 at 9:04:03 PM

I think Kamala, Lunella and a couple of others remain of that era, aside from the royal family. Burying the work of like a decade was pretty easy for them.

The question would be how will they adapt the mutants, since that bunch feels like a universe on their own at times.

Wake me up at your own risk.
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#130466: Jul 24th 2021 at 9:17:02 PM

I'd say trickle them in so that their mutant status gets brought up organically as the story continues, kinda like the Infinity Stones.

The legend has returned.
Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#130467: Jul 24th 2021 at 9:20:13 PM

Reading Magneto's history in comics, and how his early days have him commanding a Nazi-styled march with M swapping out the swastika, and the revelation of Magneto being a Holocaust survivor was a detail introduced during the 1980s, I do believe that Magneto's backstory is not truly unmalleable as some will make out.

In fact, I just read this article documenting why Chris Claremont made Magneto a Holocaust survivor. Namely, Chirs was impacted by the silence of the survivors when they were watching a documentation of the Holocaust with the imagery of the camps and atrocities. It's what motivated Chris to even bring the real-life genocide to the X-Men comics rather than using mere allegory to the Nazis during Stan Lee and Jack Kirby's time.

And as well as the fact that the reason why Magneto became a Holocaust survivor was due to the fact that Xavier had partaken in the Korean War and that if Magneto is around the same age as Xavier, it would most certainly be plausible for Magneto to personally witness the Holocaust firsthand, and thus provided the path for Magneto to go from a Card-Carrying Villain to a tragic figure born from revenge and a desire to never be hurt again.

So based on these facts, I will say that Magneto's relationship with Charles Xavier is more important to the character overall, and that attempts to justify Magneto's WII backstory with slow aging, cryogenics, time travel, etc. are Voodoo Shark explanations that fail to address the other piece of Magneto's backstory, his former friendship with Charles as a result of the fallout from their differing opinions. After all, Magneto represents the dark mirror for Xavier if he choose a different path, and it works best if they are the same age. That's why First Class manages to keep the Holocaust backstory for Magneto because Xaiver is alive and around during the 60s in that film series.

Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#130468: Jul 25th 2021 at 1:20:57 AM

I don't think they're going to make Kamala or Lunella into mutants since they might want to keep them separate from that.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#130469: Jul 25th 2021 at 2:34:09 AM

Magneto being a Holocaust survivor might not have been there from the start, but like Batman not using guns anymore and having a No-Kill Code in contrast to his first appearance, it became pretty much the core of the character.

Early-Installment Weirdness at play here.

If you wanna see the classic, irredeemable Magneto being played straight, look at Ultimate Magneto.

Edited by Forenperser on Jul 25th 2021 at 11:36:23 AM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#130470: Jul 25th 2021 at 2:38:36 AM

And Ultimate Magneto is like the worst received version of the guy.

Hell Morrison tried to bring Magneto back to his evil unsympathetic terrorist roots and that resulted in the Xorn fiasco.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Whowho Since: May, 2012
#130471: Jul 25th 2021 at 2:56:30 AM

Legacy character Magneto would work great if you could figure out how his mutation somehow gets passed on from person to person.

Which isn't implausible but would need a Muc Guffin at somepoint. Preferably a macguffin which only works on mutants.

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#130472: Jul 25th 2021 at 3:22:48 AM

Magneto isn't a place, it's a people.

Wait

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#130473: Jul 25th 2021 at 3:36:46 AM

Its a state of mind

you gotta focus on positives

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#130474: Jul 25th 2021 at 4:04:19 AM

I mean, The Gifted kinda, sorta went there with Lorna, though she did switch back to the light in the end.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#130475: Jul 25th 2021 at 4:08:57 AM

Oh yeah there was that show.

How was it?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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