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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#129501: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:49:14 PM

He’s probably the only sacred dead cow left, depending on whether you count Mar-Vell

Bucky is back, Jason Todd is back

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#129502: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:52:40 PM

Batman's parents and Superman's birth parents are still dead. Do they get brought up a lot? Yes. But they're pretty much always dead.

The legend has returned.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#129503: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:53:14 PM

The Uncle Ben who died was a Skrull. The real Uncle Ben took the opportunity to ditch his ball-and-chain of a wife and the dorkass kid he got stuck raising, and go live out his retirement hitting on twenty-something beach babes in Malibu.

...

Okay, not really, but if you told me there was a comic where that happened, and then another comic where it was hastily retconned, I would 100% believe you.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#129504: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:53:47 PM

Well yes,they're not reoccurring characters

[up][up]

Edited by Ultimatum on Jun 26th 2021 at 9:54:06 AM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#129505: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:55:26 PM

It varies on the character, a lot of the time. X-Men are the reigning champions of characters coming back from the dead every other week. Daredevil on the other hand is known for a relatively strict policy of dead characters staying dead (Karen Page has been dead for over 20 years as far as I'm aware).

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#129506: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:56:37 PM

Here's a video about that, though I don't think it happens that much, at least in Jean Gray's case.

Edited by fredhot16 on Jun 26th 2021 at 2:56:51 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#129507: Jun 26th 2021 at 2:58:35 PM

It really depends on the writers and how well your comic is selling,I bear no ill will to towards editors and writers who have to bring a character back in order to sell their comic,even if it its rather convoluted,you gotta make a living

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#129508: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:06:47 PM

I thought Batman’s dad was alive and a jerk

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#129509: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:08:19 PM

I could have sworn Mr. and Mrs Wayne always perish in crime ally

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#129510: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:11:16 PM

[up][up][up] maybe a character who uses something literally called the Phoenix Force is not someone to expect to stay dead.

Though cheap joke aside the X-Men and associates perpetually dying and coming back as infinitum is definitely a thing.

Maybe my favourite take on the whole thing in Marvel in general was Hammerhead (of all people) saying that yes, he did in fact die. But it sucked, so he came back. And IIRC that was it, subject closed.

Edited by jakobitis on Jun 26th 2021 at 11:11:42 AM

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#129511: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:11:26 PM

I think this is the Thomas from Flashpoint, who like an unwelcome Age of Apocalypse character ie most of them, made the jump back to the main continuity and has long worn out his welcome

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#129512: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:13:10 PM

Flashpoint was a thing, The Flash broke time and among other things, we got a Thomas Wayne Batman who killed since Bruce was the victim of that Crime Alley mugging.

And Jor-El came back and was a massive jerk and that had effects many still want to be reversed.

At least can we keep the Flashpoint Martha away?

Edited by Blueace on Jun 26th 2021 at 6:16:41 AM

Wake me up at your own risk.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#129513: Jun 26th 2021 at 3:17:21 PM

@jakobits: the X-Men are the most prominent comics where you have to use the fantastic line "(X) was dead at the time" very often.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#129514: Jun 26th 2021 at 4:38:20 PM

It's one of the reasons I struggle to keep up with mainstream comics for long, particularly X Men but not exclusively.

As someone on the Autistic Spectrum the fact that people are constantly dead then back then dead again and trying to keep up with it all is extremely stressful. I appreciate that probably sounds absurd given the weird logical fallacies that superhero comics run on but it's a particular trigger of mine.

Whereas in the movies, dead has MOSTLY meant actually dead and the exceptions are both rare and more justified than "we came back from being dead just because."

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#129515: Jun 26th 2021 at 4:53:28 PM

X-Men feels particularly bad about it.

Jean Grey's reputation for it isn't really deserved but then you have stuff like when its revealed that Wolverine beats up the angel of death (who he met in World War I while fighting anachronistic Nazis) for free rezzes or Nightcrawler who literally learned to teleport out of the afterlife. By the time you get to Krakoa's easy resurrections its like yeah this tracks.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#129516: Jun 26th 2021 at 5:02:11 PM

Krakoa took death is cheap to its logixal conclusion by implementing an in-universe resurrection mechanic that explcitly brought everyone back barring specific characters like precogs and clones due to plot reasons.

Now the action is in circumvanting that like how the infiltration of the vault required someone to make a psionic backup in order for the missiob to be accomplished. If anyone died before Xavier backed them up the the mission would have been a failure and all the info lost.

Massive props to Synch for pulling the hail mary pass.

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 26th 2021 at 5:02:30 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#129517: Jun 27th 2021 at 4:31:41 PM

I think Feige won't do Krakoa like that, since it kinda hurts the idea of death meaning something.

Just Makima.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#129518: Jun 27th 2021 at 4:40:13 PM

Well its a pretty high-concept thing and is reliant on the X-Men at such an absolute stage of power they have Mutants capable of accomplishing such crazy shit including terraforming Mars.

We're unlikely to get there anytime soon.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#129519: Jun 27th 2021 at 8:40:45 PM

Hickman's X-Men IMO hinges too much on how much it contrasts with the X-Men's classic premise and its decades of storytelling. One could feasibly attempt it by leaning heavily into the Fox franchise and Pop Culture Osmosis for "context" but with how badly Fox got tangled in its own Continuity Snarl I'd honestly prefer a more back-to-basics approach, refocus it back to the team as a whole.

If there's any recent comic I think would be interesting exploring it'd be Immortal Hulk, and even then I wouldn't go anywhere close to the One-Below-All or the Green Doors. I'd just take the Immortal Hulk himself, use him as a bridge into an MCU take on Banner's fractured psyche.

Aleistar Since: Feb, 2018 Relationship Status: Hugging my pillow
#129520: Jun 27th 2021 at 9:03:45 PM

[up] Honest question from someone who has only read the first few issues of Immortal Hulk: isn't the whole Green Door thing the explanation for Banner's Resurrective Immortality? How would you try to explain the whole "he's immortal" deal without it?

Edited by Aleistar on Jun 27th 2021 at 12:04:09 PM

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#129521: Jun 27th 2021 at 10:30:37 PM

[up] I've read exactly none of it and am only working off what I read online, so you have me there. [lol]

The Hulk is a Science Hero, while the Green Doors are fundamentally Doing in the Scientist by having it so that "gamma mutates" are actually spiritually connected to The Anti-God. I'd just keep it simple by not getting into the mysticism and just having him be effectively immortal due to the nature of his gamma mutation. I'm pretty sure it's like this in the book but it could even be that the Immortal Hulk persona has access to this immortality in a way that the others don't tap into as easily.

The MCU is fundamentally an Adaptation Distillation, and while comics can afford to get into the really weird shit movies and shows have to be a bit more to-the-point, y'know? And quite honestly I'm not so much interested in the immortality as I am in the chance of actually depicting Banner's Split Personalities.

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#129522: Jun 28th 2021 at 7:15:58 AM

It's not from comics, but the Reverse Flash of the arrowverse is a character who always manages to revive.

It is even assumed that by this point he should be Deader than Dead

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#129523: Jun 28th 2021 at 10:27:04 AM

Didn't the Reverse Flash get shot in the head in one of the cartoons, but then do Speedforce shenanigans to spend an entire second movie slowly dying from the bullet traveling through his brain or something?

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jun 28th 2021 at 10:27:13 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#129524: Jun 28th 2021 at 10:28:26 AM

Yeah it was in the Suicide Squad: Hell to Pay animated movie.

Prolly the most batshit insane feat ever.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#129525: Jun 28th 2021 at 10:33:17 AM

Do you all remember when Peter Parker's parents came back from the dead during the 90s?

Like it was 100% legit, and were even in Maximum Carnage. But then the writing staff really couldn't make Peter hanging out with his grumpy old parents interesting, so they were retconned into robots made by the Chameleon and Harry.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"

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