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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128576: May 26th 2021 at 5:15:49 PM

Jude Law seemed decently high enough in the Kree hierarchy that it would be a scandal. (The warmongering and gaslighting aside <3)

Edited by Synchronicity on May 26th 2021 at 7:16:59 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#128577: May 26th 2021 at 5:16:57 PM

[up][up] Huh that could work.

The issue being Mar-Vell didn’t seem like that well-known a figure that can cause a scandal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#128578: May 26th 2021 at 5:17:37 PM

The Eternals don't want to hold the humans hands, rule humans or be worshipped by them.

Their job is to protect Humans from the deviants and not to interfere otherwise.

True, it's easy to forget the Deviant angle.

However it's worth noting that the teaser put a lot of focus on the Eternals shepherding humanity without mentioning the Deviants at all, even in the abstract. This, plus the fact that the Eternals are obscure even by comic book standards, means that the average viewer isn't going to consider that complication.

Overall I think the answer from the question of "why didn't the Eternals prevent X terrible thing" will mostly be "they were busy fighting Deviants" or "they kind of did, what history recorded was far from the worst case outcome".

I've seen some speculation that due to some Captain America imagery in the background in the teaser, they may of had a hand in the creation of Captain America.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#128579: May 26th 2021 at 5:18:07 PM

The way the Kree are, any hybrid between them and the Skrulls is going to cause an uproar

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Krory Since: Aug, 2012
#128580: May 26th 2021 at 5:19:12 PM

Stopping the Deviants is kind of awkward, since the most prominent Deviant in the comics is Thanos, though I guess in the MCU he isn't one.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#128581: May 26th 2021 at 5:26:11 PM

Though it has to be a big enough figure that would cause them to rapidly scramble like crazy.

Cause if it’s like just an affair between 2 grunts, they’d prolly just send an assassin to keep it quiet.

Edited by slimcoder on May 26th 2021 at 5:29:56 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128582: May 26th 2021 at 5:27:56 PM

Wasn't Teddy's whole Great Uniter thing in part because his parents were both big enough deals that both the Kree and Skrull would take him seriously?

[up][nja] yeah that's what I was trying to say :-)

Edited by Synchronicity on May 26th 2021 at 7:28:11 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#128583: May 26th 2021 at 5:28:51 PM

Retroactively deciding Mar-Vell was prominent among the Kree was weird though. I mean, he was prominent in being known but none of them liked him. No Kree attended his funeral, while multiple Skrulls were in attendance, even in disguise.

You can’t really do Teddy as the great uniter of two massive space empires in the MCU because the Skrulls don’t have one.

Edited by Bocaj on May 26th 2021 at 8:29:45 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#128584: May 26th 2021 at 5:29:04 PM

[up][up] Pretty much yeah.

His mother was a Skrull princess while his father was one of the greatest warriors the Kree Empire ever produced, feared, respected, and hated (by the Kree) throughout the universe.

Edited by slimcoder on May 26th 2021 at 5:29:44 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128585: May 26th 2021 at 5:48:29 PM

[up][up]Secret Invasion is coming, which could make it so that (a) Talos and friends are just one faction, or (b) the 90s were an off decade for the Skrull.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#128586: May 26th 2021 at 5:51:39 PM

You could justify that the discovery of a royal heir or something can unite the disparate Skrull groups as one.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#128587: May 26th 2021 at 5:54:27 PM

Granted, it can be weird and messy using the skrull as refuge analogy and them having secret war happeing.

but them manage to make civil war not suck so sure, whatever.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#128588: May 26th 2021 at 5:59:59 PM

I really hope that the Skrulls don’t have a Secret Empire

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128589: May 26th 2021 at 6:06:22 PM

Although depending on what exactly Secret Invasion is, “refugees who decide to infiltrate/invade a planet” is probably worse optics wise.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#128590: May 26th 2021 at 6:28:21 PM

It’s at risk of falling over a whole bunch of dog whistles and such

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#128591: May 26th 2021 at 6:28:34 PM

Probably the screet inflitrating to hunt them down? that would probably work.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#128592: May 26th 2021 at 7:25:38 PM

Based on a throwaway line by "Fury" in Spider-Man:FFA about Kree sleeper cells my guess is that the Secret Invasion will either be headed by Skrull quislings who are in league with the Kree (willingly or otherwise) or Kree who have managed to replicate Skrull shapeshifting abilities through medical experimentation on captured Skrulls.

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128593: May 26th 2021 at 8:13:05 PM

Unrelated: watching Series.Girls5eva and John Slattery (Howard Stark) cameos to talk about how grateful he is that his son is a lonely New York intellectual. Lol

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#128594: May 26th 2021 at 8:44:34 PM

Yeah, saying “Surprise! Refugees are actually evil lizard people here to take over your life” is... bad.

Edited by Nightwire on May 27th 2021 at 8:34:13 AM

Theokal3 Since: Jan, 2012
#128595: May 27th 2021 at 5:56:14 AM

And if I have to be frank, this running to Superman Stays Out of Gotham territory and becomes less of genuine questions and more of unreasonable demands for superpowered beings to solve every single problem on the planet... or be criticized for making the hard work of regular humans feel unnecessary because they try to solve problems.

I strongly agree. Don't get me wrong, Reed Richards Is Useless frustrates me as much as the next guy, as I do kinda want to see all these heroes change their world for the better to show they're not just struggling to make a bad but unsolvable status quo not get worse. But at some point you gotta be reasonable: with maybe a few very rare exceptions, a superhero usually cannot be everywhere at once, and there's a reason there are many of them. It's really not unreasonable to assume, for example, that the Avengers didn't go to look for Stark when he might be dead because Cap, Black Widow and Fury were busy handling a century-years old Hydra infiltration and Thor was either solving the mess in the Nine Realms or stopping Malekith from destroying light in all the universe. Admittedly Hawkeye and Hulk don't get any official justification but it's entirely possible that Hawkeye was on a mission and Banner had retired himself to work on a cure or something. We don't need elaborate explanations for it all the time.

Regarding the Eternals, I don't know yet, but the idea that they couldn't have done that much to prevent it is entirely possible, as is the idea that them not doing anything is seen as a flaw (similar to Wakanda) and that movie will finally have them do something. Alternatively, maybe they did try something, but couldn't do much and did it while staying hidden.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#128596: May 27th 2021 at 5:59:22 AM

wild mass guessThanos beat up the Eternals and it took awhile for them to recover

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#128597: May 27th 2021 at 6:01:18 AM

wild mass guessThe strongest and/or the leaders of the Eternals were snapped and thus they couldn’t really do shit that they were supposed to until now.

The legend has returned.
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#128598: May 27th 2021 at 6:16:03 AM

[up] Snapped retroactively over the previous events of the MCU? tongue

Anyways, there's a lot of different angles to take. Given that the likely villain of the movie seems to have set up his own little cult based on the teaser, I could see the Eternals be partly be motivated by being concerned about how things can go downhill for everyone involved when they take a more active role.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#128599: May 27th 2021 at 7:07:24 AM

@ Nightwire - I think it also almost makes it worse that the post Captain Marvel appearances so far show Skrulls as having powerful and trusted military and intelligence agency roles with the approval of humans (specifically Nick Fury and Maria Rambeau), so going on to show the Skrulls as abusing that trust to Take Over the World has some pretty bad implications about immigrants/minorities being fifth columnists.

By the way (slight Wandavision spoiler) - I'm assuming here that besides the "Skrull FBI Agent", Monica's friend Major Goodner is also a Skrull.

Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#128600: May 27th 2021 at 8:20:51 AM

At minimum I do expect the villains of Secret Invasion to be wholly disconnected from Talos's faction and that Talos himself will still be a good guy.

At most, as I said before, the possibility exists that the villains won't even be Skrulls, but Kree who have managed to replicate the Skrull shape-shifting abilities.


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