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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#128451: May 24th 2021 at 7:19:55 AM

Based off the teaser, I think this movie's going to be a hard sell. What little we're shown doesn't just imply the Superman Stays Out of Gotham problem for Thanos, but for all of human history. "We've been here forever in secret and we have superpowers," is the kind of premise that leads people to ask questions like, "Where were you during the Holocaust?"

Wakanda got around this problem by making the Wakandans' isolation into a major point of contention within the plot. It stated in no uncertain terms that yes, Wakanda did stay out of world events and geopolitics that it probably should have been involved in and yes, it does mean something pretty shitty about them that they did that. The Villain with a Point was mad that Wakanda didn't do more to help people when they could have, and T'Challa ends the film resolving to bring Wakanda out of its isolationism and into the geopolitical sphere proper.

So they could do that. But. Like. We already have that movie. It's called Black Panther.

That dramatic arrival scene where the ship shows up instantly codes the titular Eternals as colonizers; a technologically-advanced people showing up on the shores of a bunch of natives dressed in furs and carrying sticks, coming to stay and do... whatever they wind up doing. That is perilous imagery to code your protagonists with.

Edited by TobiasDrake on May 24th 2021 at 7:20:56 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#128452: May 24th 2021 at 7:23:48 AM

> Based off the teaser, I think this movie's going to be a hard sell.

That's been my concern since before the trailer dropped really, partly because the eternals are completely unknown outside the comic books,contrast that with DC's new Gods who have a presence in cartoons and some of the movies for a while now

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#128453: May 24th 2021 at 7:24:46 AM

I honestly wonder if the people at Marvel Studios actually understand why nobody liked Inhumans.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#128454: May 24th 2021 at 7:27:25 AM

[up]The Eternals don't have slaves, so they have that going for them.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#128455: May 24th 2021 at 7:46:10 AM

That dramatic arrival scene where the ship shows up instantly codes the titular Eternals as colonizers; a technologically-advanced people showing up on the shores of a bunch of natives dressed in furs and carrying sticks, coming to stay and do... whatever they wind up doing. That is perilous imagery to code your protagonists with.

Looked to me like they were just sight-seeing.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#128456: May 24th 2021 at 7:51:45 AM

Wakanda got around this problem by making the Wakandans' isolation into a major point of contention within the plot. It stated in no uncertain terms that yes, Wakanda did stay out of world events and geopolitics that it probably should have been involved in and yes, it does mean something pretty shitty about them that they did that. The Villain with a Point was mad that Wakanda didn't do more to help people when they could have, and T'Challa ends the film resolving to bring Wakanda out of its isolationism and into the geopolitical sphere proper.

So they could do that. But. Like. We already have that movie. It's called Black Panther.

"Black Panther already did it" doesn't seem like a good reason not to do it and it isn't like the MCU doesn't repeat story beats.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#128457: May 24th 2021 at 7:55:30 AM

Black Panther already did it without nodding at implicitly or explicitly racist conspiracy theories.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#128458: May 24th 2021 at 7:56:04 AM

[up][up]"They already did the 'famous villain from the comics who is being presented as a good guy is revealed in a not-so-shocking twist to actually be a villain' twist before with Ego, they wouldn't do it again with Mysterio!"

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on May 24th 2021 at 7:56:23 AM

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#128459: May 24th 2021 at 8:03:37 AM

[up][up] I think it might be a bit too early to say the movie is doing that.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#128460: May 24th 2021 at 8:05:18 AM

As mentioned they might simply have been busy elsewhere. The fact they've been here doesn't necessairily mean they've always been here.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#128461: May 24th 2021 at 8:08:03 AM

[up][up]Way too early.

The racist theories say that aliens did it instead of indigenous people. That's all they have to avoid, the idea that aliens did things indigenous people were allegedly too dumb to do themselves.

ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#128462: May 24th 2021 at 8:11:05 AM

Not to mention that Black Panther leaned on some fairly common racist conspiracy theories.

It didnt agree with them, but it certainly acknowledged their existence, to counter them.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#128463: May 24th 2021 at 8:14:14 AM

I honestly wonder if the people at Marvel Studios actually understand why nobody liked Inhumans.

People hate the Inhumans because Marvel was pushing them as a replacement for mutants which pissed off everyone. Before that they were one of those properties that fans generally knew existed but were just obscure enough for no one to give a shit. Like let's be real, no one's actually dragging them for the mess that is the Alpha Primitives (not that they don't deserve it) or for the other mess that is their entire monarchical structure.

Just don't do the slave thing and give people their X-Men and it should be fine.

Edited by Watchtower on May 24th 2021 at 11:19:06 AM

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#128464: May 24th 2021 at 8:40:36 AM

Too bad the inhumans sucked, because Maximus was great.

I wouldn't mind if they ignored the rest of the cast, but they brought Maximus back with the same actor.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#128465: May 24th 2021 at 8:42:10 AM

Black Bolt is one of the coolest characters in all of Marvel comics, just on a conceptual level, and he was totally wasted.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#128467: May 24th 2021 at 8:44:06 AM

Maybe they haven’t interfered much in the past few thousand years because they’re low on prayer stamina?

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#128468: May 24th 2021 at 8:48:56 AM

Perhaps they did not interfere because they considered that it was not worth fighting against "weaklings" like Loki, Ultron or Thanos,

Edited by JoLuRo075 on May 24th 2021 at 8:49:43 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#128469: May 24th 2021 at 8:49:10 AM

I'm sure they'll have a good explanation for this.

Unlike the Inhumans, this will have quality control.

There's going to be an actual effort, and I believe that, even if the product isn't great, something that has real effort put into it can't be entirely bad.

One Strip! One Strip!
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#128470: May 24th 2021 at 8:53:31 AM

[up]x3 - The Eternals aren't gods, if anything, they're more angels of the Celestials. Servants that are sent to aid in their struggles.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#128471: May 24th 2021 at 8:57:01 AM

I kind of like the vibe from that last scene, maybe the reason they didn't interfere in stuff like the Holocaust was simply because they genuinely didn't feel the need to interfere. Like "Oh, some humans are killing other humans again, that's a shame." Like, they see horrific mass genocides the same way we see whales getting banished from their pod or baby walruses getting killed by aggressive adult male walruses: nature is cruel, but let it take its course.

That would be different enough from Black Panther, where the reason Wakanda didn't interfere wasn't because they thought they were superior, but because they were afraid of the outside world and afraid of the responsibility.

Of course, the film would end with them realizing that human life is precious, blah, blah, blah, all that jazz.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#128472: May 24th 2021 at 9:00:27 AM

The scene at the end of the trailer definitely has a "they perceive human problems the way we, the audience, perceive story drama - IE, as entertainment - and nothing more" vibe.

If Thanos couldn't jog them out of this mentality, I wonder what could. I don't know enough about these characters to really speculate.

ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#128473: May 24th 2021 at 9:18:02 AM

Presumably a threat that targets them specifically, like the Deviants.

And/or one of their own turning evil.

Edited by ArthurEld on May 24th 2021 at 9:21:48 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#128474: May 24th 2021 at 9:20:35 AM

Maybe it's like all the main characters are that one guy from Invincible (not to spoil it), except the main villain is even more that guy from Invincible.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#128475: May 24th 2021 at 9:23:00 AM

> like the Deviants.

obvious joke is obvious when you know about Deviant Art..

have a listen and have a link to my discord server

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