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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#127676: May 4th 2021 at 6:43:38 PM

Oh, no. It was a suggestion of what one could say.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#127677: May 4th 2021 at 6:51:22 PM

Ok.

They shouldn't say that.

Don't throw out Agents of Shield. That's my stance.

And nothing will sway me....

...well, ok, toss out Season's 6 and 7, because they don't fit. Everything else can work more or less.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#127678: May 4th 2021 at 6:57:00 PM

Clearly we can solve this by having AOS be one of the first multiverses mcu crosses over with

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#127679: May 4th 2021 at 8:22:30 PM

Hey, on the subject of AOS and Marvel TV overall, people are noticing that it and Agent Carter got shuffled to the "Marvel Legacy" section at Disney+.

And a while back, a(n executive?) producer for TFATWS revealed that (all of?) the Marvel shows before WV and TFATWS aren't really canon anymore?

...Sorry, everyone?

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on May 4th 2021 at 8:26:08 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#127680: May 4th 2021 at 8:24:34 PM

Agent Carter is mildly surprising, but I guess it makes sense if they - say - want to do a Madame Masque again (possible, given the two Iron Man-spinoffs coming up), or a more faithful Maggia adaptation.

Edited by KnownUnknown on May 4th 2021 at 8:25:09 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#127682: May 4th 2021 at 8:36:35 PM

I imagine Season 1 of Agent Carter is still canon considering Jarvis's cameo in Endgame, but Season 2 already had some canonicity questions with the Agent Carter One Shot. Neither Masque nor the Maggia were much like the comic versions anyway.

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#127683: May 4th 2021 at 8:37:52 PM

Not gonna comment too much on that (most definitely doesn't look good, but I'm still waiting for Ms. Marvel before making a judgment call). Just want to establish, in case there's an OCD person like me out there itching to do this, the shows shouldn't be removed from the MCU pages.

They have enough connections to count as, like so many people have compared a million times before, Legends or Expanded Universe stories. I removed Helstrom, but only because it was declared separate the day of its release. These other shows have had time to establish continuity with the greater franchise, and while it increasingly looks like that was a waste of time, it's still enough of a connection to not go ahead and remove everything outright.

Also, I'm not actually OCD, but I like organizing stuff. And feel compelled to post things like this, when I'm pretty doubtful anyone cares about these specifics. Look, it makes me feel better to get my thoughts out there, okay?

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#127684: May 4th 2021 at 8:50:40 PM

Shit.

That is one way to put it. But then, AOS kinda went off the rails at some point, yeah? (Though I guess I'm gonna miss Ming-Na Wen as Melinda May...)

And we may as well forget even mentioning the Netflix shows.

But hey, silver lining: if it means having Absorbing Man in She-Hulk or finally having a live-action Kingpin in the MCU proper, I'm all for moving forward.

Besides, not like anyone here misses Jeph Loeb, right? So I'm equally fine with this if it's essentially the final nail in the coffin that is Loeb's career. Good riddance to bad rubbish and all.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#127685: May 4th 2021 at 9:18:12 PM

It is really easy to get the impression that Feige likes to keep to his own toybox, that he doesn't really care what's been done in things he hasn't had an active hand with, and between Perlmutter's Inhumans push and SUMC that he doesn't like when others try to force him in a certain direction. It'd paint him like a Control Freak except he's made his brand such a solid seal of quality that it comes off more like Awesome Ego.

He'd probably love to just pull the trigger, declare everything not his non-canon, and be done with it. But he's One of Us, he openly says he reads internet comments, he knows if he swings the ax like that people are gonna be pissed the hell off. So he's waiting, continually dawdling on pulling the band-aid, and it's only a matter of time until it happens. But who knows, maybe he'll actually try to save at least some of it, namely actor choices.

God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#127686: May 4th 2021 at 9:20:56 PM

Axe AOS and then pick out the pieces you like. Like the Actors. And some broad strokes. And Ghost Rider.

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#127687: May 4th 2021 at 9:24:22 PM

[up] Definitely Ghost Rider...

And since I'm here, I should chime in on a mini-update since I got a PM about it:

It would appear this update is only being applied to Disney+ in different regions, like in Brazil. So some of you might have a "Marvel Legacy Movies" and "Marvel Legacy Animation," but AOS and AC might still be lumped in with WV and TFATWS in a "Marvel Live Action Series and Specials" section.

That being said, I would expect the shake-up to apply to other regions like USA later on. Yeah, it's easy to think changes like this happen overnight, and they do, but I guess the process is slower in certain corners.

Sorry if anyone is experiencing the weird discrepancy.

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on May 5th 2021 at 7:32:01 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#127688: May 4th 2021 at 9:27:39 PM

I suppose you could completely leave out the stuff with the Inhumans and say Skye-Daisies got her powers another way.

The series, still mostly works if you leave out a lot of that stuff.

So that does mean the second half of Season 2, and pretty much everything with Hive-Ward has to go.

One Strip! One Strip!
Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#127689: May 4th 2021 at 9:42:58 PM

I'm gonna say, screw Agents of Shield being canon.

They had the gall to tease Coulson having encountered a Ghost Rider in the past and NEVER followed up with it. Their time is past.

Real talk the actual discrepancy is seasons 6 and 7, but that STILL rubs me the wrong way. tongue

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#127690: May 4th 2021 at 9:52:19 PM

Would it be too much to say I never liked Coulson much? tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Altris from the Vortex Since: Aug, 2019 Relationship Status: Not caught up in your love affair
#127691: May 4th 2021 at 9:57:51 PM

For all the problems the TV shows had (hi, Jeph Loeb), I feel they were an interesting facet of the MCU that was good because they were generally well, less cinematic. What I mean is that it was very refreshing to see the street-level heroes, and the world, for lack of a better term, react to whatever the latest movie introduced. It was refreshing to see street-level heroes deal with problems that are comparatively more down-to-earth - the Netflix shows and such were very interesting illustrations of the world between the blockbusters. I wouldn't call them more 'realistic', exactly, but it was refreshing to see conflicts that weren't huge, immediate and/or endangering large amounts of people and property. (Yes, I'm aware of Civil War, but that has its own problems and enough bombastic- and traditional-action-blockbuster-feeling to slot in with the rest of the feature films.)

So, let's hang an anchor from the sun... also my Tumblr
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#127692: May 4th 2021 at 10:00:14 PM

In that sense I always felt like the netflix neck of the woods did this better. AOS always kind of struck me as "MCU on a budget" even when they were good due their tendency to shoot for the moon.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#127693: May 4th 2021 at 10:02:28 PM

They did have Graviton of all characters in the show.

Plus Absorbing Man.

Those some heavy hitters.

Edited by slimcoder on May 4th 2021 at 10:02:35 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#127694: May 4th 2021 at 10:26:08 PM

I prefer AOS. The Netflix show eventually hit me down hard with a case of Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#127695: May 4th 2021 at 10:28:31 PM

I'd like Agent Carter Season 1 to stick around as canon, but Season 2 can go. It was full of problems, from an oddly high amount of torture scenes, Madame Masque being In Name Only and having a tragic backstory that is swiftly forgotten, Peggy's backstory turning from being a self-made hero into a stereotypically airheaded bride who was inspired by her brother, a low budget finale with no climactic battle with Masque, throwing in needless sequel hooks for a third season that was definitely not going to be made...

...and especially cutting out Peggy's best friend Angie to almost no screentime after their ship became the most popular one for the series, despite queerbaiting them throughout Season 2's promotion that Agent Carter actually won out over Agents of SHIELD in charity polls due to the Cartinelli fanbase.

...whew, can't believe I held that all in for 5 years. tongue

DeathsApprentice The Ultimate Lifeform from The Ark Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
The Ultimate Lifeform
#127696: May 4th 2021 at 11:15:34 PM

Now that I'm thinking about it, I don't actually think I ever bothered finishing season 2 of Agent Carter. Mostly cuz I really didn't like what I saw of it. So I'm completely fine with that being excised from canon. [lol]

When we're done, there won't be anything left.
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#127697: May 4th 2021 at 11:22:52 PM

...I have never actually watched Season 2 of Agent Carter.

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#127698: May 4th 2021 at 11:24:01 PM

I have never watched more then two or three episodes of it, if even that much, so...

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#127699: May 4th 2021 at 11:30:59 PM

I never watched. I like the character well enough but I was never interested in watching a show about her.

Same reason with Agents of Shield, if your not a superhero your kinda secondary to me.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127700: May 4th 2021 at 11:59:02 PM

I've been rewatching the Netflix shows, and I'm gonna miss 'em if they just recast and forget about them.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

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