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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
He gets more flak because he's completely unreasonable.
Spider-Man can talk Wolverine and even Deadpool from killing someone, but you he can't do the same with Frank.
Frank doesn't care if a someone he deems a bad guy is harmless or repentant, he's still going to try to kill them.
Pretty sure Stilt-Man wasn't a heinous criminal and that didn't stop Frank from shooting him.
And heroes like Spider-Man do in fact see Frank as an outright villain. Peter was furious when Frank killed the aforementioned Stilt-Man.
Edited by Cortez on Feb 8th 2021 at 6:26:14 AM
Stilt-Man is a Complete Monster.
x6 Like I said, it is depending on the writer. By changing what crimes he's willing to kill over the writers can make him more or less sympathetic to serve the needs of the story.
But the version I'd say most people think of when they think of the Punisher isn't going after Saturday morning cartoon villains, but rapists, murderers, slavers and the like. Because that's the only way he can come off as at least somewhat sympathetic.
Edited by FGHIK on Feb 8th 2021 at 2:36:51 AM
I didn't say he killed innocents, but I don't think "shooting up neighborhoods" is a inaccurate description of what he does (if perhaps a harsh one). Castle's M.O is pretty regularly shown as him using weapons of war (like grenades, gatling guns, claymore mines and even rocket-launchers) against criminals in residential areas or even in the middle of the street, things that you absolutely should not be firing wily nily in the middle of a residential area unless Castle has a secret omega mutation that makes stray bullets (both fired by him and of the criminals he's instigating a shoot-out in the middle of a residential area with) not exist.
He's also fairly indiscriminate about what kind of criminals he targets in most characterizations. Brutalizing or outright killing pickpockets and muggers has been a fairly common M.O for him.
Logically, every urban hero in New York should be trying to stop this maniac from using weapons of war in residential neighborhoods against even non-violent offenders on occasion. They don't for nebulous reasons (admiration? too much hassle? it varies) because writers have to justify the coexistence of these people.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."A lot I think depends on how sympathetic we want the Punisher to be.
If we want him to be an unambiguous protagonist, then we need to dial up the threshold it takes for him to go after someone to the point that's far beyond almost anyone who turned to crime out of desperation. Which means he's pretty much only going to go after corrupt organizations.
Alternatively, he could fill an antagonistic role. While he probably wouldn't get to the point of shooting up jaywalkers, the focus would still be on how his overly lethal methods actually make things worse. Essentially like how if theft is punishable by death, a burglar has no incentive to spare a homeowner who caught them in the act.
There's also a middle ground, where he isn't clearly either an antagonist or protagonist. His lethal methods seem effective on the surface, but it's arguable how necessary they really are and whether or not they are really worth the risk of killing an innocent person by mistake, which perhaps he could come very close to doing on screen. While this is the best option, it's also the hardest option to pull off properly.
His lethal methods can’t be too effective if there’s always more extremely violent criminals to kill
By that same token, superheroes trying to throw people in jail can’t be too effective but that’s at least mostly the same people. Punisher seems to actually create crime if you think about it while applying this dumb logic
Forever liveblogging the AvengersHe is literally the only hero to suffer major consequences for Secret Empire just because he killed Coulson under orders of Hydra Cap.
Meanwhile Frank willingly joined and became Hydra's watchdog with absolute obedience to Hydra Cap.
Edited by slimcoder on Feb 8th 2021 at 3:25:28 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."Sounds like really bad writing
Par for the course with secret empire but you hates to see it
Forever liveblogging the AvengersWriters have occasionally implied that Castle has in fact made crime worse: by conducting a indiscriminate warpath against crime with weapons of war, he has caused crime to radicalize itself and grow increasingly more militarized and ruthless in an attempt to counteract and stop Castle. By a reason of logic, the less violent and well-armed criminals are easier prey for Castle, leaving the really unhinged maniacs to consolidate their strength.
Basically, Castle is radicalizing crime. This is actually based in reality, as this chain of events often happens when the government decides to fight crime with just more guns and more tanks (rather than solving or alleviating the socioeconomic issues that lead to organized crime in the first place).
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Aren't all Major Events these days? One of the main reasons I stopped consuming comics alltogether.
It's just one mindless crossover event after the other. Like 4 or 5 per year. The MCU (or the Arrowverse, for that matter) is much better with the dosage, crossovers in adaptations are actually still exiting.
In the comics, it's like Tuesday.
Edited by Forenperser on Feb 8th 2021 at 12:35:28 PM
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianI love how both Avengers: Endgame and Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. threw shade at Secret Empire. That was hilarious.
The opening sequence of Daredevil s2ep4 does a pretty good job showcasing this, with Cooley rallying the Irish mob into gangbanging Hell's Kitchen just to hunt Castle down.
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!One of the Punisher movies (2004?) had him running around in Florida for reasons of "moviemaker tax breaks", but moving him out of New York to some other stock Wretched Hive would explain how he runs around shooting people without Spider-Man or some other New Yorker hero pushing his shit in.
This place is careless.The Twitter account made for that Inhumans show everybody absolutely loathed tweeted the newest trailer for The Falcon & The Winter Soldier.
It's weird because the page's last tweet was waaaaaaaaaaay back in 2019. Might this be a clue to how the Inhumans will be rebirthed via TF&TWS? Could it be picking up on the plot thread WandaVision brought up regarding something going on in New Jersey? ![]()
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Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Feb 8th 2021 at 7:18:13 AM

Okay, Punisher is very far from a role model, but let's not pretend he's mass murdering innocent civilians. The people he targets are (to varying degree Depending on the Writer) the most heinous of criminals. The usual portrayal isn't having him out there shooting people for jaywalking. Of course Spider-Man and the like would immediately kick his ass if he was just an indiscriminate psycho, but he's not. He's an extremely dark Anti-Hero, not an outright villain.