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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#122751: Nov 11th 2020 at 5:48:03 PM

Agree with everything except Frost. Was she less lecherous? Yes. Was she a Flat Character that only wore underwear for no adequate reason? Also yes.

Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Nov 11th 2020 at 5:52:23 AM

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#122752: Nov 11th 2020 at 10:32:28 PM

In fairness, two of the instances of her wearing underwear were her trying to seduce someone. Which is still better than her comic counterpart who seems to never worry about freezing to death or having a wardrobe malfunction.

I remember a bit from Jessica Alba about Sue's Disney Death scene in the second film, where she notes that they had to retake it a couple times because they wanted Sue to "die sexier."

For some reason, I think "die sexier" is something a Garth Ennis villain would say.

Seriously, Will & Grace, a t.v. series that hasn't exactly aged well either, was mocking the idea of film makers putting fanservice over storytelling with Jack McFarland's sham of an acting career.

I'll give the Trank movie credit for trying to do something far less sexist with Sue even if it failed in other parts. I don't know why it was so difficult to update Sue given how far she's come in the comics and how much better she was written in the World's Greatest Heroes animated series.

Edited by windleopard on Nov 11th 2020 at 10:33:51 AM

eligram Since: Sep, 2009 Relationship Status: In denial
#122753: Nov 12th 2020 at 3:57:38 AM

On the other hand, Wolverine became much more of a Mr. Fanservice than ever before.

I mean, when you compare fugly Wolverine from the comics to Hugh Jackman sexiest man alive Wolverine, is only natural for the fanservice to increase.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#122754: Nov 12th 2020 at 4:03:29 AM

Depending on the artist, and depending on the medium, Wolverine can range anywhere from ugly as sin to hot as hell. He doesn't have trouble getting dates regardless.

Though in the comics, Logan actually decided to become celibate after meeting his Kid from the Future (from a possible timeline anyway) Raze, who is his and Mystique's son. He realizes that if he wants to avoid any possibility of siring Raze, he can never have sex again.

And no, Wolverine can't tell if it's Mystique by scent. Her shapeshifting has become good enough that it can fool even his sense of smell.

Edited by M84 on Nov 12th 2020 at 8:06:49 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
eligram Since: Sep, 2009 Relationship Status: In denial
#122755: Nov 12th 2020 at 4:11:42 AM

I would say he began to be more constantly atractive in the comics after the movie. In the comics he was canonically short barbaric l, animalistic and ugly, which make me ask how could he became popular in the first place. Even in the 1992 cartoon, while not as ugly as in the comics, he wasn't that atractive either.

Now the cartoons after the movies, like X-men Evolution and Wolverine and the X-men, he is designed as atractive as hell.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#122756: Nov 12th 2020 at 4:29:34 AM

This is what Wolverine looks like in the Wolverine Anime. And this is what Wolverine looks like in the X-Men Anime. These shows take place within the same continuity, this is the same Wolverine, he makes references in the X-Men anime to the events of the Wolverine anime, he just looks completely different.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Nov 12th 2020 at 5:30:03 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#122757: Nov 12th 2020 at 7:58:47 AM

Why didn’t he just get a vasectomy?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#122758: Nov 12th 2020 at 8:00:12 AM

Super healing I imagine

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#122759: Nov 12th 2020 at 8:27:22 AM

The majority of comic character designs lean towards beefcake male heroes, even in the comics Wolverine often leans towards a rugged Hunk instead of really looking like a short gremlin.

I recall too that some toys for the X-Men movies had Jean and Storm with lowered zippers on their costume to show some cleavage. A recent interview with High Jackman had him comment that X-Men comics were banned from the set because they didn't want people bothering them about fidelity to one thing or another. They had a vision of trying to make the X-Men feel more like a drama, which included less overt fanservice.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#122760: Nov 12th 2020 at 8:29:15 AM

Wolverine being short is pretty consistent in the comics though.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#122761: Nov 12th 2020 at 8:32:59 AM

[up][up]One could argue that eventually led the Fox Men to become stagnant in the face of an MCU that fully embraced its source material.

KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#122762: Nov 12th 2020 at 8:39:28 AM

That's really only true of the first two movies, by the third movie they started leaning into really over-the-top elements more akin to the comics. Days of Future Past and Apocalypse are no less comic-book silly than Age of Ultron or Civil War. The MCU just had a more controlled hand on what characters were included which made them beloved by the audience (helped immensely by the solo films), while X-Men has always struggled with cameos of random comic characters but you forgot who was playing them.

^^ Wolverine varied between short as in Tom Cruise short and short as in Danny DeVito.

Edited by KJMackley on Nov 12th 2020 at 8:40:58 AM

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#122763: Nov 12th 2020 at 9:06:49 AM

WandaVision tunes into Disney+ on January 15, 2021!

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Nov 12th 2020 at 9:07:41 AM

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#122764: Nov 12th 2020 at 9:25:18 AM

Upon hearing that it's actually coming out: Hooray!

Upon realizing that it won't be by 2020: FUCK.

Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#122765: Nov 12th 2020 at 9:38:15 AM

I'll confess to being nettled that they waited until early-mid November to officially tell us it wasn't coming out this year. But still excited for the show.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#122766: Nov 12th 2020 at 9:40:41 AM

[up][up]

2020 is cursed. I'm glad it's avoiding this trash fire of a year.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Nov 12th 2020 at 11:13:22 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#122767: Nov 12th 2020 at 9:50:56 AM

I expected them to hold off on releasing it considering The Mandalorian is currently airing so they don’t need to compete.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Nov 12th 2020 at 9:51:22 AM

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#122768: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:27:17 AM

Anyone have any tv/movie recommendations to scratch that Marvel itch for the next two months?

I've already watched all of the tv shows (even that one shitstain of a show we don't talk about, and even the recently decanonized-by-both-the-showrunner-and-the-two-stars Helstrom). Maybe Legion? Haven't seen the third season yet...

Speaking of, does this thread consider the shows canon? I do, but arguments on the subject go nowhere, so I'm perfectly willing to just immediately concede.

Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#122769: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:32:33 AM

Prior to Marvel TV being absorbed by Feige/season six of Agents of SHIELD, I would've said "yeah the shows are canon", but now I'm more of the mindset that only Agent Carter is probably part of the main MCU timeline.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#122770: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:39:54 AM

I’ve long thought that only Agent Carter was canon. But since I’ve learned that Sousa appears in Agents of Shield, I think it should qualify as at least semi canonical.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#122771: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:40:38 AM

Maybe I should finally watch that classic X-Men cartoon.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#122772: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:48:06 AM

You could check out movies that have casts with a lot of MCU actors and/or a MCU-linked director.

For instance, most of the cast of Spotlight ended up in the MCU, Jon Favreau's Chef!, unsurprisingly has a lot of MCU actors, and Marshall, directed by Reginald Hudlin, starred Chadwick Boseman.

Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#122773: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:48:36 AM

[up][up][up]I see your point, but I think SHIELD's approach to the Snap is borderline irreconcilable by virtue of not even mentioning it (arguably through little to no fault of the show's own), and that overrides the presence of an Agent Carter character. If that's all it took, the show would have to be declared canonical by virtue of Fury and Sif's presence in season 1.

Edited by Khfan429 on Nov 12th 2020 at 11:49:17 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#122774: Nov 12th 2020 at 11:54:36 AM

I will point out that Agent Carter’s acknowledgement in Endgame likely came about because Joe Russo, McFeely, and Markus all worked on the show, while the other series have had separate creative teams from the MCU films so they’re less likely to be referenced later, if ever.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Nov 12th 2020 at 11:56:08 AM

Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#122775: Nov 12th 2020 at 12:00:32 PM

[up]Very true. I also think it's worth noting that Agent Carter is a fairly far-off prequel to most of the movies starring a character who was largely made popular by the movies (to a greater extent, I think it can be safely argued, than characters like Iron Man or Ant-Man or even the Guardians), so Feige and Marvel Studios are unlikely to even want to take another go at the character the same way they might want to with other characters who have gotten TV shows.


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