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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

AmazingSpiderHam Since: Sep, 2020
#121876: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:00:07 AM

The sad part is, he's still less alienating than Comics!Hank.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#121877: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:01:30 AM

Comic book Hank literally beats his wife

Thank God that did not appear in the film

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#121878: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:10:01 AM

It's more like he did that once and now nobody will ever let him forget he slapped his wife that one time.

The legend has returned.
C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#121879: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:27:11 AM

And then there was his Ultimate version...

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#121880: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:36:59 AM

We don’t need to talk about his ultimate version because it was bad and dumb

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#121881: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:49:45 AM

Ultimate!Hank is everything that was assumed of Comics!Hank and then some.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#121882: Oct 12th 2020 at 6:52:31 AM

The "funny" thing is that Comics!Hank hitting his wife has overshadowed the other thing he did in that same issue.

Namely, building a Killer Robot and unleashing it on the Avengers as part of a False Flag Operation where he'd "defeat" it and salvage his reputation. Hank hit Janet because she found out about this and tried to point out that this is kind of a fucking terrible plan.

...Y'know, it's not that surprising that Comics!Hank's brain patterns would create Ultron.

Maaaaybe Hope too, but not much and not all the time.

She resented Hank for most of her life since he more or less emotionally abandoned her after Janet vanished (since he was too caught up in his own guilt and obsession with bringing Janet back) and refused to let her use the suit which she interpreted as a rejection (since he was too afraid of losing Hope in the same way he lost Janet).

Edited by M84 on Oct 12th 2020 at 9:57:20 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
AmazingSpiderHam Since: Sep, 2020
#121883: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:32:56 AM

All in all Reed was probably more consistently abusive of his wife (especially psychologically) than Hank, but Comics!Hank is still a rather difficult person to deal with all the same, and even in the Silver Age he treated Jan with a grating amount of condescendence borderlining contempt. Granted, that early Jan was also... problematic in her own way.

Edited by AmazingSpiderHam on Oct 12th 2020 at 7:33:29 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#121884: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:35:54 AM

One thing Comics!Hank and MCU Hank have in common is that most people don't like them.

The big difference is that MCU Hank doesn't give a shit.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#121885: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:43:55 AM

I think that’s what’s so fascinating about the fall of Yellowjacket arc

You don’t tend to have old established relationships like that called out for being unhealthy

Reed and Sue just got slightly adjusted as time went on and had the worse parts brushed under a rug

Hank and Jan were secondary enough as characters you actually could call out the all take no give aspect and the messed up way they got married and have the characters divorce and eventually mutually agree that they had some good times but maybe they weren’t the best for each other

I can’t fathom that happening to any other relationship that went that far back. Reed and Sue will never break up. No way editorial let’s that slide. Spider Man and Mary Jane had to be broken up via devil and their relationship has always been way more healthy anyway. Scott and Jean always get broken up by death. I’d say etc but I can’t think of any more

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#121886: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:45:14 AM

The sad thing about Comics!Hank is that looking at all his problems he may be genuinely mentally ill but this being comics he never gets the support or help he needs.

And instead people constantly throw his mistakes back in his face like when Tony’s A.I. in Secret Empire had the gall to blame him hitting Janet as somehow responsible for every bad thing that happened to the Avengers.

Same Tony whose basically became a fascist dictator that one time.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 12th 2020 at 7:46:25 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#121887: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:45:55 AM

[up][up]There's Luke Cage and Jessica Jones. Okay, it's not nearly as old as the ones you listed, but it has been over...a decade? Fuck, I'm old.

There's also, um, Titania and Absorbing Man.

[up]And even though "Hank" was actually Ultron deluding himself into thinking he's Hank, he wasn't exactly wrong when he called out "Tony" for his hypocritical bullshit.

Edited by M84 on Oct 12th 2020 at 10:47:55 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#121888: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:47:05 AM

I think they’re newer relationships. Although both are still well on the way to being iconic anyway

Edit: oh you said that

Edited by Bocaj on Oct 12th 2020 at 10:47:29 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#121889: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:51:05 AM

It’s the weird double standards.

Hank constantly gets reprimanded for the one bad thing he did & the other actually bad thing he did never gets mentioned.

Meanwhile Tony & Carol can act like murderous fascist dipshits & remain relatively well-liked by the superhero community.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#121890: Oct 12th 2020 at 7:53:41 AM

Tony did spend a good amount of time being a recurring punching bag, but dunno about Carol. Exiling her from Earth for a while might have been a good idea or something.

Wake me up at your own risk.
C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#121891: Oct 12th 2020 at 8:00:00 AM

I missed the part of Reed being abusive with Sue in the 616 continuity. The worst I can remember was him neglecting her because he was busy proving Einstein wrong or preparing countermeasures for Doom's next attack or whatever, but they usually made up quite fast after that. Were there worse occurrences?

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
AmazingSpiderHam Since: Sep, 2020
#121892: Oct 12th 2020 at 8:03:03 AM

Oddly enough, Howard and Beverly might be the healthiest long term relationship in the MU, and considering how weird and unstable it has been, that is saying something. I also admit not being all that up to date on Howard so for all I know they broke up relatively recently or something like that.

Altris from the Vortex Since: Aug, 2019 Relationship Status: Not caught up in your love affair
#121893: Oct 12th 2020 at 8:24:40 AM

I guess Shipping Bed Death is in play a lot.

- - - -

Rewatching Thor and I'm reminded that it's surprisingly solid for what it is and how early it is in Phase One. I dunno, maybe it was early enough to avoid the Serial Escalation that would come later, but it's surprisingly small-scale - just New Mexico and Asgard, I believe.

If we're being honest, it just does a lot of things I like in superhero movies. It averts Conveniently Empty Buildings by having Thor and friends get people to safety before the Destroyer fight (take notes, Iron Man 2) instead of a badass declaration Thor proves himself worthy by sacrificing himself, and the scenes in the hospital and the SHIELD compound are a case of Reality Ensues, which is rare in its degree.

I never did have time to watch The Dark World before quarantine, should I do so now? Or should I skip straight to Ragnarok, which I already read a summary for to prep for Infinity War?

Edited by Altris on Oct 12th 2020 at 8:24:49 AM

So, let's hang an anchor from the sun... also my Tumblr
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#121894: Oct 12th 2020 at 8:52:29 AM

Eh, I say watch Dark World. The ending does set-up stuff in Ragnarok (even it quickly glosses over that set-up in the first ten minutes). Dark World isn't terrible, as there are some decent moments. It's just a pretty average film in the grand scheme of things.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#121895: Oct 12th 2020 at 12:47:15 PM

It's more boring than outright terrible, to a fault. The scenes about Loki or which feature him have some genuinely good character-building both of himself (which sadly goes nowhere if you've seen Endgame) plus the other characters he talks to.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#121896: Oct 12th 2020 at 1:21:23 PM

I wouldn't say any of the MCU films are so bad as to be unwatchable. The worst of the bunch tend to just be insipid or messy.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#121897: Oct 12th 2020 at 1:24:45 PM

The Dark World has good character stuff, and contrary to popular opinion I really like the way that one treated Earth. The final battle, with fantasy and super-science rallying together to save the day, was really cool.

The villain suuuuuuuucks, though. And they wasted Kurse, something that still stings, and a good indicator of their habit of wasting their secondary villains in those days.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 12th 2020 at 1:25:19 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#121898: Oct 12th 2020 at 1:26:15 PM

Dark world is an okay popcorn flik. Its not nearly as bad too be awful and their are some good moments with loki and thor reacting to each other but is otherwise forgetabble albeit with a really awful main villain....with odd motivations

[up]Like wtf is Malekith's deal. Hes apparenlty doing this for the good of his race but is really okay with throwing them away at the drop of a hat (which fits his comic version whose The Sociopath but not really what they were going for here). And he hates light....because ? He doesnt seem harmed by it from what we see so wtf.

Edited by miraculous on Oct 12th 2020 at 1:28:58 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#121899: Oct 12th 2020 at 1:30:47 PM

Dark World also had a really cool Action Prologue. Especially in the part where three Bor's warriors managed to defeat a Kurse.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Oct 12th 2020 at 1:31:14 AM

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#121900: Oct 12th 2020 at 1:31:22 PM

You could certainly do worse with 2013 blockbusters, that's for sure. At least TDW has Loki being cool and stuff and some neat shots and action bits.

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)

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