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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
Re: crime in New York. Something that should be noted is that supervillains actually outnumber superheroes. Your average superhero will have a rogues gallery of at least ten villains. This can be mitigated by the hero joining a team like the Avengers or Heroes for Hire but not every hero would do that. Add in other factors like how not every superhero lives in New York, how certain heroes' adventures will take them away from the city or even the planet itself and some villains not so easily convicted and you've got a New York still infested with crime.
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Funny thing about that, there's apparently a rumour going around (and I do stress rumour, so take it with a grain of salt), that the upcoming Hawkeye show will feature Madame Masque as a villain
. This notably would contrast with Agent Carter's portrayal of the character back in season two. So either a) Masque will not be Whitney Frost and will instead use her original name or b) Agent Carter is gonna be rendered non-canonical.
Or the rumours could be bunk. That's always a possibility.
Edited by chasemaddigan on Sep 28th 2020 at 1:00:14 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if Masque appeared in the Hawkeye show considering she was a big part of Fraction's run and Kate's solo series, but the Masque that appeared in Agent Carter had little in common with the comics version anyway, having completely different powers, backstory, and motive, so it shouldn't be hard to keep them separate.
As for why New York in specific, Marvel tends to operate on a premise that basically any highly urbanized place in the world has a high chance of being a complete fucking mess of supers duking out (particularly due mutanthood being a relatively common thing).
But more specifically Marvel has a recurring point that the Marvel universe only really turned full batshit "super" in WWII (Marvels and The Marvels Project being some of the works addressing that) and New York was at the forefront of that new age with its status as a battlefield for Allies and Axis with super-science amid New York and it being a prominent place for the likes of some of the first real "public" supers like Captain America, The Human Torch (the robotic one) and Namor. Basically WWII put New York as a fighting ground of WWII actors, and both sides developed a public super war that clashed in NY and that clash changed the city forever. Namor attacking New York (and the city being saved by a subsequent wave of a bunch of Supes converging in NY to stop him) tends to be also portrayed as a turning point for the city.
The MCU doesn't have such a fixed set of events, but Captain America (who retains his status as a predecessor to the "superhero age" in the MCU) is still portrayed as having his early years very much fixed in New York (and his first dramatic superhero moments in the streets of Brooklyn) so you could take a similar approach.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Talking about the Netflix shows and remembering how good Jon Bernthal was, you know what I would like to see? Disney tackling The Punisher in the same way people want them to tackle Deadpool, minus the fourth wall breaking. Have him dealing with a situation where inexplicably the universe bend in a way that he isn't able to kill anyone to a ridiculously degree, much to his chagrin. Tackle him in a comedy/dark humour angle.
Could be something like the Archie Meets the Punisher crossover.
Edited by eligram on Sep 29th 2020 at 9:37:39 AM
Now I'm picturing Tom Hardy's Venom trying to help Peter after Mysterio framed him, but he keeps trying to eat people and just makes Peter look even worse by associating with him.
Fair point. I mean even Peter has killed in Endgame (although I believe Word of God is that Thanos' creatures are non-sentient).
But at the same time, I can definitely imagine a scene where for instance Venom talks about biting the head off of someone, and Peter says nervously, "You mean you gave him a stern lecture, right?" And Venom says, "Yes. Obviously"
Have we seen any MCU character so far manifest a Thou Shalt Not Kill mentality? The closest I can think of was Doctor Strange, and he was rather lamenting that he had just taken a live. Spiderman seems to follow such a rule but never expresses it onscreen.
Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.Nope, there's no Thou Shalt Not Kill logic in superhero movies in general.
Shit, Superman straight up snapped a guy's neck.
Edited by M84 on Sep 30th 2020 at 9:27:50 PM
Disgusted, but not surprisedHeck, we've even got a trope pointing out the tendency of movie villains dying: Superhero Movie Villains Die
Disgusted, but not surprisedI think every hero in the MCU has killed at least once, whether they wanted to or not. I think some of the Netflix heroes have upholded their Thou Shalt Not Kill policy, but I don't know. I haven't watched much beyond the first season of Luke Cage (2016).
Honestly, I think heroes should go less for Thou Shalt Not Kill, and try and focus on Thou Shalt Not Murder instead.
Like, they don't actively attempt to kill any one, but they do what they have to do to defend themselves and others, cause as many have pointed out, it's unrealistic that many heroes don't kill people unintentionally with a lot of the stunts they pull.
To put this in an MCU context:
And lets not even get into the shit Batman does, or a certain flag bearer and his unyielding (against skulls) shield.
One Strip! One Strip!IIRC, didn't Batman kill a mook in Bv S? Like, when he was rescuing Superman's mom he threw a crate or something at the guy, and then there was a shot of the guy sliding back against a wall with his head bleeding.
So, let's hang an anchor from the sun... also my TumblrThats one of those things that just comes with the fantastical superhero world and why sometimes injecting a shocking dose of reality ensues can be really bad for the tone.
Forever liveblogging the AvengersThe only superhero in recent movies that I remember expressing an actual Thou Shall Not Kill code is Collossus in the Deadpool movies, and then it's just to make fun of him and the code.
It's kind of disheartening, in the wide picture.
Because showing mercy to unrepentant, super-powered villains always works out so well for the heroes and society at large, am I right?
If we lay all of Joker's victims together and postulate that Batman could have prevented their deaths with a simple pragmatic act, does Batman not share some responsibility?
There's a convention in comic books, at least of the Golden Age, to maintain the polite fiction that nobody is actually killed by any of the myriad disasters and crimes that the villains commit, but we're long past that.
Edited by Fighteer on Sep 30th 2020 at 12:54:06 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Yeah. That's the impression I've been getting as well.
Which is a damn shame, because most of those shows were pretty good.
I suspect Agents of Shield is in the same boat, considering the last two season basically ignored the Snap (due to a complete lack of coordination).
One Strip! One Strip!