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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#120351: Aug 24th 2020 at 3:00:12 PM

It's the same ship that failed to kill less than dozen Avengers standing around in a building completely undefended. The power of Plot Armor is immense. tongue

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#120352: Aug 24th 2020 at 3:23:08 PM

The wizards could've put up shields without having to worry about being attacked from the sides.

C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#120353: Aug 24th 2020 at 3:50:43 PM

That's like saying Thanos could have used the stones to annihilate every single Avenger in Infinity War instead of playing cheap tricks on them.

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#120354: Aug 24th 2020 at 3:58:09 PM

[up]But that wasn't his goal, he always intended to kill half the universe. He didn't even care about his own life afterwards, fulfilling his work was the only thing that mattered.

Whereas in Endgame, his 2014 self most definitely did want the Avengers and all their allies dead.

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Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#120355: Aug 24th 2020 at 4:05:29 PM

Perhaps he did not send the orbital strike out of fear the glove would be lost in the rubble.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#120356: Aug 24th 2020 at 4:21:49 PM

Personally I generally don't find the questions of "Why didn't X do Y and instantly win" all that interesting most of the time.

Usually the answer is some variation of "it wouldn't of actually made them instantly win".

In this particular case Thanos wouldn't of instantly won for the same reason he didn't instantly win when he ordered the bombardment in the actual movie, the Sorcerers were able to protect themselves and their allies with magical shields. In fact they would of likely been significantly better at it since they would be doing so as an organized block rather then in the chaos of battle.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#120357: Aug 24th 2020 at 5:30:43 PM

This isn't the Infinity War Thanos who's a cruel pragmatist. This is the past Thanos who was a notorious throne-sitter.

The legend has returned.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#120358: Aug 24th 2020 at 5:51:26 PM

I mean, the only reason he gave the order in the movie was because Wanda was kicking his ass that badly and he clearly got desperate.

[up] But, just like his 2018 self, once he got off that throne, he was a force to be reckoned with.

Never make Thanos do it himself. It hurts.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#120359: Aug 24th 2020 at 6:06:18 PM

There's the argument to be made that he was prioritizing punishing the Avengers for daring to stand up against him over victory at all costs in the earlier parts of the fight.

Hence why he personally beat the shit out of Iron Man, Thor, and Cap before bothering to summon his army to rub it in.

He does go right for the snap the first instance he can at the end but thats after the assembled heroes have proven to be quite capable and that two of them could body him.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#120360: Aug 24th 2020 at 8:03:04 PM

Took me a second to realize who you meant by "two", since you just stated he beat Thor. I knew you were talking about Carol, but Wanda was the second one, right?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#120361: Aug 24th 2020 at 8:05:41 PM

I think Wanda and Carol are the two strongest heroes in the MCU. Ego-powered Peter Quill might be comparable, but we don't have enough evidence to draw from there and he shouldn't be able to tap into that power ever again. Makes me wonder how strong Quicksilver could have gotten if he didn't die.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#120362: Aug 24th 2020 at 8:07:47 PM

[up][up] Yes

[up] DOFP Quicksilver level maybe

Edited by Bocaj on Aug 24th 2020 at 11:08:22 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#120363: Aug 24th 2020 at 8:40:27 PM

Honestly, with Quill unable to tap into his Ego born (HAH!) Celestial powers, Thor probably takes the place of third strongest person in the MCU....or fourth after Dr. Strange.

One Strip! One Strip!
MileRun Since: Jan, 2001
#120364: Aug 24th 2020 at 8:56:24 PM

I don't know about Dr. Strange's raw power output, but I'd say he's either the most- or second-most deadly hero in the MCU by virtue of the versatility of his spells. He just happened to job for the entirety of Infinity War.

At risk of stepping into a power level discusson, it's clear that Carol has the power advantage over Strange. Maaaaybe Wanda too, but it's hard to compare them directly since Strange lost to Thanos with four stones and Wanda overpowered Thanos without any stones.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#120365: Aug 24th 2020 at 9:09:14 PM

Yeah, I'd say the strongest heroes in the MCU right now are Carol, Wanda, Thor, and Strange.

But if you were to ask me who was the strongest character overall, I'd go with Dormammu. Yeah, weak to time loops, but he was a literal god who consumed countless worlds. He was only defeated because time was a foreign element in his dimension and Strange took advantage of that.

I think Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet probably stood a good chance against him, just by the nature of wielding the full power of the Time Stone.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#120366: Aug 24th 2020 at 9:10:22 PM

Its a funny type of jobbing because it also made him look a lot more powerful and competent than all of his previous showings.

Dr Strange made getting stomped look good.

[up] Three Earthlings and an Asgardian who lives on Earth now! EARTH MIGHTIEST PLANET! GET REKT HALA

Edited by Bocaj on Aug 24th 2020 at 12:11:37 PM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#120367: Aug 24th 2020 at 9:14:13 PM

Ego, Dormammu and Surtur are probably the only 3 villains in the MCU that are stronger than Thanos without the Stones.

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wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#120368: Aug 24th 2020 at 10:25:13 PM

Hilariously, Ebony Maw might actually be close behind to Thanos without the Stones in terms of combat capability, though behind Thanos in physical damage output and durability. And that's part of why Thanos respected him so much. They complement each other well. Hell, Thanos let the Maw single-handedly lead the attack on Gamora's planet.

Ebony Maw, without any Stones, straight up beat Doctor Strange, and simultaneously repelled Iron Man and Wong (himself one of the more powerful heroes, respect Wong). Thanos needed 4 stones just to tie with Strange. Thanos beat a full power Thor (either with Mjolnir or with Stormbreaker). The Maw effortlessly restrained an injured Thor. Hell, some of the stuff the Maw was doing, Thanos would later copy by using both the Power and Space Stones, and the telekinesis is very similar to some of the things Wanda does.

I stan a Maw.


On a related note, I'm annoyed about how people latch on to Tony's "go home Squidward" or "genius billionaire playboy philanthropist" lines. He's quippy, but the important part is actually the context of the scenes.

  • The Maw was rightly dismissive of Tony, since he was far stronger, and gave just as good an insult back. Even Strange had to agree with Maw's assessment of him as a "chattering animal".
  • Cap wasn't referring to Tony's line was "I've met guys with none of that worth ten of you." The point isn't what you do with your genius, your money, or your persona, or even your philanthropy of giving when you can afford it. Cap's point was it's what you give when it's most challenging, when there's nothing more most people can give, that counts.

There's this youtube comment that bugged me. Suggesting Cap should apologize to Stark because he has on his team Scott, a "Divorced, poor, delinquent, father."

I doubt that's how that interaction would go. I see it more as:

  • Scott: "Family man, working class, rebellious activist against the do-nothing super rich."
  • Steve: "I know guys with a lot more than you've had, who aren't even worth 1/10th of you. Welcome to the team."

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#120369: Aug 24th 2020 at 10:26:06 PM

Also, one of the most unsung heroes in the MCU: the Cloak of Levitation. I was so happy to see it got its own section on the Characters page for Doctor Strange.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Aug 24th 2020 at 12:27:15 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#120370: Aug 24th 2020 at 10:29:40 PM

I can't believe someone would say something mean about Scott, the best dad in Marvel and so nice a guy he even likes Hank Pym.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MileRun Since: Jan, 2001
#120371: Aug 24th 2020 at 10:32:20 PM

I think a case can be made for Hela being stronger than stoneless Thanos. She was a one-woman army against the Asgardians, and she didn't suffer any damage at all until she was up against Surtur. Thanos never felt that invincible in Endgame, or even during the Titan battle in IW.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#120372: Aug 24th 2020 at 10:33:49 PM

Thanos did wait until Odin and Hela were dead before popping in for a cup of Space Stone.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#120373: Aug 25th 2020 at 12:58:05 AM

Maybe Hela as well, yeah, though a battle between her and Maw certainly would be interesting.

What made Thanos so dangerous isn't just his extreme physical might after all, it's his intellect and ability to adapt as well, see how he dealt with Wanda and Carol, the only 2 beings to straight-up overpower him.

Edited by Forenperser on Aug 25th 2020 at 9:58:25 PM

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jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#120374: Aug 25th 2020 at 3:30:48 AM

And while Thanos has similar or maybe greater physical power than the Hulk he's ALSO a very competent fighter in terms of technical skill. His beatdown of Hulk in Infinity War was very economical in the way he targeted pressure points and so on.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#120375: Aug 25th 2020 at 3:48:17 AM

Thanos taking the Hulk to school will never not be a glorious moment.

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