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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

FGHIK Since: Aug, 2013
#118676: Jun 24th 2020 at 3:49:51 AM

RE: The Incredibles

I took it that the government stopped playing soft with supervillains after heroes were retired. So the villains had three choices, retire themselves, cut the dramatics and go low-profile, or get shot by a sniper during an evil speech. From what we see most of them have Awesome, but Impractical tech that could be defeated by the military, and they'd probably become easier to track down as tech continues advancing. So even if a few were able to match up, the government could simply find and attack them when they least expect it. Or if it's really bad bring a super out of retirement for a secret mission. Hell, maybe they had some superhumans working in secret the whole time.

Also may be that most villains were already captured by the time supers were retired and this universe doesn't suffer from Cardboard Prisons. Would explain why most of the villains we see at the time were so goofy and incompetent, they're just the last stragglers nobody bothered to capture yet.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#118677: Jun 24th 2020 at 5:23:00 AM

I like to assume the research from Vision’s speech was gathered from internet sources like this very one that insists everything is Tony’s fault

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#118678: Jun 24th 2020 at 5:56:13 AM

Apart from the Doylist explanation (which will become harder and harder to ignore as the MCU retcons the existence of more and more existing superheroes and supervillains), an explanation would be that giving the Avengers such coverage would have inspired people to try reproducing their tech and powers. In essence it would be the equivalent of launching a new fad.

It does not explain everything, but learning overnight that a guy has been able to build an insanely powerful armour and that a war hero thought dead and buried is back to throw cars at aliens thanks to some kind of serum would probably inspire a lot of sudden vocations in technology and biology. Also, since Reed Richards Is Useless seems to be partially averted in the MCU, it seems likely that a watered down version of Stark tech is available to the people who know where to look. And that does not even covers the salvaging of various tech that we saw in Homecoming.

Edited by C105 on Jun 24th 2020 at 2:56:23 PM

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#118679: Jun 24th 2020 at 7:17:33 AM

Huh a thought.

What exactly is the international fubar for the US with Killmonger being a rogue CIA agent trying to very publicly take over a sovereign nation through various acts of terrorism?

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 24th 2020 at 7:19:58 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#118680: Jun 24th 2020 at 7:47:05 AM

[up]

Well, he's technically also a Wakandan prince, and he legally won the throne. I'm guessing T'challa said lets just both keep our mouths shut.

Killmonger is as much a Wakandan deal as he is an american deal.

I like to assume the research from Vision’s speech was gathered from internet sources like this very one that insists everything is Tony’s fault

Those are perfectly viable sources Bocaj. We all know it to be true.

One Strip! One Strip!
ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#118681: Jun 24th 2020 at 8:11:00 AM

Pretty sure when Wakanda went public with their tech a certain Agent Ross calmly told his superiors where to shove it if they tried anything since one of their own agents went rogue tried to TAKE OVER THE COUNTRY.

T Challa knew Kilmonger was a Rogue Agent but it would not be in the US best interest if that ever became public.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118682: Jun 24th 2020 at 9:02:29 AM

This is a fair point.

To this point, I have to respond with this one. Even assuming Tony's press conference broke some masquerade (SHIELD's), there's no un-ringing that bell. It doesn't do much about supervillains, or decrease the number of super-fights, but just shifts who pays the insurance for super-fights. ...and as we find out later in Homecoming, Stark tended to profit, anyway.

Thank you for sharing this.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Jun 24th 2020 at 11:03:14 AM

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#118684: Jun 24th 2020 at 10:08:03 AM

There may be something to the idea that the only thing preventing potential supervillains from developing all these advanced weapons was that they didn't think this stuff was possible.

If you assume that, pre-Iron Man, the MCU Earth was largely indistinguishable from our own, then anyone proposing to invent shrinking technology or ultra-powerful battlesuits or a serum that turns people into living bombs? They'd likely be laughed off, their grandiose plans treated a symptom of reading too much sci-fi. But once Iron Man and the other Avengers start making the news? Suddenly, all that stuff seems a lot more plausible, and you've got scientists and investors looking to develop all the sci-fi gadgetry needed to make superheroes and supervillains.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#118685: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:13:14 AM

I assume that during this time, Hank's research wasn't exactly public either.

And of course, Shield was going out of their way to keep the stranger things under wraps, until Tony revealed himself on national television.

And to be fair, incidents started to pick up after that. The Hulk destroying a university and breaking Harlem, Thor throwing down with the Destroyer, and then it all culminated in the chitauri invasion.

Hell, for all Tony's talk about privatizing World Peace in Iron Man 2, it's also shown that others quickly jumped to try and copy what he'd done, as they are wont to do when new technology appears.

Tablets appeared after iPads. Playstation Move became a thing after the Wii showed up. Etc, etc.

Tony had the advantage that it was the Arc Reactor tech that made his armour possible (and since Vanko had too much tunnel vision to sell his knowledge, that hasn't changed), but still.

And then there's Wakanda, but even they noted the rest of the world was slowly catching up to them, probably due to guys like Bruce, Tony, and Hank. God help them where Reed Richards finally joins the party

....So yeah, Tony Stark is to blame for everything....but he also isn't, because I'm mostly just joking.

One Strip! One Strip!
FGHIK Since: Aug, 2013
#118686: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:37:12 AM

Captain America, who knows how many generations of Black Panther, Captain Marvel, and Hank Pym Ant-Man were already around before Iron Man. Though they were all kept relatively secret. Also the Asgardians, but they had long ago fallen into myth.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118687: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:42:44 AM

Hell, the Hulk, too. Banner had already had his experiment, ran away, and started or considered his new life in Brazil (which likely wasn't his first new life) before Tony's announcement.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#118688: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:47:32 AM

While Doctor Strange was still an actual doctor, the Ancient One and her folks were still kicking around too.

The legend has returned.
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118689: Jun 24th 2020 at 1:49:04 PM

Tony Stark's declaration really did set the "TV anchor in Cairo, the Undersecretary of Defense, [and the] high school valedictorian in Iowa City" on the path towards super-science, though. That's all his fault.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#118690: Jun 24th 2020 at 7:16:44 PM

Rewatching Ragnarok. Man, the parts that are good are good. And the parts that are not... drag the whole thing down.

Odin's death scene + Hela's return follow a really wonderful series of scenes, but the whole thing is just one big infodump and awkward character removal, and it sets the stage for everything Asgard related in this movie being... kinda bland and lacking in substance.

It really comes off like them wanting to make a Planet Hulk movie first and foremost and kind of tacking everything else on to justify it.

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#118691: Jun 24th 2020 at 7:41:16 PM

Hulu is set to talk about Helstrom for Comic Con @ Home!

You'll notice that Helstrom doesn't have even a basic Marvel logo. I guess it means that Feige really really REALLY doesn't want people thinking it's in the MCU.

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#118692: Jun 24th 2020 at 8:07:28 PM

Visually at least Asgard has plenty more effort put into it in the first two Thors, whereas here the visual effort went with the storytelling effort to Sakaar.

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#118693: Jun 24th 2020 at 8:31:49 PM

It makes sense that Asgard didn't have much time dedicated to it in Ragnarok. It already had two movies to get used to it, and it was completely wrecked by everything.

The legend has returned.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#118694: Jun 24th 2020 at 8:51:09 PM

If they wanted a movie set somewhere else, they should've just made a movie set somewhere else. Asgard only getting a half-assed treatment isn't a problem just for the sake of having more Asgard, it's a problem because the parts we do get from Asgard are a drag to sit through and make the movie weaker. Had this movie just been about Thor facing the Collector's tyranny, it would've been a lot better overall.

You can tell Taika wanted to make a fun Thor movie with new characters and a brand new setting, but had to deal with all the high fantasy themes and character expected from the series thus far, and put most of his effort on the former and kind of a token effort into the latter.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jun 24th 2020 at 8:53:51 AM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118695: Jun 24th 2020 at 9:32:33 PM

And by the time they were done, Idris Elba was done. Damn shame, too. Heimdall was great.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#118696: Jun 24th 2020 at 10:57:29 PM

I wish Heimdall had survived long enough to meet the Avengers. I get the feeling he would have liked them.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#118697: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:01:40 PM

I'm sure he admired them from afar, following along with their little stories and all.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#118698: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:17:33 PM

Picturing Heimdall with a bowl of popcorn, chuckling to himself as he watches Peter Parker about to meet Liz's dad before prom.

FGHIK Since: Aug, 2013
#118699: Jun 25th 2020 at 3:02:17 AM

I'm sure he had an eye on events involving Thor, Loki, or other Asgardians at least.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118700: Jun 25th 2020 at 6:34:50 AM

Considering he and Odin sent Thor back to Earth for the first Avengers film, I'd like to believe he was watching for the duration, and got a kick out of Hulk giving Loki the Metronomic Man Mashing.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Jun 25th 2020 at 8:36:01 AM


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