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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#118451: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:22:49 PM

Ironically it would also make not only Wanda but Carol mutants

There was apparently an old issue where Colossus did say Carol was a mutant actually. This was just after she'd become Binary I think, so it was during the time she was hanging out with them.

One Strip! One Strip!
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#118452: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:23:19 PM

I thought that was what you meant with "It'd avoid the "why do mutants get treated so differently from other superpowered folk?" conundrum".

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#118453: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:23:24 PM

[up]If you really want to go all in on the social commentary, make a lot of the minority mutants front and center, hell, make Ms. Marvel a mutant. See how the public reacts from the premiere super team being a group of white men and women to this increase in minorities. I expect a lot of double standards, and that works for any potential mutant script.

MileRun Since: Jan, 2001
#118454: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:30:18 PM

This is kind of why I'm of the opinion that the X-Men work best in their own, separate cinematic universe, divorced from the other heroes. You don't have to worry about questions like, "Why is the world chill with Vision but not Cyclops?" The X-Men universe as a standalone was able to tackle mutant prejudice plots without distractions. That said, I understand that people love the X-Men and want to see mutants share the screen with Avengers and Guardians and other nonaffiliated heroes, so I just hope they handle the introduction well.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#118455: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:33:17 PM

What I was thinking of is that all superpowered people are viewed with prejudice. You wouldn't have to deal with it as much with the non-X-Men heroes because, being world renowned celebrities, they get treated a lot differently from that guy down the street with fins growing out of his head.

Plus, even under that broader definition of mutant, most MCU heroes still wouldn't qualify, their abilities coming from advanced technology, knowledge of magic, being an alien, or just a Badass Normal. And for some of the ones that definition does apply to, they spend so much of their time on other planets or fictional ultra-isolationist kingdoms, it wouldn't really affect them, either. In fact, of currently active MCU heroes, Wanda and Spider-Man might be the only ones you'd expect to be seriously burdened by anti-mutant prejudice ... and that'd fit into their stories pretty well.

Edited by RavenWilder on Jun 18th 2020 at 12:35:41 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#118456: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:45:59 PM

Fun fact: people aren’t always cool with Vision!

In the comics someone suicide bombed him because they were worried about robots taking all the meat women

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#118457: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:46:52 PM

What I was thinking of is that all superpowered people are viewed with prejudice. You wouldn't have to deal with it as much with the non-X-Men heroes because, being world renowned celebrities, they get treated a lot differently from that guy down the street with fins growing out of his head.

There's already shades of that in the MCU.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#118458: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:51:10 PM

You fall in love with a meat woman one time! One god damned time!

Also, why suicide bomb someone who has two ways to avoid being harmed? This guy did not think through his cunning plan.

Though to be fair, it may have been due to lack of information.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#118459: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:53:00 PM

I mean it worked so who is the fool? The fool who blew himself up or the fool who didn’t think to intangible?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#118460: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:53:38 PM

....

God dammit Vision.

One Strip! One Strip!
BOOXMOWO Since: Mar, 2013
#118461: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:55:45 PM

Anti-Mutant prejudice is illogical in a different way from real life prejudice. Real bigots tend to lump barely or not at all related groups together an their perceptions because they're all "different from me" in similar ways. Not that a real life bigot admits that "different from me" is what they have a problem with, they'll invent some excuse to claim their prejudices are justified and then apply that excuse broadly and illogically.

Meanwhile Anti-Mutant bigots seem to take the stance of "I hate Mutants but if your different from me in a functionally similar way but for different reasons then we're cool" and then they're internally consistent about that.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#118462: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:57:11 PM

Regarding Sorcerors, they're not omniscient, so there's only so many conflicts they can help with, and the biggest question is where were they when Bor and the Frost Giants were fighting over the Tessseract. Maybe the NYC sanctum could've done more during the Battle of New York. As for real world conflicts, they aren't magical or even alien in nature, and are more abut human determinism.

Basically, unless it's a threat to reality, or aliens, they probably don't have reason to get involved.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#118463: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:58:42 PM

also,Sorcerors are squishy and going into a war zone means some of them might not come back

Hey is that an idea for TV show I hear..

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#118464: Jun 18th 2020 at 12:59:41 PM

Perhaps the prejudice works the same as in the Star vs The Forces of evil series.

Humans hate "monsters", but not other types of magical creatures that could also be considered monsters, in all but name.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#118465: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:01:57 PM

The difference is that magic users are rare and less dangerous,mutants could come from anywhere and they often can't control their powers making them a threat to innocent people.

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#118466: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:06:02 PM

If they do bring in the mutants and the mutant metaphor I pray to god they try for some fucking nuance and don’t go right to “the government keeps building murder robots to murder us”

Maybe even get some Xstatix influence where people go “I’m not prejudiced against mutants, I love mutantcore music”

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#118467: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:08:23 PM

I would not worry much about the sentinels, if they are the same as in the animated series, they will not be a real threat.

Sentinels are generally only dangerous if they are in a Bad Future.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Jun 18th 2020 at 1:11:07 AM

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#118468: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:13:15 PM

I still want the hilarity of the MCU debating why giant killbots are a good idea.

“The only way to keep your neighborhood safe...is with giant robots designed to hunt down ‘those people’, right Senator Kelly?”

“When you say it like that it sounds really dumb and racist.”

Edited by Beatman1 on Jun 18th 2020 at 4:14:32 AM

Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#118469: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:14:57 PM

Wait for them to ignore the one who'll go "Cough... Sokovia Cough"

Edited by Blueace on Jun 18th 2020 at 4:16:40 AM

Wake me up at your own risk.
MileRun Since: Jan, 2001
#118470: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:16:59 PM

"I don't agree with Ultron's actions, but you have to admit he had some valid points about how murderbots are the way of the future." - A senator, probably

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#118471: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:17:28 PM

[up]I can already see the test of a Sentinel being a full on homage to the ED-209 scene from Robocop, but with a lot less blood squibs.

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#118472: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:18:44 PM

Magneto: Humans hate us and want to destroy us.

Xavier: You exaggerate, if we take a peaceful route, there will be peace and love.

Magneto: Are you serious? They literally create homicidal robots to kill us.


[up]*5, When you mentioned Sokovia, I remember that the government gave a position of power to the jerk who started a battle inside a university.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Jun 18th 2020 at 1:20:57 AM

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#118474: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:19:34 PM

They could tie Magneto to the Red Skull, who is still alive and free to his own machinations in the main timeline, as per Word of God.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
BOOXMOWO Since: Mar, 2013
#118475: Jun 18th 2020 at 1:24:24 PM

I think the MCU populace has a general weariness of superheroes that could get ugly when Mutants come out of the woodwork. Saying the general public should in some way be protected from enhanced individuals sounds reasonable when "enhanced individuals" translates to "The Avengers plus a tiny handful of survivors of weird scientific accidents", but when there turns out to be a visible percentage of the world's populations who are born enhanced and often just want to live their lives, then saying that people need to be protected from them gets unreasonable. And you know what maybe in a few movies they work through that and make steps towards progress but there's still prejudice in subtler ways.


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