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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
I assume that Asgard had some presence on Midgard *Earth for a bit before losing interest.
Because of the myths and because of the hidden super weapon
Forever liveblogging the AvengersFascism is not A Lighter Shade of Black than nazism. They are all vile blights on our world.
Edited by Eriorguez on Jun 1st 2020 at 8:30:45 PM
Nazism is the very worst form of fascism.
If you compare Franco and Hitler, Hitler is definitely the worse one.
Doesn't make Franco a good man, but it's just a fact.
Edited by Forenperser on Jun 1st 2020 at 8:34:07 PM
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianA Nazi by Any Other Name and all that jazz.
Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)Coulda sworn Nazis are against pretty much anyone aside from themselves and those who are complicit with their methods and ideaology. Which is well beyond just racism.
Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Jun 1st 2020 at 11:51:22 AM
Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)Yes and anybody who is not "themselves" are people who aren't "Aryan". They wanted to basically wipe out everybody else.
HYDRA is bent on world domination and subjugation, which you can call horrible and fascist, but they lack the racial supremacy aspect of the Nazis, seeing how their high-ranking members include people of all nationalities.
This is not me defending HYDRA, this is just me objecting to unfitting comparisons, which in my eyes underplay the very real evils of the Nazis.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianNazis were race-heavy fascists, but that's merely their take on the usual tribal component of fascism: "we are an ancient proud race that has been denied of their glory by dirty outsiders".
Italian fascists deemed themselves the heirs of Rome (nevermind the fact that the Byzantine empire outlasted Rome by a millenium), Spanish fascists had a massive Catholic backing and reveled on the Reconquista (so they had visigoths as glorious leaders, and the Cordoba Caliphate as an invader, despite, well, being something any sane person would be proud of)...
They always think of themselves as better. That's fascism. And, the less people are, the more exclusive their "us" becomes. Supporters become disposable pawns.
Except it's not like HYDRA is similar to Nazis, it's that HYDRA is literally Nazis. People aren't saying the HYDRA are Nazis just because they're a group of fascist assholes bent on world domination, people are saying they're Nazis because they're literally a spin-off group from the original German Third Reich.
They're not metaphorically Nazis, they're literally Nazis. Just because their ideology as an organization has changed somewhat since the time of World War 2 doesn't change the fact that they're literally Nazis.
Which is false, because again, HYDRA was started centuries before WW 2 and the Nazi faction was basically the rogue faction part of an Enemy Civil War with the original faction.
(Plus, in the MCU Red Skull also never focused on racial aspects).
If it would be about comics HYDRA, I'd agree with you in a heartbeat, but MCU Hydra has no racial elements.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianAgents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has characters refer to HYDRA as Nazis several times throughout the series, so it's not entirely baseless.
They also have several heroic characters display Fantastic Racism numerous times throughout the series.
The characters have their opinions and views, but they are not the gospel of truth, at least that's how I see it.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianAnd this is where we get into the weird area of what the characters are trying to say and what the writers are trying to say.
Edit: Were those instances of "Fantastic Racism" ever recanted or apologized for? Because that might be the difference between what's supposed to be a character flaw, isolated entirely to that character as far as analysis of the narrative goes, and what's supposed to be put forth, unintentional or otherwise, by the writer.
Edited by fredhot16 on Jun 1st 2020 at 12:28:11 PM
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.Ao S Hydra are unambiguously nazis while the movies depict them as just another evil organization that wants to take over the world like COBRA from G.I. Joe.
I think we should just agree to disagree and settle on them being evil (and overused).
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Mack to this day absolutely hates any kind of mechanical lifeforms and refuses to consider them as such, on top of my head.
Edited by Forenperser on Jun 1st 2020 at 9:27:11 PM
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianI think Hydra can be more accurately classified as Nazi-collaborators.
Hydra doesn't share the Nazis' ideology because Hydra doesn't really have an ideology beyond world domination and authoritarianism for its own sake. Them fighting for Nazi Germany during World War II was opportunism on their part, hitching their wagon to the Nazis' star.
Edited by RavenWilder on Jun 1st 2020 at 12:30:58 PM
Franco's contribution to cinema kinda points towards racism.
Franco also had executed the cousin he grew up with
, and couldn't care less about his republican brother
, disregarding his niece and sister-in-law after said brother was shot down. And, that's how people who grew up with him were treated, apparently some of his approaches were too much for Hitler. Because the guy utterly depised people who weren't reactionary Catholics.
Fascism is built on hatred of the different. If you think genociding people due to their ethnicity is better or worse than genociding people due to their ideals, you should rethink that.
I can't remember right now: have we seen a lot of non-white Hydra characters onscreen? Right now the only one I can think of who looked a bit less caucasian than the others was Sitwell.
Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.Several, even in high-ranking positions
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Sheikh
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Sunil_Bakshi
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Raina
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Giyera
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Kebo
https://marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com/wiki/Toshiro_Mori
Edited by Forenperser on Jun 1st 2020 at 9:41:14 PM
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianApologies for being a bit off-topic, but I've been thinking about this for a while. Whenever Tony is injured (for example, getting hit by the cars in Civil War), his snarking about it kind of kills the moment for me. Whenever I see that, I think "he can focus on being sardonic, therefore he's not distracted by a serious injury, therefore he's fine", and it really gets rid of the tension. I dunno if this is just a me thing, but it really makes me care less about the supposed danger of whatever fight he's involved in.
So, let's hang an anchor from the sun... also my Tumblr

Nidavillir expected Asgardian protection. So at least that much in that specific place.
Forever liveblogging the Avengers