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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#113901: Dec 23rd 2019 at 8:26:03 AM

Based on the way he phrased it, it sounded like his complaints were more along the lines of "it's a fake country with fake art and fantasy elements that do not represent Africa, they probably didn't even go there for research and just googled 'African texture patterns', and went from there".

Which is, of course, a criticism born of ignorance and stupidity, because the makers of Black Panther DID go to Africa for research and they DID study actual African cultures to represent in the film. The one who didn't do proper research is him.

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#113902: Dec 23rd 2019 at 8:40:42 AM

I'm not inclined to think Gillem knows much about Africa himself, yeah. But he's always been an asshole so I'm not really surprised.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#113903: Dec 23rd 2019 at 8:40:59 AM

Well, as said before, this is why we have to separate the art from the artist.

Cause Terry Gilliam is a dumbass.

If he were smart, he'd own that, but he'll probably make up excuses to save face.

One Strip! One Strip!
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#113904: Dec 23rd 2019 at 9:10:18 AM

[up][up][up]This. From the Oscar winning score and costuming, to the geography, to the setting, to the several characters in the film who either are African, or based their portrayals on actual African cultures, as well.
Representation isn't just for white Westerners.


Regarding the Peter Jackson example mentioned on the last page, the LOTR trilogy is was filmed in New Zealand, home of the Maori people. So imagine how disappointing this could be:

At least later seasons of Power Rangers that were filmed in New Zealand actually used Maori actors for several of the major roles, and even ensured people could keep their standard accents.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Dec 23rd 2019 at 11:15:50 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#113905: Dec 23rd 2019 at 9:13:59 AM

Based on the way he phrased it, it sounded like his complaints were more along the lines of "it's a fake country with fake art and fantasy elements that do not represent Africa, they probably didn't even go there for research and just googled 'African texture patterns', and went from there".

This, at least, I can get in part (it's the same criticism Aaron McGruder once had about Kwanzaa), but not so much in the case of movie Wakanda - he's basically accusing Wakanda of being The Theme Park Version of Africa, which is true. The fact that Wakanda mashes together things from all over Africa (and beyond, at times) as one blanket culture is something I've seen offend people in the past.

But while movie Wakanda does do this, it's a lot tighter and more concise about it than comic Wakanda, and manages to keep a much stronger hold on the cultural identity its trying to establish than other things that do this, so I gave it a pass.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#113906: Dec 23rd 2019 at 11:35:28 AM

I can see what he means in the cynical sense: it's basically False Hope: The Movie.

But that's how pretty much all fantasy stories are (which is why they're called fantasy). It's hypocritical, nonsensical, and probably insincere to single out Black Panther over any other movie that contains an optimistic ending, not-entirely-terrible people, and some sort of validation of the notion of justice.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#113907: Dec 23rd 2019 at 11:39:26 AM

If you don't mind me asking, and I hope they don't get the mods on it, why are you discussing a racist douche that's trying to sound smart?

Wake me up at your own risk.
Bec66 Since: Dec, 2016
#113908: Dec 23rd 2019 at 1:14:15 PM

Did you read the actual interview? Based on what he said it really doesn’t seem like he’s being racist. Dickish perhaps, ignorant of the fact that they did indeed go to Africa (As if he cares), and really annoyed at the possibility that Black Panther got attention for “being PC” wich is also bull. Plus people take him seriously because he’s a director who’s made some critical darlings.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113909: Dec 23rd 2019 at 1:18:51 PM

Nah, definitely racist. No surprise coming from him. Calling #MeToo "mob rule", complaining about inclusion, saying he'll call himself a "black lesbian", etc.

Bec66 Since: Dec, 2016
#113910: Dec 23rd 2019 at 1:24:39 PM

Okay I take back the not racist part but the rest of my opinion still stands, which is that he’s a dick who made some famous movies. Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s just doing this crap so more people will look at his new movie.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#113911: Dec 23rd 2019 at 1:33:26 PM

Yeah, he's just not worth the thought, and we can talk about other stuff if there's something to talk about, without it being in the realm of ignoring problems.

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#113912: Dec 25th 2019 at 8:48:52 PM

A Redditor's attempt at describing what exactly each Infinity Stone does. Something something the Soul Stone sucks in the MCU (which I do think it does).

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#113913: Dec 25th 2019 at 8:58:22 PM

Yeah, we didn't see the Soul Stone actually do anything. Sure, as part of the Snap it identified all creatures with souls in the universe, but on its own it didn't do anything but demand sacrifices.

The Soul Stone needed to be introduced before Infinity War, and I think the best place would have been Ragnarok. Have Hela come out of her prison with the Soul Stone, explaining why no one could find it. Could also explain her power connection to Asgard, and she could definitely use it to raise her undead army.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113914: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:03:32 PM

There's literally one time the Soul Stone is ever used on its own, when Thanos uses it to identify the real Doctor Strange among all his duplicates, but it flashes by so fast that most viewers don't see it unless they're looking for it.

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#113915: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:07:20 PM

I do like the blue stone's ability to kidnap evil people.

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#113916: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:08:08 PM

Sure, as part of the Snap it identified all creatures with souls in the universe, but on its own it didn't do anything but demand sacrifices.
Since we know it also killed half of all animal and plant life, does this mean that animals and plants have souls?

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#113917: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:10:46 PM

ANIMISM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#113918: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:23:02 PM

Maybe it defines "souls" as "life force."

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#113919: Dec 25th 2019 at 9:57:54 PM

I think the soul stone just likes being a dick.

I'm sure it laughed it's ass off at Thanos being both human enough to have someone he loved and evil enough to be willing to sacrifice them anyway, because it still gets to see someone suffer.

Especially since I bet it knew what Thanos would do.

Of course it's more logical to assume that soul for a soul clause was to prevent someone like Thanos from getting their hands on the stone, on the idea that no one who would be willing to do that would have someone they loved enough to sacrifice them.

Live and Learn huh?

....why do I feel like a green assassin and a russian spy are now glaring at me?

One Strip! One Strip!
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#113920: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:11:17 PM

Since we know it also killed half of all animal and plant life, does this mean that animals and plants have souls?

It didn't. Maybe it killed animals, but the Snap didn't kill half of all plants. The Snap took place in a forest, and we didn't see half the trees turn to dust.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#113921: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:15:42 PM

Kevin Feige confirmed that it killed half of all life, meaning the plants and animals, too. Or else plants aren't really alive.

Edited by alliterator on Dec 25th 2019 at 10:17:49 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113922: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:36:51 PM

Doctor Strange: Uhhh not killing any of the plants around Wakanda and the Avengers HQ was also part of the 16 million chance plan.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#113923: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:39:08 PM

I feel that this is a case where the evidence disregards the plants thing but does support the animals thing, since more birds was Scott's sign that the unSnop had worked.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#113924: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:41:10 PM

Do we know when in the year Infinity War and Endgame took place? I'm sure most of the animals brought back in the Blip didn't even notice the 5 year difference, but if they came back during a different season, that would throw off a ton of animal's internal clocks.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#113925: Dec 25th 2019 at 10:52:39 PM

According to the MCU wiki, the Snap happened sometime in late May while the Blip occurred in mid-October.

So yeah, that would confuse the heck out of some animals.


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